Full Length or Neck Only; What's Best Resizing for Accuracy?

BigJohnH said:
1)I never said "neck sizing die". 2) I have been nick sizing for my .308 since I built it with no problems at all.
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I have seen a big difference in my 300rums and edges when I used to neck size. Switched to fl and no issues with lugs or accuracy
 
BountyHunter said:
Sierra had different machines/dies and different operators all running down the line into one box. they had as much as .018 variance in one 100 rd box. I sent several back to sierra techs. Rich M. was a 1k shooter and Sierra tech and was key in getting the one operator/machine into one lot.
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When did that happen?

I don't think Sierra's HPMK bullets ever went from coin, cup, draw, trim, heel, core and finally point machine went direct into green boxes. Nor did any retail lot have bullets from more than one such machine. I've toured both of Sierra's plants several times and there's 3 more stages they went through before going into green boxes.

Only their 1000 count brown box HPMK's sold at rifle matches bypassed those last three stages. They still had sizing lanolin on them but shot more accurate than those in green retail boxes. I've bought several 30 caliber HPMK ones in 168, 180, 190 and 200 grain weights; about 40% below retailed 100 count green boxed.bullets.

20180402_085528~3-1200x1297-1024x1107.jpg


These were "standards" that tested in the zeros and ones used as quality control tests in their rail gun test barrel's accuracy. I've chatted with Sierra's Martin Hull, Rich Maholz and Kevin Thomas about all this. Sierra stopped this direct sales program when they moved to Missouri. I was able to get two such boxes of 30 caliber 155s in 1991 as I helped develop 308 Win load data for their first production lot of that new Palma bullet before they were sold at retail.
 
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Bart B said:
When did that happen?

I don't think Sierra's HPMK bullets ever went from coin, cup, drawn head, bunt, heel, core and finally point machine went direct into green boxes. I've toured both of Sierra's plants several times and there's 3 more stages they went through before going into green boxes.

Only their 1000 count brown box HPMK's sold at rifle matches bypassed those last three stages. They still had sizing lanolin on them but shot more accurate than those in green retail boxes. I've bought several 30 caliber HPMK ones in 168, 180, 190 and 200 grain weights; about 40% below retailed 100 count green boxed.bullets.

View attachment 171101

These were "standards" that tested in the zeros and ones used as quality control tests in their rail gun test barrel's accuracy. I've chatted with Sierra's Martin Hull, Rich Maholz and Kevin Thomas about all this. Sierra stopped this direct sales program when they moved to Missouri. I was able to get two such boxes of 30 caliber 155s in 1991 as I helped develop 308 Win load data for their first production lot of that new Palma bullet before they were sold at retail.
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It was my understanding that those bullets were not only from the same lot, and dies, they were consecutive in the run and not only very consistent, responsible for much of Sierra's reputation at the time.
 
Orange Dust said:
It was my understanding that those bullets were not only from the same lot, and dies, they were consecutive in the run and not only very consistent, responsible for much of Sierra's reputation at the time.
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Yes, same set of forming dies, but not consecutive bullets.

All bullets from one set of dies were dropped into a barrel that held a few thousand. 10 would be grabbed as they fell out at 70+ per minute then seated in full length resized primed and charged metered powder. They were fired about 3 seconds apart in rail guns for 100 or 200 yard accuracy tests. Then 10 more tested. If bullets started shooting in the ones, another barrel was moved in to catch bullets. If test groups got bigger, the original barrel was used to catch the less accurate bullets that still passed accuracy spec of 1/4" average.

Those super accurate bullets were never degreased, polished nor inspected for jacket flaws. 3 or 4 per 1000 count box had visible flaws on them.
 
Bart B said:
Yes, same set of forming dies, but not consecutive bullets.

All bullets from one set of dies were dropped into a barrel that held a few thousand. 10 would be grabbed as they fell out at 70+ per minute then seated in full length resized primed and charged metered powder. They were fired about 3 seconds apart in rail guns for 100 or 200 yard accuracy tests. Then 10 more tested. If bullets started shooting in the ones, another barrel was moved in to catch bullets. If test groups got bigger, the original barrel was used to catch the less accurate bullets that still passed accuracy spec of 1/4" average.

Those super accurate bullets were never degreased, polished nor inspected for jacket flaws. 3 or 4 per 1000 count box had visible flaws on them.
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Yes, that sounds right. They also really boosted their reputation with these.
 
Orange Dust said:
Well then explain how you "Neck Size" with a FL die, unless you are using a custom die fitted to the chamber.
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setup you FL DIE NORMALLY for FL SIZING AND Back it of 3/16" generally. If you read Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading 3rd addition it will debunk some of what others have said about neck sizing...
 
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