For those who NEVER clean their bore, or almost never

[keithcandler]

What about boretech c4?

I have all of Boretec products, hard cooked on carbon is tough to get out, and C4 does not even touch it.. Certain powders are worse offenders than others. If you get C4 on a wood stock, it will ruin the finish.

 

[7stw]

I am in the middle of the road on this topic. My barrel cleaning, has evolved over the years, as I nearly scrapped a very good barrel, a long time ago, due to build up in the throat. Now, our cleaning supplies and technical cleaners, and actual techniques have gotten much better. Back then, Hoppes 9 was the norm, and it wouldn't remove copper, and wasn't the best for carbon either. So ignorance was bliss in that situation, and I nearly lost a barrel. Then came shooters choice, sweets, etc, and JB more cleaner!
Since the evolution of our modern cleaners, I've found a happy medium, and am in the camp of shoot the rifle, and monitor your shot count, and watch your groups. When they start to open, a cleaning is in order. OVERCLEANING, is as bad as any of it, because it strips the barrel, then it takes a few, or more for it to settle back down.
Bore cameras, can be a good thing, or a bad thing. It can cause people to overclean, or to think there barrels are junk, depending on the individual interpreting what they are seeing. Also remember, and I know this to be true, cleaning causes more damage, in some cases then not.
Our modern propellants leave a carbon signature, more so then the the older powders, and left unkempt, can cause problems. Lots of variables. Magnums need more cleaning, then non magnums, more powder, more carbon.
Again, in in the middle, clean when groups open, fire a few foulers, but clean carefully, watch the crown.
Peace out, 7stw

 

[kiwikid]

My tent is pitched in the same camp ground as J E Custom, Alex Wheeler and Bob Wright!

My CF rifles are cleaned back to squeaky clean every time they are used using KG1 and KG12. Then I put one patch through with a light coating of Eezox to protect from moisture. Due to this I have never seen a carbon ring through my Hawkeye in any of my rifles.
We spend hours sorting and prepping our brass, seating our primers to consistent depths, weighing our loads to individual kernels and then seating our bullets to consistent CBTO lengths. After all that joyful effort I don't see much point shooting them through an inconsistently fouled barrel. My experience suggests that the more rounds fired the harder the carbon seems to be baked on and the cleaning effort required appears to rise in an exponential fashion.

 

[Saracen]

There's a few people around who absolutely never clean their bore. There's a member on another forum who apparently works at some ballistics facility that fires hundreds of thousands of rounds annually during testing. They test barrels in some type of mechanical rest and find the true accuracy of barrels through thousands of rounds through those barrels. He says that he stopped cleaning the bores and found that there is no change in accuracy of the barrel through it's life. On his own rifles, he'll have fired upwards of 5,000 rounds through the bore of his Tikka without every having put a patch through it and it still shoots small groups. This all applies to functional field rifles... rifles for hunting or military applications. This is not in reference (I don't think) to benchrest competition barrels where you're trying to put every bullet in the same hole. So of course, there's the issue with pitting, etc. Well, if it still shoots then why worry about it? The whole point of doing this is to have a barrel that is consistent and reliable,, being able to put that first shot in the kill zone without worrying about fouling your bore, not having to put a lot of rounds through the bore to refoul it, etc. You're not worried about maintaining sub half moa groups, you just want the rifle to shoot roughly MOA so you can put the bullet into a 6" zone at 600 yards. I've started to embark on this journey, after having been in the habit of cleaning my bore every 20 rounds. Why? Because my gun is primarily for hunting and the enjoyment of shooting and handloading, and worrying about my bore isn't fun! Sure, if I had my gun shooting 1/4 moa that would be nice. But, I don't plan to shoot at game passed 500 yards, so 1" groups are fine with me. I do still worry about pitting and rust, even though my barrel is stainless.

Is there anyone here that NEVER cleans their bore? If you enjoy the life of neglecting your bore, do you do anything at all to protect the bore between shooting sessions to put your mind at ease? What are your experiences with the consistency of your barrel if you subscribe to this kind of madness?

Apparently military snipers don't go OTT on cleaning, as it creates inconsistency.

 

[J E Custom]

I need reccomendation on new cleaning solvents. I have been using Bore Tech products. Any residual left anywhere of this stuff gets really gummy. I want to try something different.

I use Butch's Bore shine for normal cleaning and break in, and Bore tech if I an going to leave it over night and use 1 or 2 application's to remove it and then follow up with a mild application of Hoppe's to remove any solvents that may be left. If fouling is bad i will use Sweets but wont leave it in the barrel for more than 5 or 6 minutes.

J E CUSTOM

 

[Saracen]

I use Butch's Bore shine for normal cleaning and break in, and Bore tech if I an going to leave it over night and use 1 or 2 application's to remove it and then follow up with a mild application of Hoppe's to remove any solvents that may be left. If fouling is bad i will use Sweets but wont leave it in the barrel for more than 5 or 6 minutes.

J E CUSTOM

Hoppes No. 9?

 

[keithcandler]

Get a Teslong bore scope or a lyman, and become an expert with your rifles, especially in what does not work...you will be shocked to say the least in all the BS that you have read.

Hint: Bronze bristle brushes are your friend, discard after 100 strokes.

Cleaning frequency, caliber, #of grains in the powder charge, barrel and throat quality, amount of bearing surface on the bullet you are shooting, type of bullet you are shooting, and more come into play in getting the most out of your barrel in terms of accuracy and consistency.

