Breaking/Sighting in Hunting Rifle

This thread's irony is comical. The op does not believe in barrel break in, yet wants to know how many shots before the barrel is broke in.... Perplexing. Why waste all that ammo.. shoot 3 shots to sight in and hunt... now you can harvest 1497 critters compared to 1480 animals had you broken in properly. But you've already answered your question w/ your excerpt of which you've based your opinion, why not follow it?.... 100-200

To be worried about shortening barrel life in a hunting rifle that is not a notorious barrel burning caliber (comparibly speaking) is a bit over bearing. I bet my house you will not hunt enough to shoot out your barrel simply b/c you did a proper barrel break in.

If your cleaning procedure is sound you'll be fine, but if you're shoving the walmart hoppe's 3piece cleaning rod down your bore w/ out a guide and a steel jag then yeah, you're probably gonna do some harm. For a proper breaking.. If it's good enough for BR's, its good enough for me.

You plan on hunting out to 600yds? Would you rather shoot w/ 6" accuracy or 3" in perfect conditions that is..?? It just blows me away how one could be so willing to accept medocrity when excellence is achievable... even before you've sent one bullet down range. FYI... 6" accuracy and a slight breeze at 600 on an african animal will leave you tracking for days.

You said pretty much everything I wanted to say when this thread was first posted...but I decided to keep my mouth shut.
 
This thread's irony is comical. The op does not believe in barrel break in, yet wants to know how many shots before the barrel is broke in.... Perplexing. Why waste all that ammo.. shoot 3 shots to sight in and hunt... now you can harvest 1497 critters compared to 1480 animals had you broken in properly. But you've already answered your question w/ your excerpt of which you've based your opinion, why not follow it?.... 100-200

To be worried about shortening barrel life in a hunting rifle that is not a notorious barrel burning caliber (comparibly speaking) is a bit over bearing. I bet my house you will not hunt enough to shoot out your barrel simply b/c you did a proper barrel break in.

If your cleaning procedure is sound you'll be fine, but if you're shoving the walmart hoppe's 3piece cleaning rod down your bore w/ out a guide and a steel jag then yeah, you're probably gonna do some harm. For a proper breaking.. If it's good enough for BR's, its good enough for me.

You plan on hunting out to 600yds? Would you rather shoot w/ 6" accuracy or 3" in perfect conditions that is..?? It just blows me away how one could be so willing to accept medocrity when excellence is achievable... even before you've sent one bullet down range. FYI... 6" accuracy and a slight breeze at 600 on an african animal will leave you tracking for days.

I don't believe in a cleaning method of break in a barrel, but I do believe when the velocity and accuracy settles down, that's when you know it's broken in. kids these days... Don't even read the original post, just the title of the thread
 
I guess I missed it - the answer I mean. How many rounds ARE required in order to achieve a Sako 85 7mm rem mag barrel to the point that it's "broken in enough"?

Was it somewhere between 1 and 200 rounds???
 
I guess I missed it - the answer I mean. How many rounds ARE required in order to achieve a Sako 85 7mm rem mag barrel to the point that it's "broken in enough"?

Was it somewhere between 1 and 200 rounds???

I think it's sort of like the old woodchuck question...

Q: How much wood could a woodchuck chuck, if a woodchuck could chuck wood?

A: As much wood as a woodchuck could chuck, if a woodchuck could chuck wood...
 
I guess I missed it - the answer I mean. How many rounds ARE required in order to achieve a Sako 85 7mm rem mag barrel to the point that it's "broken in enough"?

Was it somewhere between 1 and 200 rounds???


YES, it takes exactly between 1 and 200 Winchester super X factory ammo or, to be precise, any other factory ammo (or handload). At this point your sako 85 7mm remington mag barrel should be broken in for hunting purposes only. Please do not confuse this procedure with any other rifles, ammo, or purposes other than those listed above as barrel life may suffer resulting in delicious tag soup. Please consult your owner's manual or your local LRH forum which ever comes to mind first, or second. Enjoy.
 
I guess I should have taken some of the sage advice and just stayed out of the debate but I like a good debate and felt some discussion would be beneficial.

As to the exact round count, I don't think there is a number that anyone can share.

Earlier I made reference to a factory rifle that just wouldn't shoot so I decided to do a break in and see if it would help. this rifle had somewhere between 200 and 400 rounds through it with very infrequent cleaning.

So looking at it in a totally different light. if I shot 20 rounds and then cleaned before the next 20 shots, it should take 400 rounds to have the same effect as a clean and shoot procedure for 20 rounds to be broke in.

And to be truthful, I probably didn't clean it as well as I do during break in now.

