Fawn Killer Gets Lead Poisoning, Is that a good thing?

shootallday

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That's clearly a wolf. New York would be in the range of the wolves of the great lakes. Probably don't see many there, but it's possible I guess.

Edit: after a little reading, there is a small reclusive wolf population in upstate New York known as the "Adirondack wolf"
we had a moose hit by a car on rt.17 near bear mountain about 10 years ago. That s like 30 minute drive from Manhattan.
 

DSheetz

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Shootallday look at the ears on the picture you posted then look at the ears on the picture that Pwbergen posted you don't need to see the size of the animal the ears tell you a story as do the size of the feet . It's amazing to see them .
 

HRM Johnny

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There are cross' out there and often people can't tell you for sure if it was a coyote or a coyote dog cross . I can tell you that some of the cross' here are quite large and have little fear of humans . As time goes on I'm pretty sure that you will be seeing more and more coyote dog cross' and fewer pure coyote . The cross breeds here tend to run in packs more then the true coyote do and they also tend to do more killing for the chase then the coyote .

If you read up on Wikipeda and Inspire Uplift Illinois and Ohio are both listed as having tested for and found to have a percentage of coydogs in their population of wild coyote it's not a high percent perhaps 3 percent . Wyoming is one of the states listed as being one of the states that had breading of coydogs early on by humans . We have a large sub-specie of coyote that are known as mountain coyote by a lot of people that will routinely run from 60 - 75 lbs . and have a much more blackish back and mane , we have a smaller coyote that has fine fur and is often called a sand hills coyote as well as an average sized coyote that will run in the 30pound range and over that has a nice silver back and mane refereed to as a Montana pail . There are several sub-specie of coyote with varying sizes , colors from reddish to nearly black ,silvery and some nearly brown . Coydogs are not real common but do exist in the wild and most likely have from around the time mankind brought dogs with them over the Bearing land bridge . Coyote kill to make a living and at times of the year kill more then they will eat as they are teaching the young of the year to hunt and kill , or in the spring they may only eat the soft parts to take back to the litter to regurgitate . I have spent a lot of my life studying coyote and learning how to hunt and kill them I haven't killed nearly as many as some have , around 4500 , and I sure don't know all that there is to about them and I hope to keep learning about them from people here on this site but as is usual if I think some info is wrong or I find that I may be wrong I will start to study some more and I will correct my statement for your benefit . Killing coyote isn't a bad thing over the years I have found that the litter size is consistent with the amount of food base they have so some what to the numbers of coyote in the area and the areas carrying capacity not on the hunting pressure put on them . They are survivors , adaptable and intelligent . I also do my best to deal in facts and study up so that I can for my own benefit
Thanks for the information. Thanks for the posts-they are much appreciated.
 

Nipper

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Gentlemen let me interject, I've killed realistically upwards of 1000 coyotes, a large coyote in Ohio is 45 lbs., here's a pic of one in dead of winter very lean , in good times he might have gone 55lbs. The only way to know for sure is to weigh them, 80 lbs. doubtful, HOWEVER Ohio DNR has documented some in the 65 to 75 lb. range, HOWEVER DNA testing showed northern timber wolf in the genetic background. This crossbreeding has occurred when Lake Erie freezes over and northern timber wolves cross the ice and interbreed with coyotes, all proven by DNA Testing a relatively simple process. Coydogs are extremely rare I actually thought I killed one picture to be posted HOWEVER after DNA testing it was proven to be a pure coyote. I deal in facts not speculation or drama. Here we go. The first picture red coyote was 100% pure DNA tested by my friend a veterinarian he's all into this kind of stuff, I also provide him with coyote hearts he checks the heartworm infestation in them in Ohio .I would have bet the farm this was a coydog. In the summer this coyote hanging might have hit 50 to 55 rare anyways.
That. Is one big Dead. But healthy looking dog!!
 

Coyote Shadow Tracker

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A lot of interesting information on Coyotes. I have studied them for years, but never shot as many as some stated 1,000+ and 4,500. I have trapped them and grew up in areas that never had coyotes and now loaded with them. I have several post on this subject so won't repeat it.
Coydogs are real, still need to be convinced on wolf cross breed and am sure on the "Red Wolf" cross breed. Back in the 70s 80s South Carolina re-interduced the Red Wolf. If you look at a Red Wolf and Coyote they almost look like the same animal. They have cross bred. Although we are not allowed to shoot Red Wolves you can't tell the difference in the field. I have dozens of pictures of coyotes that look like a coyote, but they go from pure black to white and getting larger in the years. There is documented films of wild dog packs interacting with coyotes so there is Coydogs. I have shot and trapped a lot of coyotes, but never thought one was a Coydog or part Red Wolf. Now I took a break from hunting due to medical issues and still kept up setting up cameras to see what was in the areas. I have a new piece of property where the last time I shot a coyote or Bob Cat was about 4-5 years ago. The pictures I have been getting of coyotes the past two years is astonishing to me. These coyotes are all different colors and looking like 40 lbs. I hope to be able to get out to take of few. This area is the area that has a hog population also. There is plenty of feed for these yotes. The are where I live is loaded with opossums, racoons, armadillos, squirrels, turkeys and a good climate. I should mention that the Quail population is gone, but mainly due to farming, skunks, racoons, Hawks not all to coyotes. Racoons and skunks kill most of the quail and turkey population from eating the eggs on ground nesting birds.
I have a tree farm down the road from me and they have a 24/7 365 day permit to shoot deer. hey want the coyotes around to kill the deer so if you look at everything there are people ranchers hunters that think you need to kill the coyotes because the eat deer and live stock then the farmers that want to kill the deer because the eat the crops or trees and want the coyotes around. I have hunted in PA shooting woodchucks. The farmers said kill every woodchuck and deer you see. Killing a deer out of season is illegal , but the farmers said no problem kill anyway. They told us DO NOT SHOOT ANY COYOTE. That's how much they hated deer and their loss of crops to them.
I guess there is two side to every story!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Hecouldgoalltheway

