From POV of LR hunters, why the .17 Remington?
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MudRunner2005
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If you handload your ammo, and want a .172 caliber centerfire, the .17 Rem Fireball would be better, IMO. But another good one is the .204 Ruger cartridge. Brass and good factory ammo are much more available for .204 Ruger, as it is still in current production.
.17 Fireball brass is very hard to find, but this place has 400 pieces of once-fired for really cheap...
http://www.highplainsbrass.com/17-Remington-Fireball-Brass-Case--100-Rounds_p_12.html
.17 Fireball brass is very hard to find, but this place has 400 pieces of once-fired for really cheap...
http://www.highplainsbrass.com/17-Remington-Fireball-Brass-Case--100-Rounds_p_12.html
WildRose
Well-Known Member
*
Out to 400yds you're fine, beyond that or if there's any significant wind things get squirrely in a hurry.
The .22's like the Swift and -250 are much better at longer ranges and in the wind. The .243 and 6.5's are vastly superior to all of the above beyond 400yds and if you stick to rounds like the 6.5 Grendyl, .243, .260 Rem and 6.5CM the recoil, particularly with the 100-120gr class bullets is mild enough for just about anyone even without a suppressor or brake. Add either one and it's on par with the .204 and .17 Rem.
It's faster but you still have the same limitations due to microscopic BC's.
Out to 400yds you're fine, beyond that or if there's any significant wind things get squirrely in a hurry.
The .22's like the Swift and -250 are much better at longer ranges and in the wind. The .243 and 6.5's are vastly superior to all of the above beyond 400yds and if you stick to rounds like the 6.5 Grendyl, .243, .260 Rem and 6.5CM the recoil, particularly with the 100-120gr class bullets is mild enough for just about anyone even without a suppressor or brake. Add either one and it's on par with the .204 and .17 Rem.
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WildRose
Well-Known Member
All you need is .221FB brass or it's parent case the .222Rem and a couple of dies.
I just ordered a Shilen 1-9" twist in plain Jane 17 Remington.
A CZ527 got the ball rolling but I dislike the magazine.
I as many other people were like sheep, believing what the gun rag writers of the time told us. The 17 Remington was brow beaten by many from the start. The claim to fame of 4000fps was with the 20's. As we all well know, speed does little good with poor accuracy. The CZ does well with both the 20 and 25's. Though I will say I much prefer the 25's day in and day out, running what my rig says it likes.
I also have a 17 HH. I like the cartridge and like the accuracy and speed. A good what I call midrange cartridge 200-250 is where I swap guns. Yes it wil shoot further, but a lot of splat factor is lost. I run 20 grainers exclusively out of it. I am working on a 17WSM to see if I can replace the 17HH with my expectations. Rimfire, no muss no fuss looking for empty brass.
I lucked into a pile of 17 R brass and ammo, so I will be good for several years and barrels.
The new barrel I went with zero free bore. The 17R neck is plenty long. I have a pile of 25 Hornady's and plan on trying some of the Berger 30's.
The 20's fly better in the wind than I was led to believe. The 25's fly and track in the wind as good as any 55 grain 22 caliber I have ever used.
Recoil is nill. But this new rig is gonna be heavy. I went with a 26" bull barrel. The Choate stock from the donor rifle is getting filled up with #8 shot. Am hopeful I can get to 30 + lbs.
I have played with the 204 Ruger some. All I will say is, it is a fine cartridge, but the factory have the wrong twist. I have two factory rigs both at good shooters. Buddy has a rebarreled rig and it is an Excellent shooter.
A CZ527 got the ball rolling but I dislike the magazine.
I as many other people were like sheep, believing what the gun rag writers of the time told us. The 17 Remington was brow beaten by many from the start. The claim to fame of 4000fps was with the 20's. As we all well know, speed does little good with poor accuracy. The CZ does well with both the 20 and 25's. Though I will say I much prefer the 25's day in and day out, running what my rig says it likes.
I also have a 17 HH. I like the cartridge and like the accuracy and speed. A good what I call midrange cartridge 200-250 is where I swap guns. Yes it wil shoot further, but a lot of splat factor is lost. I run 20 grainers exclusively out of it. I am working on a 17WSM to see if I can replace the 17HH with my expectations. Rimfire, no muss no fuss looking for empty brass.
I lucked into a pile of 17 R brass and ammo, so I will be good for several years and barrels.
The new barrel I went with zero free bore. The 17R neck is plenty long. I have a pile of 25 Hornady's and plan on trying some of the Berger 30's.
The 20's fly better in the wind than I was led to believe. The 25's fly and track in the wind as good as any 55 grain 22 caliber I have ever used.
Recoil is nill. But this new rig is gonna be heavy. I went with a 26" bull barrel. The Choate stock from the donor rifle is getting filled up with #8 shot. Am hopeful I can get to 30 + lbs.
I have played with the 204 Ruger some. All I will say is, it is a fine cartridge, but the factory have the wrong twist. I have two factory rigs both at good shooters. Buddy has a rebarreled rig and it is an Excellent shooter.
sable tireur
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While not nearly as popular as the .223 Rem., the .17 Remington Fireball is still a viable cartridge even without factory support.
Originally it was the .17 Mach IV from P.O. Ackley which is made from .221 Fireball brass. There is not a tiny hair's difference between the two cartridges (.17 Rem Fireball and the Mach IV). There is a steady supply of .221 Fireball brass so your supply of .17 Rem. Fireball is assured. Yes, you'll have to actually make some brass but the life of these cases is extremely long due to low pressure and low heat. I made 500 pieces 24 years ago and I'm still working on that first batch now. I still have 500 pieces of .221 Fireball brass just in case...
