How is StaBall 6.5 working out?

[okie man]

My all time favorite deer rifle was a model 70 featherweight in 280 rem. Sold it to buy a magnum for elk . Really thinking about a short action 7mm to replace my model 70. If I could get close to 280 numbers with stabil in a 7mm/08 I'd pull the trigger on a new gun

 

[Hugnot]

I notice Hodgdon load data is the same for H414 & W760, same charge weights & pressures. This makes me think there might be some noticeable lot to lot variation as other manuals have different data for the two.

At one time I used W760 in a 7mm-08 with the 150 Sierra MK & 140 - 150 Nosler BT for targets up to 1,000. This with a 9 twist barrel & 3000 ft. & 70* temps, never tried it in the 90*s. I might use StaBall in my 9 twist 6.5-08 with 130 ELDM's.

Last summer my nice .22-.250 75 ELDM load worked up in the 50*s with H414 at 90* temps was too hot, sticky bolt lifts & expanded primer pockets, thus interest in StaBall 6.5.

 

[johnnyk]

I got a pound to try and then got two more from a friend in a trade deal. I blended the three individual pounds so I wouldn't have to re-do load development as quick.
I just tried it before deer season in my .270 Winchester with 130gn Ballistic Tip's and it worked great. I used mostly Winchester brass but worked up to Hodgdon's max load of 55.5gn. I didn't look at their primer selection but went with Remington 9.5Magnums.
My rifle shoots the 130's into sub 1/2 MOA groups with low ES/SD. I have taken deer with this load this year from 25-471yds. I like it!

 

[BrentM]

Ran stabil in my 6.5 creed and it was ok. Liked 4350 and definitely rl26 better.

 

[JAYgs8163]

There's a great article about this powder in the most recent release of the Hodgdon online reloading app. Talks about using in the WSM and PRC rounds also. Some are reporting similar results to Retumbo. Here's a data sheet from that article. SDs are not very impressive across the board. I've got a few lbs and plan on testing with it soon in a 1/7 twist 6 Creedmoor and 115 Bergers. Just waiting for my build to get done. The listed loads below appear to be very modest.

 

[J E Custom]

I notice Hodgdon load data is the same for H414 & W760, same charge weights & pressures. This makes me think there might be some noticeable lot to lot variation as other manuals have different data for the two.

At one time I used W760 in a 7mm-08 with the 150 Sierra MK & 140 - 150 Nosler BT for targets up to 1,000. This with a 9 twist barrel & 3000 ft. & 70* temps, never tried it in the 90*s. I might use StaBall in my 9 twist 6.5-08 with 130 ELDM's.

Last summer my nice .22-.250 75 ELDM load worked up in the 50*s with H414 at 90* temps was too hot, sticky bolt lifts & expanded primer pockets, thus interest in StaBall 6.5.

Hodgdon has been buying there ball powders from Winchester and when Hodgdon bought them out they decided instead of marketing two of the SAME powders that they would drop the H414 and stay with the 760 designation to prevent redundancy. The W 760 and the H 414 are the same powder so the load data is the same.

The only difference I have found in ether powders, has been in the different batches (Common to all powders)

J E CUSTOM

 

[J E Custom]

My all time favorite deer rifle was a model 70 featherweight in 280 rem. Sold it to buy a magnum for elk . Really thinking about a short action 7mm to replace my model 70. If I could get close to 280 numbers with stabil in a 7mm/08 I'd pull the trigger on a new gun

My experience with the 7/08 has been if you want more velocity, Varget will deliver. Accuracy is very close to h 414 but 100 to 150 ft/sec increase is common.

If you really want to step the 7/08 up just AI it my 7/08 AI velocities are 150 ft/sec + faster than my 7/08 and my 260 rem AI will match the 7/08 with same weight bullets.

So a 7/08 AI should match the velocity of a 280 rem using 140 grain bullets because it can easily exceed 3000 ft/sec with the 140's.

J E CUSTOM

 

[WYO300RUM]

Testing Staball is on my to do list, I just haven't had time to do it yet.

