did I anneal too long or what else is going on?

G. Neely

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Oct 26, 2018
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16
Location
Houston, TX
A salt bath annealer works great and is buildable for around $200. We use larger versions of them to temper custom forged blades as well, because they provide the most even heat possible.
 

Bwana Barry

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Sep 22, 2012
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25
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Napier South Africa
I was lubing the shoulder. I stopped doing that and now all is good. I am still a bit worried I annealed too long. Any idea of the consequences if I did? The bases/case head definitely did not get to hot as I used the socket technique to prevent them being exposed to high heat and then I dropped straight into a water bucket.
Exactly for how long did you anneal each case?
Caliber?
Strength of blue flame?
Annealing machine or revolving drill bit?
 

Starlite

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Dec 8, 2019
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289
Location
New Brunswick Canada
I have a 308 win in a Ruger #1, I just neck size the cases, I've never annealed them btw they are federal cases.
I picked out 20 cases for load development, they are now on their 15th reloading and it looks as though the primer pockets are going to be the cause of scrapping them.
Yep. Mine too. Before I started annealing, Primer pockets failEd before brass hardness/softness changes. I do annealing anyway; as I’m Type A:rolleyes::rolleyes:
 

CCAguns

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Feb 3, 2009
Messages
48
Location
Louisiana
Just shoot them. I get them all the time when using a pad - just can't even out the grease or take the time to check each neck. The spray on lubes work better if lightly sprayed. They'll just blow out upon firing.
 

J E Custom

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Jul 29, 2004
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10,595
Location
Texas
Please see picture. I am getting this small dent on resizing my once fired brass which I also annealed. I used tempilac to time how long I should anneal but I also noticed some of the pieces of brass starting to faint glow orange so I think I went too long. I checked my die and there is nothing inside causing the dents when sizing and not all the pieces are doing this. Im thinking the case neck wall is collapsing because it is too soft. Are these no longer safe to use? This would be a total bummer as I did about 75 pieces this way. Thanks....

Like the others, I think the cases are being deformed because they are soft and normally to much case lube is used or the die is getting loaded up with the lube. I will often size a case with no lube to wipe the excess of the dies.they should be ok to use. (But only one so as not to size dry). But they should be ok to use. If you have overheated the cases changing the alloy, they will take on a galvanized look (Little crystals). I would recommend polishing before annealing so you can see if any overheating is taking place.

J E CUSTOM
 

Chrsm

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Jan 21, 2020
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4
Location
N.east
Make sure peep hole on your sizing die is clean. I clean mine out after I’m done using it every time
I agree, It looks to me like vent hole. It should breath free to exit air, if it is clogged it will build pressure and collapse the weakest (softest) point. Try cleaning your die. If it was to soft I believe it would have collapsed the neck into the shoulder.
 

jdyoung

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Mar 1, 2020
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330
Location
Ironman Country
6.5prc. MAP gas torch. About 4.5 seconds is how long it took for the tempilac to melt away.
What degree of Tempilac ?
Also, If you use 'em, Redding dies, (the last I looked), didn't have a vent hole.
I use Dillions Precision case lube. It is a pump spray , ingredients: lanolin and alcohol
 

beto

Active Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2014
Messages
38
Please see picture. I am getting this small dent on resizing my once fired brass which I also annealed. I used tempilac to time how long I should anneal but I also noticed some of the pieces of brass starting to faint glow orange so I think I went too long. I checked my die and there is nothing inside causing the dents when sizing and not all the pieces are doing this. Im thinking the case neck wall is collapsing because it is too soft. Are these no longer safe to use? This would be a total bummer as I did about 75 pieces this way. Thanks....
Too much lube.
 

