Breaking/Sighting in Hunting Rifle

[FEENIX]

Thanks for the input. Check this out:
As a barrel maker I have looked in thousands of new and used barrels
with a bore scope and I will tell you that if every one followed the
prescribed break in method A very large number would do more harm than
help. The reason you hear of the help in accuracy is because if you
chamber barrel with a reamer that has a dull throater instead of cutting
clean sharp rifling it smears a burr up on the down wind side of the
rifling. It takes from 1 to 2 hundred rounds to burn this bur out and
the rifle to settle down and shoot its best. Any one who chambers rifle
barrels has tolerances on how dull to let the reamer get and factories
let them go longer than any competent smithe would. Another tidbit to
consider, Take a 300Win Mag. that has a life expectancy of 1000 rounds.
Use 10% of it up with your break in procedure for ever 10 barrels the
barrel maker makes he has to make one more just to take care of the
break in. no wonder barrel makers like to see this. Now when you flame
me on this please include what you think is happening to the inside of
your barrel during the break in that is helping you.

Gale McMillan
NBSRA IBS,FCSA and NRA Life Member


I was talking about his comment that after a certain number of rounds the barrel settles in and starts shooting its best... I didn't mean my question in the "cleaning the barrel break in sense".

I've seen that before ... does he still make barrels?

 

[goebs66]

I've seen that before ... does he still make barrels?

Im not really sure... I think so though

 

[J E Custom]

Now when you flame me on this please include what you think is happening to the inside of
your barrel during the break in that is helping you.


Sorry you think I was "Flaming you" I was not.

You ask a question and I gave you my opinion based on my experiences.

The whole reason for breaking in a barrel is to let the bullet finish conditioning the barrel and smooth out any imperfection or machine marks left after lapping. If you leave the carbon fouling in a barrel you can also see the damage it can do. (Carbon is much harder than barrel steels and will scratch or wear the barrel and ruin a perfectly good lapping. Also the better the lapping the faster the break in. I use a bore scope (Not a bore light) and not only can see the effects of a proper break in but you/I can also feel the bore getting smoother as the break in proceeds.

It is not unusual for a proper break in to clean up with one solvent brushing and One patching
and the second solvent brushing does not show any more copper fouling left in the barrel.

If you have already made up your mind, why ask the question in the first place especially if you get upset if someone disagrees with you.

Barrel makers don't recommend something that will destroy there barrels sooner so they can sell you another., because if they did they would not sell many barrel if they did not hold up. In fact, When both McMillan brothers were together they made good products. But when they split up something happened to there barrels and I stopped using them. I don't want to see anyone go out of business, but if quality goes down so do sales.

Some custom barrel makers say you don't need to do a break in on there barrels because they are hand lapped. they don't say not to or that it cant help.Others have a recommended barrel break in procedure for there barrel. so who is right?

If you ever do a break in you will feel and see the improvement in accuracy and cleaning within 8 to 10 shots. Break in will not reduce barrel life in fact it will add life if proper cleaning is done frequently.

Again, sorry if I offended you I just answered your question.

J E CUSTOM

 

[goebs66]

Now when you flame me on this please include what you think is happening to the inside of
your barrel during the break in that is helping you.


Sorry you think I was "Flaming you" I was not.

You ask a question and I gave you my opinion based on my experiences.

The whole reason for breaking in a barrel is to let the bullet finish conditioning the barrel and smooth out any imperfection or machine marks left after lapping. If you leave the carbon fouling in a barrel you can also see the damage it can do. (Carbon is much harder than barrel steels and will scratch or wear the barrel and ruin a perfectly good lapping. Also the better the lapping the faster the break in. I use a bore scope (Not a bore light) and not only can see the effects of a proper break in but you/I can also feel the bore getting smoother as the break in proceeds.

It is not unusual for a proper break in to clean up with one solvent brushing and One patching
and the second solvent brushing does not show any more copper fouling left in the barrel.

If you have already made up your mind, why ask the question in the first place especially if you get upset if someone disagrees with you.