As to long range, we have to be sure to understand that not all cartridges are created equal. Tiny but grandly efficient cartridges like the .17 Rem. Fireball will out perform it's sized out to about 300 yards or slightly more given appropriate conditions. But if the range of a prairie dog field exceeds that, be sure to bring at least one more rifle. We start with hand guns in the early days of the season when they aren't shy, then gradually add in rifles starting with the .17's and moving up to bigger stuff later as the PDs move back and away.
Originally it was the .17 Mach IV from P.O. Ackley which is made from .221 Fireball brass. There is not a tiny hair's difference between the two cartridges (.17 Rem Fireball and the Mach IV). There is a steady supply of .221 Fireball brass so your supply of .17 Rem. Fireball is assured. Yes, you'll have to actually make some brass but the life of these cases is extremely long due to low pressure and low heat. I made 500 pieces 24 years ago and I'm still working on that first batch now. I still have 500 pieces of .221 Fireball brass just in case...
As to long range, we have to be sure to understand that not all cartridges are created equal. Tiny but grandly efficient cartridges like the .17 Rem. Fireball will out perform it's sized out to about 300 yards or slightly more given appropriate conditions. But if the range of a prairie dog field exceeds that, be sure to bring at least one more rifle. We start with hand guns in the early days of the season when they aren't shy, then gradually add in rifles starting with the .17's and moving up to bigger stuff later as the PDs move back and away.
djm670
Well-Known Member
How well I remember!
I was out in AZ shooting at a local range before leaving to shoot prairie dogs, testing some newer loads. It was unusual for AZ since there was a tad bit of humidity in the air that morning so trace was definitely visible. I had some 15, 18 and 20 gr. varmint bullets loaded just to test and only about 3/4 made it to the targets at 100 yards. But the puff of grey mist was impressive to say the least.
The 37 gr. VLDs were just plain fun to shoot under the right conditions. When we brought these rifles out, we generally had people lining up just to try a shot. Good entertainment for everyone, young and old. The youngsters didn't have to fight the recoil at all and could be assisted with walking shots into the target. I have some left around here somewhere, I'll have to dig them up and get a barrel out.
Did the 37 grain VLD's stabilize in a 9 twist barrel? Probably a moot point now.
I hear you on the progressively longer capable rifles on gopher shoots....... .22 LR, 17 m2, 5mm Remington, .17 Remington, .223, .220 swift.. Have never used the 6 mm remington on gophers.. it has been a wood chuck and deer rifle..
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WildRose
Well-Known Member
The 5mm Rem was a heck of a neat little round. Before I was old enough to know you couldn't do it I actually killed a big gobbler flying away from us at a couple of hundred yards with one borrowed from a friend.
I was between 10-12 at the time.
Thanks for dredging up that memory.
djm670
Well-Known Member
The 5mm Rem was a heck of a neat little round. Before I was old enough to know you couldn't do it I actually killed a big gobbler flying away from us at a couple of hundred yards with one borrowed from a friend.
I was between 10-12 at the time.
Thanks for dredging up that memory.
Going to have to call you Annie Oakley shooting shooting birds on the fly with a rifle; that is pretty cool! It is amazing the things we did when we didn't know we couldn't do them.
The 5 mm remington has a modified Timney model 788 trigger on it now set at 1.5 lbs.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
We used to shoot pigeons on the fly with .22lr's till someone told us it was impossible too, HA!
A gobbler flying straight away with a scoped rifle wasn't that big of a deal but it sure impressed my dad.
codyadams
Well-Known Member
Just the other day I surprised myself, I was up looking for a cow elk with my cousin, and while driving on the mountain road from one canyon we had glassed over to another, we spotted several blue grouse about 75 yards away in a small grassy clearing. We stopped, I grabbed my .22 pistol and started sneaking up to them. I got to about 15-20 yards away, picked one out and lined up on it, and popped it, but my shot missed the wing and only using 40 grain solids, it just poked a hole with no expansion. The grouse jumped up and began flying away, so knowing it was wounded, I lined up on it while it was still flying low and gave it what I felt was the appropriate amount of lead and squeezed another one off, and to my surprise the bird promptly fell to the ground! When I cleaned the bird, I found my first shot just barely went into the vitals behind the breast as the bird was broadside to me, and the second shot broke the neck right where it comes into the body. I shot my bull elk at 816, but by far my best shot this year was a flying grouse with a .22 pistol at less than 30 yards!!
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Hey beats mine, I was using a rifle!
It's amazing what can be done once we get past the limits imposed on us by those who tell us it's impossible.
A flying Grouse with a .22 pistol is close to impossible but can be done If you ask me you had a great time hunting this year.
MagnumManiac
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My first barrel I ever burnt out was a Rem 700 BDL from 1971, a year after my birth, it was NIB when I bought it in 1990, UNFIRED by the deceased owner.
I burnt that barrel out in 18 months using Hornady 25gr HP's at a blistering 4163fps fired over my chrony.
I was shooting rabbits, foxes, goats, pigs and hares for paid vermin control, I had a VSF 700 in 22-250 as well that was shot out 6 months later.
In those 2 years, I fired in excess of 5,000 rounds through those barrels. I was impressed with both barrels lives. My first 300WM barrel didn't last 1200 rounds, I shot it hard and fast, so I am to blame.
Cheers.
I burnt that barrel out in 18 months using Hornady 25gr HP's at a blistering 4163fps fired over my chrony.
I was shooting rabbits, foxes, goats, pigs and hares for paid vermin control, I had a VSF 700 in 22-250 as well that was shot out 6 months later.
In those 2 years, I fired in excess of 5,000 rounds through those barrels. I was impressed with both barrels lives. My first 300WM barrel didn't last 1200 rounds, I shot it hard and fast, so I am to blame.
Cheers.
