Is my Bergara Bergarbage?

[jdyoung]

What do you mean usually makes a good barrel. It's the most popular barrel in PRS right now. Those guys demand a consistent barrel. Pretty much today if you stick with the big names you will get a good barrel 99.97 percent of the time. I made that number up but you get the point. They can't afford to make a bad barrel. This thread is proof why. Anytime someone gets something bad it goes to the public to hear. Then the company has a chance to make it right. Then we the public find out how that went. If that goes bad then they are stabbing their self in the foot. On one thread a guy sent his Savage back 3 times and it's still not right. If I was in charge of Savage some people would be looking for new jobs right now. I own 2 businesses and if a customer gets a bad product I bend over backwards to make it right. I don't care if it cost me double the product they bought. If it stops bad press and creates good press it's worth it to me to do so. So many big corporate manufacturers don't seem to care. The penny pinching accounts are costing these companies more than they save and just can't see it. If bergara was to see this thread they should hand select the most accurate replacement they can find and throw in some swag. With the internet and forums like this they can't afford not too. Same with barrel companies. Bullet companies. Powder companies. Every company.
Shep

Did you read #143 in this thread by Nate T. he is an executive for Bergara , Lawrenceville, Georgia.

 

[338 dude]

Did you read #143 in this thread by Nate T. he is an executive for Bergara , Lawrenceville, Georgia.

Very nice gentleman everything sounds good about him taking care of it but really they shouldn't have to and I'm just not buying that a little paint on the pillar would affect it that much

 

[25WSM]

I don't see where he said he is an executive. He said he works for them. Hopefully he has brought this thread to the attention of management. I don't know who he is. Maybe he's half owner or a service rep but it's nice he made an account and came on here to help. That shows initiative and a wanting to make it right. And I feel this will be made right. Are you watching this Savage. No they probably still don't care.
Shep

 

[jdyoung]

I don't see where he said he is an executive. He said he works for them. Hopefully he has brought this thread to the attention of management. I don't know who he is. Maybe he's half owner or a service rep but it's nice he made an account and came on here to help. That shows initiative and a wanting to make it right. And I feel this will be made right. Are you watching this Savage. No they probably still don't care.
Shep

#147 by Tex_Hunter wrote…(For anyone not paying attention here... Nate Treadaway doesn't just "work at Bergara" he's the CEO of BPI.)

also, I can believe that of Savage.

 

[25WSM]

That's the kind of stuff that makes companies great. When the top brass care and come to the rescue it shows you how they feel about their customers. My hats off to Nate for coming here to help take care of this. I'm sure the op will be well taken care of. Nate send him some swag. We're all gonna hear about it.
Shep

 

[rld346]

Guess I'll be watching this thread. Just got the same rifle in yesterday, Bergara B14 HMR Wilderness 300 WM. I plan on going to the range next and burn up some old factory ammo to check it out before reloading. I have new Norma brass, H1000, and Berger 215's to start my handloads on. Hopefully it goes better than the OP, 101stCurrahee.

Not trying to hijack the thread, but as I commented in post #16, I just bought almost the same rifle and was going to the range this week to start breaking it in. I used a variety of factory ammo I had on hand, from 150gr to 200gr. Best group was with Nosler Custom Ammo 200gr AB, 3 shot group .63". Next was with Hornady Custom-Lite Recoil 150gr, 7 shot group, with a flyer (which was probably me), at 1.34, minus the flyer it would be a .98 6 shot group, all touching. So, this Bergara is fine, no problems at all. Now, with 30 rounds down the tube I'll mount my suppressor and Magneto starting working on some handloads.

 

[smokey3]

Take it to a gun smi`t, if there is something wrong in the chamber they should be able to tell. It will give you more ammo to get Berger's to fix it. I have seen poor chambering jobs in factory guns that were easy fixed by a good smith.

It is not Berger's problem, he is just using their bullets. Maybe you meant Bergara?

 

[smokey3]

Although there is conflicting posts regarding this rifle from the OP, this isn't a reason to disparage the OP or for the OP to get super defensive about being called out on it. The knowledge base here is truly fantastic but only as useful as the info provided. Since the adage regarding computers applies to group discussions too, as the saying goes...Garbage in, Garbage out.

It is simply impossible to find a solution to such a complex problem with so many variables without enough reliable data.

1) Assuming a large ES from an optical chronograph from a brand new reloader as accurate is a giant assumption. OP has not answered the numerous posts about lighting or distance greater than 30' so we as a group have no idea if he is even using the chrono correctly. "Tested with a 9mm" is not reliable data. A 9mm powder charge will not send unburnt powder as far as a 300wm will so a 9mm will not show errors at the same distance a 300wm will either.