Barrel makers don't recommend something that will destroy there barrels sooner so they can sell you another., because if they did they would not sell many barrel if they did not hold up. In fact, When both McMillan brothers were together they made good products. But when they split up something happened to there barrels and I stopped using them. I don't want to see anyone go out of business, but if quality goes down so do sales.

Some custom barrel makers say you don't need to do a break in on there barrels because they are hand lapped. they don't say not to or that it cant help.Others have a recommended barrel break in procedure for there barrel. so who is right?

If you ever do a break in you will feel and see the improvement in accuracy and cleaning within 8 to 10 shots. Break in will not reduce barrel life in fact it will add life if proper cleaning is done frequently.

Again, sorry if I offended you I just answered your question.

J E CUSTOM

The flaming part of my post was a quote from Gale McMillan. I appreciated your advice man! Thanks! But I was more so asking about a round count before the barrel accurizes... Rather than a break in procudure. Thanks for the help though!i definitely see your point

 

[Laelkhunter]

J E CUSTOM, well said. I have no where near the experience you have, but I know enough to agree with everything you say. I feel that if you are going to cause excessive wear to a barrel by doing a 10 or 20 shot break in period, the barrel is crap to begin with. A break in period should not reduce the life of the barrel, and I have to sight in the rifle anyway when I get it. I can do that while breaking in the barrel, and cleaning it to remove the carbon and copper before firing another shot.
If the OP is dead set against a break in, I agree with those who have said it is his right, although I feel he would get better service from the barrel, and prolong it's useful life by proper break in, and not taking away from it's useful life by firing the break in shots. JMHO, worth about .02

 

[FEENIX]

Im not really sure... I think so though

The barrel making part of the business was acquired by Bill Wiseman (About « Bill Wiseman) in 1983.

 

[7magcreedmoor]

After reading all the posts on this thread, I will say this:

Break it in however you like, I am not looking to add to that argument. If you are looking for a number of shots fired the best way to answer that question is probably this- when the velocity becomes stable.

When I am starting a new barrel, I shoot every shot over the chrony during break in and load development. With every barrel so far, I've seen the velocity increase a bit with the same load as the barrel becomes seasoned. When the average velocity from string to string stops increasing, then I call that barrel "broken in" and am content to create the drop card/custom turret/program the pocket calculator (whichever method you prefer for the field) and go hunting.

 

[goebs66]

After reading all the posts on this thread, I will say this:

Break it in however you like, I am not looking to add to that argument. If you are looking for a number of shots fired the best way to answer that question is probably this- when the velocity becomes stable.

When I am starting a new barrel, I shoot every shot over the chrony during break in and load development. With every barrel so far, I've seen the velocity increase a bit with the same load as the barrel becomes seasoned. When the average velocity from string to string stops increasing, then I call that barrel "broken in" and am content to create the drop card/custom turret/program the pocket calculator (whichever method you prefer for the field) and go hunting.

Finally someone that understands what I was asking!! This answers my question!!!! Thanks boss!

 

[FEENIX]

Finally someone that understands what I was asking!! This answers my question!!!! Thanks boss!

Believe me, everyone that responded to your post know exactly what breaking in a barrel entails.

 

[Laelkhunter]

Believe me, everyone that responded to your post know exactly what breaking in a barrel entails.

I think his original post was stating that he does not wish to do a "barrel break-in procedure" because he doesn't believe in it, and was trying to find out if not doing so would result in a satisfactory barrel for hunting conditions, and not match grade, pin point accuracy ( I think)..

 

[goebs66]

I think his original post was stating that he does not wish to do a "barrel break-in procedure" because he doesn't believe in it, and was trying to find out if not doing so would result in a satisfactory barrel for hunting conditions, and not match grade, pin point accuracy ( I think)..

Exactly! I was simply asking how to make sure my barrel is in hunting condition. AKA I was asking how many rounds to put through for the barrel to be reliable!

 

[FEENIX]

Deleted!

 

[FEENIX]

Exactly! I was simply asking how to make sure my barrel is in hunting condition. AKA I was asking how many rounds to put through for the barrel to be reliable!