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A lot of interesting information on Coyotes. I have studied them for years, but never shot as many as some stated 1,000+ and 4,500. I have trapped them and grew up in areas that never had coyotes and now loaded with them. I have several post on this subject so won't repeat it.
Coydogs are real, still need to be convinced on wolf cross breed and am sure on the "Red Wolf" cross breed. Back in the 70s 80s South Carolina re-interduced the Red Wolf. If you look at a Red Wolf and Coyote they almost look like the same animal. They have cross bred. Although we are not allowed to shoot Red Wolves you can't tell the difference in the field. I have dozens of pictures of coyotes that look like a coyote, but they go from pure black to white and getting larger in the years. There is documented films of wild dog packs interacting with coyotes so there is Coydogs. I have shot and trapped a lot of coyotes, but never thought one was a Coydog or part Red Wolf. Now I took a break from hunting due to medical issues and still kept up setting up cameras to see what was in the areas. I have a new piece of property where the last time I shot a coyote or Bob Cat was about 4-5 years ago. The pictures I have been getting of coyotes the past two years is astonishing to me. These coyotes are all different colors and looking like 40 lbs. I hope to be able to get out to take of few. This area is the area that has a hog population also. There is plenty of feed for these yotes. The are where I live is loaded with opossums, racoons, armadillos, squirrels, turkeys and a good climate. I should mention that the Quail population is gone, but mainly due to farming, skunks, racoons, Hawks not all to coyotes. Racoons and skunks kill most of the quail and turkey population from eating the eggs on ground nesting birds.
I have a tree farm down the road from me and they have a 24/7 365 day permit to shoot deer. hey want the coyotes around to kill the deer so if you look at everything there are people ranchers hunters that think you need to kill the coyotes because the eat deer and live stock then the farmers that want to kill the deer because the eat the crops or trees and want the coyotes around. I have hunted in PA shooting woodchucks. The farmers said kill every woodchuck and deer you see. Killing a deer out of season is illegal , but the farmers said no problem kill anyway. They told us DO NOT SHOOT ANY COYOTE. That's how much they hated deer and their loss of crops to them.
I guess there is two side to every story!!!!!!!!!!!
You can argue with the genetic evidence if you want to, but coydogs aren't a thing. They have been doing genetic testing for decades, and it is clear. Wolves and coyotes regularly share DNA, but not domestic dogs. Color phase animals are a result of melanin production, which can be due to many factors, but are mostly just regressive genetic traits, not because they bred with the neighborhood Rottweiler. There are more than 30 recognized subspecies of coyote, so they vary widely, even in the same area. Buy I repeat, the coydog is a myth. Do some research before you attempt to argue this.
 

Coyote Shadow Tracker

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You can argue with the genetic evidence if you want to, but coydogs aren't a thing. They have been doing genetic testing for decades, and it is clear. Wolves and coyotes regularly share DNA, but not domestic dogs. Color phase animals are a result of melanin production, which can be due to many factors, but are mostly just regressive genetic traits, not because they bred with the neighborhood Rottweiler. There are more than 30 recognized subspecies of coyote, so they vary widely, even in the same area. Buy I repeat, the coydog is a myth. Do some research before you attempt to argue this.
I guarantee that I won't argue-I NEVER do. Only Stated what was posted in magazines on Coydogs and videos taken showing coyotes and dogs breeding. They say Grey Wolves and coyotes have mixed DNA - I would most likely dispute this because Grey Wolves kill and eat coyotes. Now another story with Red Wolves. They are both the same size and look the same. I can see the cross breeding. I can also entertain and believe that a coyote and dog can breed. If you believe wolves and dogs interbreed why not dogs and coyotes???? There are thousands of mixed Wolf/Dog breeds. I have done research and spent many weeks inside with wolves & wolf/dog. I have many pictures with me in RESEARCH containment areas with wolves and wolf/dogs. At Facilities that study wolves and dog interbreeding located in FL from the University of FL. I CAN NOT see why anyone would say that Coyotes and dogs can't breed to have a Coydog??? Studies and DNA prove it the same as wolves and dogs. They say the dogs came from wolves and most of the dog's DNA is wolf!
This post is about hunting coyotes because of killing fawn. It has gone full circle about everything else.
If Coyotes are in your area taking out the population you sure can take them out. I do all the time. The coyotes ripped up my neighbor's dog three nights ago and they had to put her down. Our cats are very smart and never been caught mainly because Samson our 145 Bernese Mountain Bog Protects our cats, & Goats.. Samson has killed a few on his own. I will have to break out my night hunting coyote equipment and start taking them out. Just nature has a funny way with animals. If we start getting more interbreed dog and coyotes we will be in for one hell of an animal killer.
 