Blackhawk

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Mar 29, 2018
Messages
217
Location
Florida
Please see picture. I am getting this small dent on resizing my once fired brass which I also annealed. I used tempilac to time how long I should anneal but I also noticed some of the pieces of brass starting to faint glow orange so I think I went too long. I checked my die and there is nothing inside causing the dents when sizing and not all the pieces are doing this. Im thinking the case neck wall is collapsing because it is too soft. Are these no longer safe to use? This would be a total bummer as I did about 75 pieces this way. Thanks....
[/QUOTE
Food for thought :
First, take apart your Fl resizing die and clean it down to the bone.
After reassembling your die, clean your shell holder of accumulated grit and set it back in place.
Next, check your press for cleanliness and clean & lube as needed.
Make certain that your bras shell cases are clean inside as well as out.
Your photograph shows an accumulation of grit inside the necks ID. This must be cleaned out with a brush before you continue.( most likely from the Templac residue)

Once all of this has been done try to full length resize a virgin piece of brass using the same lube and applying it in the same manner. If it checks out OK then perhaps your brass may be annealed incorrectly.
You did mention how you are annealing your brass and your applied techniques but before we go down that road I would suggest the following.

1) Readjust your Fl resizing die to just slightly cam over on your press if your press allows for cam over.
2) lightly lube your shell case making certain not to place lubricant on your cases neck and shoulder area.
3) Raise your ram with slow and deliberate pressure. (don't slam it home)
4) Remove and examine your bass shell casing for any signs of collapsing shoulders.
5) If your brass shoulder area still is collapsing then back out you die a quarter of a turn and process another shell case.
6) If still no luck I would change the brand of lubricant (Hornady One-shot works very well if used sparingly).
I have been using a homemade copy of the Dillon Spray Lube ( can be found on the internet) and this has been working just fine for me for years with no I mean 0 issues.

Note: I honestly believe that your case lube and the amount that you are using is your problem.
7) If your problem still persists I would believe that perhaps your brass has been annealed to long allowing your case necks and shoulders to become too soft. This would lead me to believe that your annealing process needs to be reevaluated.
Homemade annealers are not very reliable nor accurate. If you choose to anneal your brass I suggest that you look at an automated annealer. In this manner least, you will get even and consistent annealing.
I am using Annealeeze 2, which yields brass that has correctly annealed to the proper temperature.
You can google this or any other annealer for more information as I for one would not trust the socket and drill press method of annealing ( just my thoughts )
8) This will be verified by the full-length resizing of a virgin sell case as described earlier and if this is still your problem try changing the brand of your brass shell cases and do not anneal them, assuming that they are not range brass and are all of the same brand and lot numbers and have been fired from the same weapon and see if this solves your issue.
Best of Luck & hope this helps!
 
Last edited:

7mmTikkaShooter

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Joined
Nov 3, 2015
Messages
54
Location
South Dakota
Please see picture. I am getting this small dent on resizing my once fired brass which I also annealed. I used tempilac to time how long I should anneal but I also noticed some of the pieces of brass starting to faint glow orange so I think I went too long. I checked my die and there is nothing inside causing the dents when sizing and not all the pieces are doing this. Im thinking the case neck wall is collapsing because it is too soft. Are these no longer safe to use? This would be a total bummer as I did about 75 pieces this way. Thanks....
That’s hydraulic deformation from excessive case lube on the shoulder. Over annealing can cause some dangerous conditions to happen and things like blown primers or case head separation would be likely. That said, your annealing line looks appropriate from what I can see and as long as you adhered to the what the Tempilaq was showing you, I’d feel fine about shooting them. I run into the same issue with an RCBS lube pad with other calibers and I don’t adjust the load at all. The case capacity difference is negligible and probably less than running virgin brass. After next firing the brass will be back in shape. I find that using my fingers to wipe the lube off of the case eliminates the excess and still provides the necessary lubrication. One other thing you could do is just give the dies a good cleaning. If you’re seeing issues from excessive lube it might be a buildup inside the die. In my opinion I would not throw out that brass and load them up. Happy shooting.
 
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