But that's exactly what you've been provided except for the actual count you are hoping for. Nobody can provide you an exact or approximate count because of the too many variables.

C&P from https://kriegerbarrels.com/faq#breakin

BREAK-IN & CLEANING:

With any premium barrel that has been finish lapped -- such as your Krieger Barrel --, the lay or direction of the finish is in the direction of the bullet travel, so fouling is minimal compared to a barrel with internal tooling marks. This is true of any properly finish-lapped barrel regardless of how it is rifled. If it is not finish-lapped, there will be reamer marks left in the bore that are directly across the direction of the bullet travel. This occurs even in a button-rifled barrel as the button cannot completely iron out these reamer marks.

Because the lay of the finish is in the direction of the bullet travel, very little is done to the bore during break-in, but the throat is another story. When your barrel is chambered, by necessity there are reamer marks left in the throat that are across the lands, i.e. across the direction of the bullet travel. In a new barrel they are very distinct; much like the teeth on a very fine file.

When the bullet is forced into the throat, copper dust is removed from the jacket material and released into the gas which at this temperature and pressure is actually a plasma. The copper dust is vaporized in this plasma and is carried down the barrel. As the gas expands and cools, the copper comes out of suspension and is deposited in the bore. This makes it appear as if the source of the fouling is the bore when it is actually for the most part the new throat.

If this copper is allowed to stay in the bore, and subsequent bullets and deposits are fired over it, copper which adheres well to itself, will build up quickly and may be difficult to remove later. So when we break in a barrel, our goal is to get the throat "polished without allowing copper to build up in the bore. This is the reasoning for the fire-one-shot-and-clean procedure.

Every barrel will vary slightly in how many rounds they take to break in. For example a chrome moly barrel may take longer to break in than stainless steel because it is more abrasion resistant even though it is a similar hardness. Also chrome moly has a little more of an affinity for copper than stainless steel so it will usually show a little more color if you are using a chemical cleaner. Rim Fire barrels can take an extremely long time to break in, sometimes requiring several hundred rounds or more. But cleaning can be lengthened to every 25-50 rounds. The break-in procedure and the cleaning procedure are really the same except for the frequency. Remember the goal is to get or keep the barrel clean while breaking in the throat with bullets being fired over it.

Finally, the best way to tell if the barrel is broken in is to observe the patches; i.e. when the fouling is reduced. This is better than some set number of cycles of shoot and clean as many owners report practically no fouling after the first few shots, and more break-in would be pointless. Conversely, if more is required, a set number would not address that either. Besides, cleaning is not a completely benign procedure so it should be done carefully and no more than necessary.

You've been provided very sound advice by folks that have far more experience than I do and are always willing and able to extend that helping hand. What you do with that advice is entirely up to you.

 

[ohiohunter]

This thread's irony is comical. The op does not believe in barrel break in, yet wants to know how many shots before the barrel is broke in.... Perplexing. Why waste all that ammo.. shoot 3 shots to sight in and hunt... now you can harvest 1497 critters compared to 1480 animals had you broken in properly. But you've already answered your question w/ your excerpt of which you've based your opinion, why not follow it?.... 100-200

To be worried about shortening barrel life in a hunting rifle that is not a notorious barrel burning caliber (comparibly speaking) is a bit over bearing. I bet my house you will not hunt enough to shoot out your barrel simply b/c you did a proper barrel break in.

If your cleaning procedure is sound you'll be fine, but if you're shoving the walmart hoppe's 3piece cleaning rod down your bore w/ out a guide and a steel jag then yeah, you're probably gonna do some harm. For a proper breaking.. If it's good enough for BR's, its good enough for me.

You plan on hunting out to 600yds? Would you rather shoot w/ 6" accuracy or 3" in perfect conditions that is..?? It just blows me away how one could be so willing to accept medocrity when excellence is achievable... even before you've sent one bullet down range. FYI... 6" accuracy and a slight breeze at 600 on an african animal will leave you tracking for days.