Each barrel will have their own fouling characteristics.

Model your techniques similar to Alex Wheeler's if you are a long range shooter.

 

[J E Custom]

Hoppes No. 9?

Yes. It is a very mild solvent that you can leave in to store a rifle. It will however do a good job of removing harsh solvents, although I don't leave anything in the barrel for storage except oil.

I feel that It is not very good for removing Fouling or anything else but it works to remove other solvents. I prefer not to trust leaving any residual solvent in the bore mixed with oil.

J E CUSTOM

 

[Dirtrax]

I have yet to experience anything positive in not cleaning beyond 30-50 rounds. 20 rounds is my typical max. I dry patch after a few shots if it is practical to do so and it will extend my accurate round count somewhat. Using the Lyman gen.2 borescope has only confirms this IMO. I'm not calling anyone out or discrediting personal experiences contrary to mine. I understand why in some cases it isn't feasible to clean frequently.

 

[milo-2]

Every barrel has it's own characteristics. I am not sure how blanket statements hold much merit. Every powder fouls a barrel differently. As does every bullet offering, now re-enter different barrels.
If I switch powders while testing, clean, same goes with bullets. Why would you leave copper residue from one bullet in your barrel and not give your next try the opportunity of being engraved without outside interference?
This not cleaning phase really took hold about 5 yrs ago, a couple top shooters made the statement, and the "useful idiots" fell in line. Now, I am not calling anyone here an idiot, it is just a term to illustrate how easy it is to get people to follow. We seeing this right now all over the country in protest form.
The guys and gals who like to shoot tiny little groups at 1K on weekends, seem to do it with cleaner barrels, yet here we are trying to prove them wrong.
The barrel itself, the powder, the bullet, and the speed of that bullet will dictate how often a rifle needs cleaned if at all. We all have differing degrees of accuracy we strive for, so how can a blanket statement be made?
To the op, it is up to you to determine if you need to clean or not, I would not listen to you on the subject, why would you listen to me?

 

[Tac-O]

Every barrel has it's own characteristics. I am not sure how blanket statements hold much merit. Every powder fouls a barrel differently. As does every bullet offering, now re-enter different barrels.
If I switch powders while testing, clean, same goes with bullets. Why would you leave copper residue from one bullet in your barrel and not give your next try the opportunity of being engraved without outside interference?
This not cleaning phase really took hold about 5 yrs ago, a couple top shooters made the statement, and the "useful idiots" fell in line. Now, I am not calling anyone here an idiot, it is just a term to illustrate how easy it is to get people to follow. We seeing this right now all over the country in protest form.
The guys and gals who like to shoot tiny little groups at 1K on weekends, seem to do it with cleaner barrels, yet here we are trying to prove them wrong.
The barrel itself, the powder, the bullet, and the speed of that bullet will dictate how often a rifle needs cleaned if at all. We all have differing degrees of accuracy we strive for, so how can a blanket statement be made?
To the op, it is up to you to determine if you need to clean or not, I would not listen to you on the subject, why would you listen to me?

I agree. I wasn't trying to make a blanket statement. The guy who I referenced may have been based on what he's seen it n his work experience. I'm simply trying it out with my gun to see what f it works and would like to hear other's experience that have tried it.... Whether it's been good and they're still going with a dirty barrel or it didn't go well and they're cleaning with some regularity.

Example - I've started this with my kids Savage 7mm08, but I'm only about 45 rounds in or so and there is a boat load of copper in the muzzle. It also didn't shoot the best last time I took it out. So, that one may get cleaned today.

 

[Alex Wheeler]

And for anyone that has been around a long time and tried it ALL....

I just recently read Nathan Foster's books from this web site Ballisticstudies.com. For some bores, like a Tikka that likes to be fouled to shoot well, he recommends cleaning every 100-200 rounds. Regardless of whether the gun is cleaned every 20 or 100 or 200 rounds, he promotes "polishing" the throat area of the bore every 100 or 200 in order to keep the pores of the stainless closed and increase the life of the barrel by reducing fire cracking. This is done usually with a maroon 3m pad and then some JB's. What are people's thoughts on these treatments? @J E Custom @Alex Wheeler

Absolutely not. 3m pads are aluminum oxide (same as sand paper), way more aggressive than jb or iosso. The sharpness in a throat is important to accuracy. You will smooth it out very fast doing something like that and shorten the barrels accuracy life drastically. I measure the oal to touch in all of my rifles every time I reload. So I am checking for throat wear every 10-50 rounds down the barrels. I know exactly how much they wear and when it happened. Solvents and brushing will not move a throat. You want to do that as much as you can. Eventually you will need to get after some hard carbon with JB compound. When you JB the barrel you will move the throat a couple thousandths. I would bet you move it .005" if you used a 3m pad easy. Its not reducing the fire cracking, its sanding it out. Even jb or iosso should be used only as needed, for longest accuracy life. Thats some terrible advice to be honest. I hope its out of context somehow.

 

[glasser]

Couldn't have said it better myself

Here's what John Krieger of Krieger barrel fame has to offer on the topic:

Thanks for sharing that.

 

[snowghost51]

Am I the only one who knows each barrel has a shot limit before being replaced? A cold bore shot, is different than a hot shot, no matter, every 100-250 rounds clean out the carbon & copper, check zero, & soldier on!