Cooper rifle won't chamber twice fired brass

[Blackhawk]

Maybe the neck just needs to be trimmed back to spec???

PLEASE READ:
If You measure the head with a pair of quality micrometers you will find your cases head dimension is most likely +.002" +.005" Over Size. This can be attributed to several issiues which I won't go into here, however you will solve your initial problem by following along.
Initially start with virgin brass and set aside all your fired brass so that you can make a fair assumption of the following procedure !
Apparently your brass is conforming to your chambers dimensions which may be slightly larger but still within Sammi Specs..
The solution is to reduce the brass at it's base to where it will chamber in your rifle easily.
First do you own a cartridge Case length gage in .270 Caliber?
If not please I suggest that you purchase one in this caliber. (see below)
Next purchase a Redding body die. (caliber specific)
Now if you want to bump you shoulder at the same time killing two birds with one stone purchase the Redding #1 competition shell holder set.
Combining these two items will allow you to fit brass cases
(A) To completely ensure a perfect case to chamber fit.
(B) It will bump size your shoulder back -.002" or more as you see fit. all in one continuous operation .
The best part is you do not need to waste your valuable time playing around with your FL resizing die in order to get your correct shoulder bump.
Simply by setting the Redding Body Die ONCE , and use of the Redding Competition Shell Holder Set #1 plus the stepped and numbered shell holders included in this set along with your rifle you will establish a custom fit that works in your action.
(You can U-Tube for videos on this)
Now another plus is that you can use this same Redding # 1 Competition Shell Holder Set on Any and I repeat Any Caliber Case that is in this family ie, . 22-250, 243, 6.5 Creedmoor, 270, 308. & 3 0 -06 + any wildcat cartridges using this parent base
( NOTE: You Must FL resize your your cases, and trim to length as per your norm first before using the body die)
By using this system You No Longer will you be plagued by rounds that will not feed in your rifle !
I use this Redding Body Die Combination as stated above on every rifle that I shoot ( most fortunately fall into the category #1 Redding Shell Holder Set) and can attest to it's ease of use as well as functionality.
OBTW The Case Length Gage will determine if your cartridge cases will fit in your chamber easily as well as some of these gages will check your cases O.A.L. depending on which brand that you purchase.
Hope That this helps.
Just my 2 cents worth !

 

[MNbogboy]

I think you are exactly right. Unless I can figure out a way to resize this part of the case, either Cooper will have to fix the chamber or I will have to be content using "one and done" brass.View attachment 184475

Ah...much better pic of affected area....
Better do the pick test....run a pointed metal wire to that point and feel for separation...looks completely resized too much...
Like 7rm brass i had tossed....
Check for separation....

IF head separation has been initiated, and it may have by the appearance in this picture, it may have started at the first firing when the brass was new.
Even with proper shoulder bump the second firing will always add some more thinning at the front of the web.
The next sizing may "bulge"/deform the thinned area. This brings us to the question somebody asked; will the two fired unsized brass chamber?
The "paper clip" pic test as mentioned may instantly reveal if this is the problem. Also a picture of the suspect brass before sizing and without Sharpie coloring may also give visual clues.

If there is no thinning evident and the unsized two fired brass chambers the problem can then be narrowed down to the sizing dies or the sizing operation/technique itself.

If it is the chamber in the rifle most likely the two fired brass nut in sizes brass would not rechamber (in all positions). Caused by oversized (egged) setup issues.

Do you have some pictures of two fired but in sizes brass?

Just some thoughts,
Randy

 

[lyle2231]

View attachment 184466

Contact cooper and include the pic! I'm willing to bet they can offer a solution.

 

[TommyBreaux]

It doesn't look like they make a small base body die for .270, but you said that the .30-06 would work? I know they are close to the same case and the sizing of the body of the case would be just fine, but would a .30-06 body die mess up the shoulders on a .270 case?

RCBS makes small base dies for the .270, I have one.

 

[Chuck32571]

I'd say its either your not trimming the case back to SAAMI specifications or you need to bump the shoulder back. Both are easy to fix by purchasing a trimmer (I use the Little Crow fast trimmer.) and the Redding Competition Shell Holder Set applicable to the 270 cartridge for bumping the shoulder back.