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Mike Matteson

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I have watch the game go down hill in Montana for the pasted 20 years. The wolves increased and the game animals went down. Some of that was management, but the wolves had a large part in it. Moose are almost gone now. In the early 2000 there was a time while in the field hunting, that I didn't run into Moose. That's is no longer the case. Good luck even seeing one now. In the Big Hole area 20 years ago you couldn't drive through there without see several. Again good luck now. SAD. SAD.
 

cabelasken

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You mean the WILDLIFE BIOLOGIST, they got a bunch of them fellers in Washington too.
I heard the original target was 30 to 50 breeding pairs of wolves to keep the balance between predators and prey. And now we have over 5 times what was designated and the number is growing. If the trend continues, tag quotas for sportsmen for big game will have to be reduced so herds will have a chance to maintain adequate levels. Let's not kid ourselves, the wolves now inhabit nearly all western states so potentially all tag quotas will be affected. And the reason wolves have moved into other states is that the competition among the initial packs has forced them to seek new new territory.
 

Mike Matteson

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10 breeding pairs in Yellowstone. The dumb a**s in court stop it for a long time. Now there about 300 breeding pairs and packs. Change out congress sometime back and the laws changed. With what we have in there now, Look Out! I use to hunt close to Yellowstone for awhile in the early 2000. Then the elk began to disappear. One year I noted that almost no elk, but a hell of a lot of Wolves Tracks. The Moose the same way there. Montana Fish & Game moved in Grizzle too, now too, it has become one place they want you to stay out of. Wyoming fought it for a very long time and finely won out. Now you can shoot any wolf almost anywhere any time of the year except in a couple of places. No Licenses require in state or out of state people. they do a far better job of managing their wildlife. A lot of biologists quick Montana and moved on. They didn't want to be a part of the down fall of the wild game. They couldn't get the powers to be over them to lesson. I was against it from the start, and still am.
 

DSheetz

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Canines eat meat as do felines mainly in their diets . Some will kill and eat fresh meat others will also eat what they can find already dead that is all a part of their make up . We can do the best that we can to control their numbers . We can study and learn about them and how best to control them or we can just kill the ones we see when we can . I did predator control for a few ranches for over 36 years , as well as worked at a power plant as a multi craft mechanic . I hunted coyote and mostly targeted the ones that were causing problems by killing livestock as well as any other animals that were killing livestock . I worked on some ranches that were in the area of 100000 acres , trapping , calling , snaring and areal hunting them . As well I would get called to kill coyote or other animals by other ranchers having problems ( often caused by people not really knowing what they were doing but not intending to cause harm . I actively den hunted in the spring time from April to mid June finding for me that to be the best way to really control their numbers in my area , as well as to stop the killing of livestock . I have started working for ranchers that were shipping a 70 % lamb crop and in a couple of years they would be shipping well over 100% lamb crop as well as they would be seeing larger numbers of deer and antelope fawns surviving . I retired from control work in 2017 some of the ranchers didn't hire anyone to take over where I left off as they had decided to sell the sheep and just run cattle . With in two years the number of coyote was back to the numbers that were there when I first started . I'm not trying to brag I'm just trying to point out that you have to really work at it to control the coyote population and if you let up on the control they will be right back to fill in the gaps that you have created . I could go out there and starting today hunt them for a year and get over 216 coyote that was my average from the same areas that at one time I had them controlled in .
 

Starboard277

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We should petition the government to let us release a few packs of Dalmatians and Rottweilers near the mexican wolves in the nm gila near snow lake and see if it is possible for them to interbreed with the wolves and yotes. This will tell us all we need to know and it will not take much time to come to a conclusion. Been wanting to try this for years.
 

parshal

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I'm like the original poster. I'm a live and let live kinda guy until they start killing the fawns outside my bedroom window. I don't want to listen to that and I really enjoy watching the fawns. It's happened a few times in the past eight years. They got a hold of my neighbor's young got the other night hand have taken a big bite out of one our goats ears and he's no small goat. If I have a safe shot now I take it.
 

Starboard277

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I'm like the original poster. I'm a live and let live kinda guy until they start killing the fawns outside my bedroom window. I don't want to listen to that and I really enjoy watching the fawns. It's happened a few times in the past eight years. They got a hold of my neighbor's young got the other night hand have taken a big bite out of one our goats ears and he's no small goat. If I have a safe shot now I take it.
We raise sheep and fortunately the yard is fenced but occasionally we will hear the yotes in the alfalfa fields next us.
 
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