The fact that some have had good luck with it helps, but for what I want to use it in it remains to be seen if it will perform because all cartridges react differently in different rifles.

I'm looking for a heat stable substitute for H 414. and Hoping that it will work. W 760 has replaced the h414 But it is heat sensitive like the H 414.

Just have to try it in my rifles and see.

J E CUSTOM

Hurry up Steve ! I have 6 lbs. and haven't tried in anything yet . Not sure why I even bought it...
Used your Absolute Hammers on a lope buck at 438 yds. A whitetail doe at 255 yds and one at 75 yds. All pass thru. They work great as long as I do my part. Haven't chrono'ed difference on Hammer Hunters but sure will.
1508 1/2 lol
Thanks !

 

[Hugnot]

Hodgdon has been buying there ball powders from Winchester and when Hodgdon bought them out they decided instead of marketing two of the SAME powders that they would drop the H414 and stay with the 760 designation to prevent redundancy. The W 760 and the H 414 are the same powder so the load data is the same.

The only difference I have found in ether powders, has been in the different batches (Common to all powders)

J E CUSTOM

Are all USA ball powders made by St Marks/General Dynamics in Florida? Would that include Alliant Power Pro Powders like Varmint, 1200R, 2000MR, & 4000MR? Don't know about 2000MR but 4000MR, a ball powder, appears to have been subjected to some extrusion process. Other ball powders appear to be rolled flatter to some degree, possible to inject some type of deterrent into each tiny grain.

It appears that Hodgdon is marketing two identical powders, H414 & W760, two different labels, two sets of identical on-line Hodgdon data, including data the 2021 Hodgdon annual manual. For years I had no problems with this as the shooters/hand loaders thought W760 was inferior to H414 and left the W760 powder available for me to buy when H414 supplies were gone.

Possibly, there are OSHA requirements that block domestic production of extruded powders in the USA. All the extruded or stick powders that I have seen are made in Australia, Finland, Sweden, Canada, Switzerland & other countries. I have read about horrific powder accidents in the USA where tons of extruded single base smokeless powers have exploded instead of combusting upon being subjected to heat and other nearby explosions during some drying process; this happened during during WWI production.

I have read that excess stocks or aged extruded powder can be salvaged to make ball powders.

Imagine how much shooting could be done with a ton of powder.

 

[Hugnot]

There's a great article about this powder in the most recent release of the Hodgdon online reloading app. Talks about using in the WSM and PRC rounds also. Some are reporting similar results to Retumbo. Here's a data sheet from that article. SDs are not very impressive across the board. I've got a few lbs and plan on testing with it soon in a 1/7 twist 6 Creedmoor and 115 Bergers. Just waiting for my build to get done. The listed loads below appear to be very modest.

View attachment 228982

Observed same - if Staball works in a .270 w 140's & 150's it might work in a 6.5-06 with 100's & 107's. It appears like the degree of case filling might be important for accuracy. I would guess that 53.5 & 51.0 grains filled the .270 case 80% to 85% - just guessing.

 

[J E Custom]

It appears that Hodgdon is marketing two identical powders, H414 & W760, two different labels, two sets of identical on-line Hodgdon data, including data the 2021 Hodgdon annual manual. For years I had no problems with this as the shooters/hand loaders thought W760 was inferior to H414 and left the W760 powder available for me to buy when H414 supplies were gone.

My Information came direct from Hodgdon them selves and they stated that they were discontinuing the H414 because it would be redundant to label and package the same powder with two different names.

Trying to find the quote and will post there statement.

J E CUSTOM

 

[ButterBean]

I use Staball 6.5 to start the grill with, I know it works good for that

 

[JAYgs8163]

One thing for sure, "it's in stock".

 

[Hugnot]

Is there a military application for StaBall? Looking at General Dynamics/St Marks site it seems like they supply almost all of the powder used by our military. I don't see where Staball would fit in unless there were some plans for using the 6.5 Creedmore for military applications. Midsouth sells 6.5mm 123 grain bullets.

I don't think I would fire up my grill with Staball because the deterrent and other stuff might make the food taste funny.