 

[22250imp]

I am having a problem with my Cooper rifle, .270 winchester, not being able to chamber brass that has been fired more than 2 times. I was wondering if someone could help me find a solution. It will chamber and fire factory ammo just fine. It will also chamber and fire my hand loads of brand new unfired brass just fine. It will also chamber and fire this same brass just fine when I have full length resized and reloaded it once. However, after the second firing and a second full length resizing, the brass will no longer fit properly in the chamber. It is too tight for the bolt to close without excessive force. It seems to me that even though I full length resize, the brass has nevertheless stretched out enough that it won't fit back into this chamber as normal. I have verified this by measuring all parts of the case with my calipers. Even after a full length resize, all parts of the case are still slightly larger than new, unfired brass. Can you help me understand what is going on? I have never had this problem before in any of my other rifles. I have been using both Norma and Hornady brass. Same problem with both brass. I presume that the chamber in this Cooper rifle is cut very tight? It also looks like standard full length sizing dies do not reduce the brass back to the actual size of factory ammo or unfired brass? This would be very disappointing if I can't reload brass for this gun. Has anyone seen this problem before? Also, is there a body die or something that will resize the brass back to the same size and measurements of brand new brass?

If you have an extra shell holder take it to a grinder or the side of a chop saw blade and take just a smidgen off the top surface and try that. If it helps but still not there, take a smidgen more. May not be the most kosher way to do things but worked for me. Was having the same problem.

 

[RYEWSKY25284]

I am having a problem with my Cooper rifle, .270 winchester, not being able to chamber brass that has been fired more than 2 times. I was wondering if someone could help me find a solution. It will chamber and fire factory ammo just fine. It will also chamber and fire my hand loads of brand new unfired brass just fine. It will also chamber and fire this same brass just fine when I have full length resized and reloaded it once. However, after the second firing and a second full length resizing, the brass will no longer fit properly in the chamber. It is too tight for the bolt to close without excessive force. It seems to me that even though I full length resize, the brass has nevertheless stretched out enough that it won't fit back into this chamber as normal. I have verified this by measuring all parts of the case with my calipers. Even after a full length resize, all parts of the case are still slightly larger than new, unfired brass. Can you help me understand what is going on? I have never had this problem before in any of my other rifles. I have been using both Norma and Hornady brass. Same problem with both brass. I presume that the chamber in this Cooper rifle is cut very tight? It also looks like standard full length sizing dies do not reduce the brass back to the actual size of factory ammo or unfired brass? This would be very disappointing if I can't reload brass for this gun. Has anyone seen this problem before? Also, is there a body die or something that will resize the brass back to the same size and measurements of brand new brass?

How hot is your reload? About 30 years ago I was shooting & reloading a .257WBY and could only get 3 reloads out the brass. I my case it wasn't trim length. It was the belt line getting blown-out due to hot load...that was the pet load for bugholes. And, long story short, 3 reloading was all I could get. So, I sold it. Kind'a wish I'd kept it.

 

[26Reload]

Oh Timotheus...where are't though........lol.....you created this...please step back into it.....

 

[jarnold37]

I would compare this to a once fired factory load but at least my initial though based on your measurements is that resizing isn't the issue, the problem is your loads are WAY too hot. That much case head expansion at the Web is a REALLY bad thing.

Page 85 is the Saami specs for the 270. If your measurements are accurate your brass is starting out way undersized but you also should not be getting .0-06-7 expansion on the head but the brass will expand to fit the chamber even with modest loads.

https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/ANSI-SAAMI-Z299.4-CFR-Approved-2015-12-14-Posting-Copy.pdf

I would compare this to a once fired factory load but at least my initial though based on your measurements is that resizing isn't the issue, the problem is your loads are WAY too hot. That much case head expansion at the Web is a REALLY bad thing.

Page 85 is the Saami specs for the 270. If your measurements are accurate your brass is starting out way undersized but you also should not be getting .0-06-7 expansion on the head but the brass will expand to fit the chamber even with modest loads.

https://saami.org/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/ANSI-SAAMI-Z299.4-CFR-Approved-2015-12-14-Posting-Copy.pdf

I may be way off here, but if a tailstock is perfectly zeroed with the rotation of the spindle the back of the chamber will be "fat". Cutting the chamber to minimum specs refers to length, or depth of the chamber. Some gunsmiths show a video of the newly cut chamber with a plug guage inserted in back of chamber with a tight fit. My first chamber job resulted in a chamber that allowed rhe case to expand 007 right above the web. Problems are even worse with a belted case. Simple to determine. Just measure back of chamber. My tailstock after aligning laterally was .0029 high x's 2 equalled chamber .007 big at back, even though barrel was indicated to 1-2 tenths.