What I found was that the copper fouling actually protects the barrel and prevents the bullet from making contact with the barrel allowing the bullet to smooth out any machine marks, and the carbon actually scored the barrel and eroded the throat.

So if the poster is happy with how the rifle shoots, don't worry about break in just shoot and enjoy.

J E CUSTOM
 
YES, it takes exactly between 1 and 200 Winchester super X factory ammo or, to be precise, any other factory ammo (or handload). At this point your sako 85 7mm remington mag barrel should be broken in for hunting purposes only. Please do not confuse this procedure with any other rifles, ammo, or purposes other than those listed above as barrel life may suffer resulting in delicious tag soup. Please consult your owner's manual or your local LRH forum which ever comes to mind first, or second. Enjoy.

L:DL!
 
"What I found was that the copper fouling actually protects the barrel and prevents the bullet from making contact with the barrel allowing the bullet to smooth out any machine marks, and the carbon actually scored the barrel and eroded the throat."



How can a copper bullet (softer alloy) smooth out machining marks down the barrel? Let's say at 18"-26" of the barrel?
 
How can a copper bullet (softer alloy) smooth out machining marks down the barrel? Let's say at 18"-26" of the barrel?


Friction and heat from the velocity of the bullet traveling down the bore, and more heat from the powder burning... Friction causes heat and erodes metal... For example, grinder wheel vs. steel tube. Which is the same principle as to why those David Tubbs fire-lapping bullets work so well.

However, I think what JE was referring to, was parts of the copper jacket that are torn off from machining marks, filling in said machining marks in the rifling, creating a smoother surface for the next bullets to ride along, until it starts building up too much, which will throw your shots down range. Then it's time to clean it good, and start over re-fouling your bore with a couple fouling shots at the range, and you're good to go again.

If copper jacketed bullets are not capable of smoothing out machining marks, then why do we even have throat erosion, and rifling erosion in steel barrels? Why would anybody ever need to re-barrel a rifle, other than to change caliber? Nobody would ever have to worry about barrel life. Think about it that way. :cool:
 
at work , so i am blocked going to Germans blog. Riflemans journal. quoting him .... Barrel breakin in its entirety ..... " "
 
goodgrouper's experiences and thoughts are similar to mine - as expressed in this linked Thread. Not that this means he and I are 100% correct. Just saying my observations resulted in similar conclusions over the past 7 years. Of course goodgrouper has gone thru many more barrels than I - thus he has much more 1st hand experience.

Should my custom rifle maker do one shot one clean on new barrel test?

Here's the crux of it. There's a photo provided in the linked Thread.

One thing that no "non-believer" has ever been able to explain to me is this:

If barrel breakin is a waste of time, how come copper-ed patches diminish in number as the process goes along? Why does it take (for example) 9 patches for shots 1 thru 7, then suddenly go to 3 patches on shot 8? Then go to two patches on shot 10?

Here is a complete sequence set of patches used to break-in a Bartlein 338 barrel recently. Solvent used was Boretech Eliminator and the patches were wrapped around an aluminum/nylon brush to avoid "false reads". The first number in each column is the sequence shot(s) and the second number is the patch number in that sequence.

HERE's where he provided a photo of his cleaning patches.

As you can see from the pic, the copper came out of the barrel easier after the second sequence and I felt like this barrel was probably broke in at that point (good barrel!). But I continued shooting one shot and cleaning up to sequence 6 where I fired two bullets. Sequence 7 and all thereafter were two shot sequences. Sequence 7 patch #3 was cleaner than second sequence patch #3 despite it being a two shot sequence. So obviously, something happened during this test that was clearly indicating that the copper was either coming out easier, or there was less copper to come out. Or both.

Now, I have run this test with every barrel I've worked with for the last ten years or so and they all have shown a similar progression of decreasing blue patches. However, the factory barrels produce bluer patches for much longer than the custom barrels (again, proof that something is happening) and it can be quantified. I can bet you $100 that I can blindly take a custom barrel and a factory barrel and tell you which is which simply by how "easy" they break-in and I won't lose a penny.

Now, to quantify how much of a difference break-in makes in the grand scheme of accuracy, I don't honestly know. Maybe it only makes the barrel .0000001% more accurate then just taking it and shooting it right off the bat such as Gene does. But, barrels that have been broken in by this method seem to clean a bit easier in the first third of their lives (before serious throat cracking appears) and also seem to "settle down" a bit quicker. Maybe it's just my imagination with that, but my eyes are seeing the above picture with perfect clarity.

BTW, this has already been said in previous threads on this topic, but most barrel manufacturers still recommend some type of break in. So maybe I'm not the only one who still "believes"?


There's another post in the thread that explains his logic on the benefits of barrel break-in.
 
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