Boosting BC of commerical bullets.....

[Swamplord]

Would you be willing to share your method for coating the bullets. I am familiar with WS2 grease. Did you manage to obtain powder and what is your source ?

I've been playing with this stuff since the late 90's early 2000's....... a good friend was a benchrest shooter and gunsmith, he loved competing with 22 PPC and 6mm PPC BR guns he built himself,
he used to tell me the only way to improve a 6mm Berger was to coat it with Danzac, (WS2 powdered tungsten disulfide) I was using CT Ballistic Silvertips with amazing accuracy out of my factory hunting rifles then started using tunsgsten disulfide powder to coat all my bullets.....

I purchased 2 lbs of the stuff back then and 1 tsp will coat about 1000 bullets, it goes a long way.. the old timer passed away 2 years ago, I'm sure you can hit somebody up at BR Central and find it there, the BR crowd has the most experience with it, I'm just a hunter in Alaska that likes to shoot tiny groups at high velocity and so far and for so long it has worked very well for me...
I made a few reports on it back in 2004 but it fell on deaf ears as most were using moly at the time and didn't particularly care for my results... it was asked again recently and I updated the info here ....

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f28/lazzeroni-warbird-105398/

 

[MudRunner2005]

Hey Kirby, would it be possible to do this with the 7mm 180gr Berger VLD's? If not, that's cool, but I am just curious what that would look like, and if it would help out, even though those bullets already retain just a high BC and long-distance stabilization.

Also, would it be possible to try it on a 7mm 160gr Accubond?

 

[Fiftydriver]

Kirby

Since bearing surface consistency is critical to downrange accuracy, it follows that those bullets that control this parameter the best would be the most accurate. Is Berger then the most accurate of the major bullet makers at long range?

They are one of the best for sure. Its simple to get a baring surface measuring device however and sort your bullets of any make which will tighten up down range consistancy. What you see downrange with baring surface variation is vertical variation in impact. Sorting your bullets by baring surface length will tighten up this vertical variation downrange.

 

[Fiftydriver]

Hey Kirby, would it be possible to do this with the 7mm 180gr Berger VLD's? If not, that's cool, but I am just curious what that would look like, and if it would help out, even though those bullets already retain just a high BC and long-distance stabilization.

Also, would it be possible to try it on a 7mm 160gr Accubond?

Yes but I am not sure you would get any real benefit because the Berger VLDs use a more aggressive ogive design then these tips do. Plus, you may get into some serious over expansion issues as well with the Berger bullet.

I will be testing the 160 gr Accubond very soon with these tips and it should work great. Another option is the Sierra 175 gr SPBT and Sierra 175 and 180 gr SMK bullets which are known to be a bit lacking in expansion at long range, these tips should really boost BC on those 7mm bullets and improve long range expansion as well.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Yes but I am not sure you would get any real benefit because the Berger VLDs use a more aggressive ogive design then these tips do. Plus, you may get into some serious over expansion issues as well with the Berger bullet.

I will be testing the 160 gr Accubond very soon with these tips and it should work great. Another option is the Sierra 175 gr SPBT and Sierra 175 and 180 gr SMK bullets which are known to be a bit lacking in expansion at long range, these tips should really boost BC on those 7mm bullets and improve long range expansion as well.

Thanks for the info Kirb....You tha man! Let me know your findings with those 7mm 160 AB's in a 7mmRM. That is what I shoot for whitetails if I don't shoot my .257 Wby Mag. Also, if they work good and you could make a few, let me know how much it would cost to have a box of 50 done....I already have about 6-7 new unopened boxes of them laying around that I could send you 1 of, for having this done.

 

[Fiftydriver]

Thanks for the info Kirb....You tha man! Let me know your findings with those 7mm 160 AB's in a 7mmRM. That is what I shoot for whitetails if I don't shoot my .257 Wby Mag. Also, if they work good and you could make a few, let me know how much it would cost to have a box of 50 done....I already have about 6-7 new unopened boxes of them laying around that I could send you 1 of, for having this done.

I shoot the 160 gr Accubond out of my personal 7mm Allen Magnum as well so will be testing them in that rifle. Standard 160s are clipping out at a somewhat reduced load of 3450 fps since this rifle is based on a Rem 700 receiver.

That same chambering in my Raptor rifles will do 100 fps more and show less pressure then the loads I am using now in the Rem 700. Anyway, I am hoping to see BCs jump into the mid .6 range with the tip added to the 160 gr Accubond. A .650 BC bullet clipping along at nearly 3500 fps always puts a smile on my face!!!

 

[MudRunner2005]

Yeah, I don't load my 7Mags quite that hot..... LOL I do load my 7STW a little wildcatty sometimes, when load testing.

What's your personal opinion, since I got you on the horn.....A precision whitetail and shooting rifle capable at 1000, but will mostly shoot 100-600 majority of it's life......280 Ackley Improved, or another 7STW? I'm in a pickle trying to figure out which one I want. I love shooting my STW, but brass is as expensive as .280 AI, but you get 1/2 as much for the money (25 vs 50 pcs). Plus getting good Nosler brass is hard for the STW right now. I can still find .280 AI 40* Nosler brass...

I have had my STW for 11 years now, and know it fairly well. I am mainly interested in the .280AI b/c it is a non-magnum .284 with magnum ballistics. So, any info is greatly appreciated.