2) Problems with scope/mounting will certainly cause giant groups. Loose reticle, over extended turret, loose rail, lose screws, rings mounted too close to turret pinching erector. Goofy assumptions on what is needed for 1mile shots such as excessive rail angles, shims, coke cans, hot glue have all been seen (not necessarily in this particular situation). Relying or even paying a store employee to mount a scope is an obnoxious waste of money that shows the confidence level of OP with mechanical things as well as a lack of knowledge.A stranger cannot mount a scope properly without the shouters body present to position it properly for eye relief and comfortable shooting positi

3) Load development can be a a giant contributor. In previous posts in other threads, the OP stated he measured BTO in this rifle/load and set back from there. However, I have yet to see if the OP did more than assume brass length in a book was to his rifles chamber specs. It is imperative to check brass (no bullet needed) fits the chamber. If it is the slightest bit too long and the OP doesn't catch the slightmy harder bolt close with empty brass then he can be crimping the neck on the bullet causing high pressure and erratic velocity. The OP should most definitely check this when he restarts load development on any future rifles. Assumptions do not make for reliable reloading. Also using a beam scale is not a foolproof method if attention to detail of knowledge of scales is not involved.

3) Pressure signs. The OP hasn't provided pictures of brass to show blackened necks orflattened primers or other tell tale signs that will be very helpful in diagnosing the issue.

4) H1000 is extremely temp stable so time in chamber is clearly not the issue causing 200fps spread. However, the 200fps shouldn't be discounted in load development nor should the rifle be blamed for this with out proper info regardi g the use and setup of the chrono. Clearly a Magnetspeed or Lab Radar are better options and would eliminate this poor info is the OP has access to someone who has one and knows how to use it as errors in those systems also occur when not used properly.

5) Addition of muzzle break. Was this with factory threaded muzzle, gunsmith threaded with die or gunsmith threaded with a lathe without removing the barrel? We have no idea if the rifle was worked on by a Gunsmith or by a person at a gunstore who simply operates in that role. Clearly "gunsmithing" service like mounting a scope do not justify the title.

6) Parallax. As the OP is new to the technical side of reloading and unfamiliar with other common techniques such as bedding, improper parallax is not out of the question. As the OP is clearly a green shooter than many here, he may not be aware that If the scope is randomly mounted and the eye relief is not correct, we will reset his eye into the scope after each shot effectively aiming at a different spot on the target every time. Since there is so little information regarding the possible causes of the supposed 200fps spread shown by a possibly maybe accurate chronograph, it cannot be definitively ruled in as the cause if the large groups at this point.


Hopefully, the OP continues to use this rifle situation as a learning experience when he receives the rifle back from Bergara. Most of these questions and details will still need to be addressed regardless of what rifle the OP chooses to setup and reload for in the future. Good luck on your learning adventure.

Very good analyzation of current subject and information provided. It is highly unlikely but not impossible to have a bad scope and/or chronograph giving false readings. I have one of these chronos and a magneto speed, I think the magneto speed is the more accurate of the two IMO.

 

[smokey3]

A gun smith buddy of mine & competition bench rest loader/shooter said to tell you to just try another bullet. He says step one in load development should be to find a load in loading manual selecting a powder that is about the fastest velocity you can get using a ~92% loading density in the bullet weight you want to shoot. Then try several bullets with that same powder, primer, brass and seating depth. He said you will be amazed out how some bullet groups you can cover with a dime and some groups look like watering can. I use this technique myself now and it has saved countless work up hours and man...those rifles can really be picky about the bullet they like. Then I do the ladder test to find the nodes and tweak seating depth etc. Just for grins, try 68 grs I-4350 and 180 gr Barnes TTSX or Nolser AB. Max is 70 grs in Nosler book. My son has a Rem 700 Sendero SS heavy barrel with jewel trigger and it shoots a ragged hole with that combo.

I have a custom 700 Rem. with a 26 Krieger barrel, HS stock, and Jewel trigger that shoots .4" groups with the 180 AB and 70 grs of IMR 4350 at about 3009 fps average. No pressure signs. My gun was built locally by a hobbiest gunsmith that shoots at our local 1000 yard BR range. He competes in the 1000 yd competitions and he doesn't break the bank on his builds either.

 

[7stw]

How many total shots have been through the barrel including the break in process?? Some rifles need to take lots of copper before the barrel sweetens up.

Shoot Straight!

StraightShooter77

You are correct on the sweet spot. I have s super accurate Bergara Ridge, in 7-08. Pretty much from day one, it shot most everything under an inch. I thought it was going to remain at that level, but after about 125 rounds, and with careful cleanings, it started shooting .5 groups, and now I have some repeatable .1, and .2 groups.
I have had no issues with mine, and am sad to hear that a few do, or suspect that thst have an issue with theirs!
Pretty good the the CEO is minding his business in a good way.
Happy with my choice!

 

[Muntell]

After this conundrum why would you want one

This is only the second bad review I've seen on a Bergara Rifle. The first one I came across, Bergara handled very well I feel. I'd be confident in getting one.

 

[338 dude]

This is only the second bad review I've seen on a Bergara Rifle. The first one I came across, Bergara handled very well I feel. I'd be confident in getting one.

There are a lot more than two bad reviews out there my friend had problems with one I know of personally I've read several but they're bad reviews with any manufacturer everyone makes a lemon every now and then

 

[25WSM]

I've seen more bad CA than bergara.
Shep

 

[Julio2357]

I would try a different bullet. Some rifles have a strong dislike for certain bullets and some have a definite preference for certain bullets.

I would agree, doesn't Hornady make an ELD-M in a .208 gr?? U might try that. I had a 6.5 that would no way shoot the Bergers. Bad thing is you have to buy a hundred bullets to find out-