 

[Sgt. grizz]

I had the same problem recently my dies were not Full length sizing causing the webbing to expand too much. Also I would check the overall length of the case your next might be a little too long

 

[freddiej]

Oh, So many opinions and bits and pieces of truth to this problem. I had a rifle like this. Infact I still own that rifle. it is a Tikka 270 Win. YES, I would check the length of the neck/brass after resizing, due to the first firing and second are the largest growth of your brass. I think the brass might need trimming as well as annealing. I had to buy a small base die, I need to anneal after ever other reloading or the brass just springs back to just a bit to large to go in the chamber. I have found I have collected these kinds of rifles all over my collection, not only my Tikka, but Winchesters and Remingtons. in calibers ranging from 17 Rem to 338 W/M. I usually just anneal and use a small base die when they will not go in the chamber. I also leave the cases in the resizing die for about 5 to 10 seconds. I allow the springy tendency of the brass to relax and take a set in the die. the brass does not spring back as far. also I stage size the brass, first in a normal sizing die and then a small base.
I have also found that recently Ruger American and Savage rifles are coming with 0.000" to -0.002" SAAMI chambers. That is dead minimum and 0.002" under SAAMI minimum headspaced chambers. Most recently a Savage came in with a -0.001" chamber. I measured the brass after he had resized it. -0.0005" under SAAMI min and it still would not chamber without a fight. the rifle went back to savage with a note that the headspace gauge used was a bit too short. we will see what happens when it returns.

 

[azsugarbear]

You are all wrong! It's obviously the COVID-19 virus at work here. The glands around the base of the brass are swollen which won't allow the brass to chamber. Give it lots of fluid and alternate between aspirin and tylenol to control the temperature. It should eventually recover and allow itself to be chambered - unless it's old brass. Then you will just have to chuck the brass and start all over.

Sorry about the rant - at home and bored to death. Obviously.

 

[timotheius]

PLEASE READ:
If You measure the head with a pair of quality micrometers you will find your cases head dimension is most likely +.002" +.005" Over Size. This can be attributed to several issiues which I won't go into here, however you will solve your initial problem by following along.
Initially start with virgin brass and set aside all your fired brass so that you can make a fair assumption of the following procedure !
Apparently your brass is conforming to your chambers dimensions which may be slightly larger but still within Sammi Specs..
The solution is to reduce the brass at it's base to where it will chamber in your rifle easily.
First do you own a cartridge Case length gage in .270 Caliber?
If not please I suggest that you purchase one in this caliber. (see below)
Next purchase a Redding body die. (caliber specific)
Now if you want to bump you shoulder at the same time killing two birds with one stone purchase the Redding #1 competition shell holder set.
Combining these two items will allow you to fit brass cases
(A) To completely ensure a perfect case to chamber fit.
(B) It will bump size your shoulder back -.002" or more as you see fit. all in one continuous operation .
The best part is you do not need to waste your valuable time playing around with your FL resizing die in order to get your correct shoulder bump.
Simply by setting the Redding Body Die ONCE , and use of the Redding Competition Shell Holder Set #1 plus the stepped and numbered shell holders included in this set along with your rifle you will establish a custom fit that works in your action.
(You can U-Tube for videos on this)
Now another plus is that you can use this same Redding # 1 Competition Shell Holder Set on Any and I repeat Any Caliber Case that is in this family ie, . 22-250, 243, 6.5 Creedmoor, 270, 308. & 3 0 -06 + any wildcat cartridges using this parent base
( NOTE: You Must FL resize your your cases, and trim to length as per your norm first before using the body die)
By using this system You No Longer will you be plagued by rounds that will not feed in your rifle !
I use this Redding Body Die Combination as stated above on every rifle that I shoot ( most fortunately fall into the category #1 Redding Shell Holder Set) and can attest to it's ease of use as well as functionality.
OBTW The Case Length Gage will determine if your cartridge cases will fit in your chamber easily as well as some of these gages will check your cases O.A.L. depending on which brand that you purchase.
Hope That this helps.
Just my 2 cents worth !

Will a standard body die size the base of the case to where I need, or do I need a small base body die for that?

 

[BountyHunter]

Will a standard body die size the base of the case to where I need, or do I need a small base body die for that?

Maybe, depends on the die. As I said they vary in dimensions. IF you can borrow someone elses die, try it from different mftr. BTW, what brand die are you using? However a small base die WILL work.