 

[Kiwi Greg]

Very interesting Kirby, nice to see some one else mucking around with projectiles

 

[Fiftydriver]

Yeah, I don't load my 7Mags quite that hot..... LOL I do load my 7STW a little wildcatty sometimes, when load testing.

What's your personal opinion, since I got you on the horn.....A precision whitetail and shooting rifle capable at 1000, but will mostly shoot 100-600 majority of it's life......280 Ackley Improved, or another 7STW? I'm in a pickle trying to figure out which one I want. I love shooting my STW, but brass is as expensive as .280 AI, but you get 1/2 as much for the money (25 vs 50 pcs). Plus getting good Nosler brass is hard for the STW right now. I can still find .280 AI 40* Nosler brass...

I have had my STW for 11 years now, and know it fairly well. I am mainly interested in the .280AI b/c it is a non-magnum .284 with magnum ballistics. So, any info is greatly appreciated.

This might suprise some but I am not a huge fan of Nolser brass. Love their bullets, not their brass. Not that its bad but I personally think its very costly for what you get and spending a bit of time on the loading bench will get you as good of brass using Rem or Win brand cases.

That said, for 0 to 600 yard shooting, either would work great, 280 offers longer barrel life but the STW offers less worry about the wind out to 600, no question.

The 280 AI will match most factory loaded ammo in the 7mm Rem Mag with same bullet weights but thats because most factory loaded 7mm Rem Mag loads are down loaded to make the 7mm STW or 7mm RUM look better then they are. In reality, if you handload, the 7mm Rem Mag will do anything the 7mm Wby Mag can do so it will run a solid 150 fps over the 280 AI with good handloads. Still the 280 AI is very potent for a 0.470 diameter case head chambering and great barrel life. In the end, not a bad choice between the two. I tend to error on the higher performance level personally but I know someone to replace barrels if thats needed.....

 

[Fiftydriver]

Very interesting Kirby, nice to see some one else mucking around with projectiles

I needed another project...............

 

[MudRunner2005]

This might suprise some but I am not a huge fan of Nolser brass. Love their bullets, not their brass. Not that its bad but I personally think its very costly for what you get and spending a bit of time on the loading bench will get you as good of brass using Rem or Win brand cases.

That said, for 0 to 600 yard shooting, either would work great, 280 offers longer barrel life but the STW offers less worry about the wind out to 600, no question.

The 280 AI will match most factory loaded ammo in the 7mm Rem Mag with same bullet weights but thats because most factory loaded 7mm Rem Mag loads are down loaded to make the 7mm STW or 7mm RUM look better then they are. In reality, if you handload, the 7mm Rem Mag will do anything the 7mm Wby Mag can do so it will run a solid 150 fps over the 280 AI with good handloads. Still the 280 AI is very potent for a 0.470 diameter case head chambering and great barrel life. In the end, not a bad choice between the two. I tend to error on the higher performance level personally but I know someone to replace barrels if thats needed.....

I didn't see that shamelss plug coming......

Seriously though, that's good info to hear. So basically for barre life, and case life, you recomment the 280AI over another STW. That's good, since that's the direction I was leaning towards, since I already have an STW.

Thanks for the info Kirby. And sorry for de-railing the thread. LOL

 

[Fiftydriver]

I didn't see that shamelss plug coming......

Seriously though, that's good info to hear. So basically for barre life, and case life, you recomment the 280AI over another STW. That's good, since that's the direction I was leaning towards, since I already have an STW.

Thanks for the info Kirby. And sorry for de-railing the thread. LOL

Yep, no problem.

 

[Swamplord]

Fifty,

Have you considered working on the Swift A-Frame ? that bullet seriously needs a bc upgrade,
If the A-Frame had the profile of at least the Scirrocco, I believe it would be the best hunting bullet on the planet.

I have a lot of experience with the 30 cal 180 gr and 200 gr both on game and targets, it is a very accurate bullet and performance on game is unmatched, every bull moose I shot with the A-Frames was impressive DRT, including brown and black bear....the 200 grain bullet "improved" would get a lot of my dollars !

I think the 275 gr 338 cal A-Frame bullet would also benefit greatly from your treatment and also make me a customer,
of course so would the 300 gr 375 cal...

 

[Fiftydriver]

Fifty,

Have you considered working on the Swift A-Frame ? that bullet seriously needs a bc upgrade,
If the A-Frame had the profile of at least the Scirrocco, I believe it would be the best hunting bullet on the planet.

I have a lot of experience with the 30 cal 180 gr and 200 gr both on game and targets, it is a very accurate bullet and performance on game is unmatched, every bull moose I shot with the A-Frames was impressive DRT, including brown and black bear....the 200 grain bullet "improved" would get a lot of my dollars !

I think the 275 gr 338 cal A-Frame bullet would also benefit greatly from your treatment and also make me a customer,
of course so would the 300 gr 375 cal...

I had not thought about the Swift A-Frame until you mentioned it but after looking at several of them, I beleive they would all work very well with this aluminum tip.

My only concern is that when the tip is driven into the core of the bullet, it may contact the partition inside the bullet and stress it. Not sure if this stress would be enough to rupture the partition but if it did, penetration would suffer significantly.

The profile of the bullet would match up with the aluminum tip pretty well I beleive and should add alot of length to the bullet, just like it does with the TSX bullets so there should be a sizable increase in BC.