Full length size

tim_w

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 25, 2008
Messages
546
It looks to have been answered multiple times now by a few different people. You need to turn the die down so more of the case goes into the die. If you had a headspace gauge and calipers it would clearly confirm what your chamber is already telling you.

Brass has to flow somewhere when sized. You squeeze the sides of the case down the brass flows forward increasing the length of the case and thus not fitting. Having the case go in further not just till it hits the shoulder but untill you push the shoulder back to 0.001 headspace past its yield point your fired case are and the bolt will close with no resistance. The case has gotten longer so you are having to move the shoulder back more in response just to get it back to the headspace of a fired case.

Basic reloading manuals and kits give you at best the ability to make ammo of factory spec of min SAAMI with their instructions and minimal tools. But fact of the matter is calipers and headspace gauges are mandatory if you want ammo that custom fits your chamber and longer case life. It allows for accurate record keeping as well so you can reproduce the results later.

The comments about the lube are helpful and should be taken but are not the root of the issue, IMO. They will however help make the sizing work as it should.

For a long time I use to make my case lube using 50/50 stp oil treatment/hoppes 9 took the thinnest of films and was plenty. Little on a sponge in a big zip-lock or do it manually rolling one at a time. Just use the Hrdy spray or the pad lubes from the major suppliers.
 

PoppaW

Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2018
Messages
24
Well it did everything I can exceptshave the shellholder. I had an RCBS and a lee holder and bought another RCBS. All the same. No made in China variance here. I will find a machinist and take the holder down a bit. Am I talking 1 thou? More less??

I did get my three cases I was messing with to eventually size and I loaded them up. Not sure how long those three will last with the extra sizing.

Thanks for all the advice.
 

Barrelnut

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2013
Messages
4,444
Location
End of the Oregon Trail
I have read that you can shave off some of the shell holder yourself with sandpaper. Lay the sandpaper on a flat surface and move the shell holder in a figure 8 pattern and rotate it in the hand often. Just take off a couple thousands off the top of the shell holder at a time until it works. All you can mess up is the shell holder. I don't think it is important that the resulting surface has to be all that square.
 

jimbires

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
1,804
Location
clearfield county , Pa
how do you have the sizing die adjusted ?

when sizing a piece of fired brass , at the top of the stroke is there a gap between the shellholder and the die ? if there is any gap at all , you need to turn the die down a little more . you could also take some strain off your press , by trying a different lube that will reduce some friction . I do not like the spray lubes . I've never used the Lee lube you are using .
 

PoppaW

Member
Joined
Jan 9, 2018
Messages
24
Die and shell holder touch. Tried everything suggested in this thread. Will be trying the sandpaper on the shellholder next. I have not tried a different lube but will see what we have at the LGS. I will update with results.
 

Kmccord

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2016
Messages
765
Location
Reilly Springs, TX
Die and shell holder touch. Tried everything suggested in this thread. Will be trying the sandpaper on the shellholder next. I have not tried a different lube but will see what we have at the LGS. I will update with results.
I will tell you I shaved my shell holder down until it worked, but after a few more re-sizing the shell holder was to thin to hold up to the pressure. I ended up with a stuck case in my die, I had to purchase a stuck case removal tool, so you may want to purchase one. Redding makes a kit of shell holders that vary in size that will do what you need. The only other thing you could do is shave the bottom of the FL die, then take some 600 grain sand paper and polish the edges, good luck.
 

tbrice23

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2012
Messages
3,077
Location
Indiana
Seems like you could have trimmed a few thousandths from the bottom of the die instead.
Dies have a slight chamfer on the inside bottom of the dies anyway to keep from scratching the brass. This part never touched the brass anyway .
 

J E Custom

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2004
Messages
10,725
Location
Texas
Die and shell holder touch. Tried everything suggested in this thread. Will be trying the sandpaper on the shellholder next. I have not tried a different lube but will see what we have at the LGS. I will update with results.


Did you try adding a feeler gauge under the case head ? I like this method because you don't weaken the shell holder by grinding, And you can try different gauge thicknesses to get the sizing you want/need.

Once you find the best gauge thickness, You can simply add a small shim to the inside of the Shell holder and it becomes easy to use.
I also use the shim method to avoid adjusting the dies every time I change cartridges. I simply wright which cartridge on the shim needed.

J E CUSTOM
 

MNbogboy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 14, 2009
Messages
770
Location
Northern MN
Piece of window glass, 320 emery paper, figure 8s as stated above. These generally are a "tool" steel, so it takes a while. Measure often, apply more pressure on thick sides. Don't worry about taking off too much, you only need one or two thousandths. If you get .002 try it before you take off more. It will not weaken your shell holder "measurably" until you reach .010 or .015 and pretty certain you don't need that much. Alternative is to have it machined with a surface grinder. But hand electric grinding will not work because too hard to control.
Good luck,
Randy
 

Azrael

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2018
Messages
79
Location
Saskatchewan
I've been passing the feeler gauge trick on to others for quite some time; usually when they are having trouble sizing cases that were fired in a generous chamber first, but often when their gunsmith thinks that super short headspace is doing them a favor.

What I'm not 100% on is remembering to tell them to take the decapper pin out first. There's more than a few feeler gauges that have nice little holes in them. ;)
 

Barrelnut

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2013
Messages
4,444
Location
End of the Oregon Trail
Depending on the brand of shellholder your using, changing to a different brand shell holder may also help. RCBS shell holders set about .060 lower than Hornady shell holders. I just measured a couple I have...
 

jimbires

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2008
Messages
1,804
Location
clearfield county , Pa
Die and shell holder touch. Tried everything suggested in this thread. Will be trying the sandpaper on the shellholder next. I have not tried a different lube but will see what we have at the LGS. I will update with results.


"IF" your die and shellholder are touching solid at the top of the stroke with a fired piece of brass you can try the feeler gauge as J E custom suggested . you said you have tried a few other shell holders , so the only other thing is to alter the shell holder or die . that's something I've never had to do .
 

wboregon

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2017
Messages
124
This may not be a permanent solution, and I think everything else said here is definitely where you're going to be headed to resolve this permantly

But if you don't already, try sizing a case with out the expander and see if it will chamber.
 

J E Custom

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 29, 2004
Messages
10,725
Location
Texas
I've been passing the feeler gauge trick on to others for quite some time; usually when they are having trouble sizing cases that were fired in a generous chamber first, but often when their gunsmith thinks that super short headspace is doing them a favor.

What I'm not 100% on is remembering to tell them to take the decapper pin out first. There's more than a few feeler gauges that have nice little holes in them. ;)


Thanks for reminding me to tell others about removal of the ex pander/ Decapper . I automatically remove it when trying to size brass because I want the feel of the press without any distractions. After dies are set, and sizing is done, I remove the shim and finish decapping. (By removing the shim, This assures that the sizing remains where I set it).

I have yet to punch a hole in the feeler gauges or a shim, but there is always the first time.:rolleyes:

J E CUSTOM
 

Primary

LRH Assistant
Here are some related products that LRH members are talking about. Clicking on a product will take you to LRH’s partner, Primary, where you can find links to LRH discussions about these products.

 
 
Top