Bigger is better theory or truth?

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by Jeremy R Snyder, Oct 19, 2019.


Help Support Long Range Hunting by donating:


  1. David Lindler

    David Lindler Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    105
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2018
    Unless you break the shoulders and spine, any deer can run no w matter u shoot them with. First pic.130 grain 270 sst on a 200 lb muley at 235 yards. Boom floop. Destroyed shoulder
    2nd picture, mulely shot at 90 yards. 338 lapua 300 grain Berger double lung hit.. Ran 45 yards before hitting a fence. Exit wound size of baseball. All vitals turned to jello.
    3rd pic, 180 Berger 7mm mag VLD deer still ran 10 yards. Deer should have never been able to take a step, but did.
    The main thing is bullet placement and large exit wounds for blood trails if they run.
     

    Attached Files:

    Bob Wright and Jeremy R Snyder like this.
  2. MagTen

    MagTen Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    146
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2012
    I have been very fortunate. Great percentage of my shot game have been either been DRT or just a few yards away. I have built guns recently for longer range shots. I would have to say in my experience the 35 Remington or like cartridges are the best short range rounds ever made. Shots that totally explode the heart are no guarantee of DRT. How much your animal is pumped up has a lot to do with how they run when dead.
     
  3. Johnslam

    Johnslam Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    68
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2019
    Terminal ballistics is like black magic.
    Sometimes what traditionally works doesn’t and sometimes it does.

    I’ve seen 243s drop em drt. Others have run 45 plus yards. Same bullet.

    My 308, has also dropped em drt and some have run. None over 45 yards though.

    Just last weekend I witnessed two separate does take a 35 Whelen to the boiler room at around 200. Both ran 50 plus.
     
  4. okie man

    okie man Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    553
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2013
    it’s funny when you hear, I shot a small doe with a sumpin’ Big magnum shooting a big ole bullet and it ran after the shot! That’s because there wasn’t enough tissue to upset the bullet and transfer the energy to the central nervous system. Tough well constructed bullets are fine for heavy bone and tissue but don’t always preform well on smaller framed game
     
    Alan lafin and Jeremy R Snyder like this.
  5. BigSky112

    BigSky112 Previously mtdonahue

    Messages:
    76
    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    If the shooter is as good as they think they are or claim to be, 1 shot behind the ear will be DRT with any legal hunting caliber. Unlike high shoulder shots, ZERO meat lose !
     
  6. SergeantD

    SergeantD Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    63
    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2019
    The 7mm-08 is a great deer caliber. IMO I believe even better than the 6mm everyone has fallen head over heals with. I have shot deer with a 7mm RM with Speer Grand Slams and have lost one. The only thing I could think of is that the bullet didn’t have enough time to expand or I was too close when I shot the deer. I agree with what your saying. I believe it comes down to the bullet type being used.
     
    Jeremy R Snyder likes this.
  7. Peregrine82

    Peregrine82 Active Member

    Messages:
    37
    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2014
    I find it is shot placement first of all. Bullet selection also has some merit as well. I have notice cartridges with higher velocities tend to turn the switch quicker in most cases.
     
    Jeremy R Snyder likes this.
  8. tooth doc

    tooth doc Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    79
    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2012
    I dont believe any shot other than spine or brain will always drop an animal immediately. Haveing said that, a shot through both shoulder , they dont go very far. Any mortal shot through lungs and or heart seems to come with animal running a bit.
     
    Bob Wright and Jeremy R Snyder like this.
  9. GLTaylor

    GLTaylor Member

    Messages:
    9
    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2019
    I agree with several. The only way to ensure an animal drops in his shadow is disrupt his nervous system. Like an earlier respondent I too lived in lowcountry South Carolina for many years. No limit and 4 1/2 month deer season. Quit keeping records at 200 bucks. Many does. I've also killed deer with everything from 22 to 7RUM. Head, neck or high spine = drt. Lung, heart , shoulder many if not most run some distance. I don't fool with neck meat so destruction doesn't matter to me.
     
    Jeremy R Snyder likes this.
  10. TangoOscarMike

    TangoOscarMike Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    57
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2019
    In Georgia we can kill I think 12 deer per season. I hit them wherever the best shot presents itself. I am not going to worry about ruining a shoulder or the neck meat if that is the best available shot. I think of it more as gaining hams and loins than losing a shoulder LOL. For most of my deer hunting with a rifle I have been shooting a 30-06 with 180 grain core-lokts. They always punch on through and I never have trouble following the buckets. When I lived up north it was shotgun only. There were many a deer that fell in front of that 870 with 00B. I never had a problem with it. Now the deer that I hit with buckshot pretty much dropped like a building imploding.
     
    Jeremy R Snyder likes this.
  11. Jeremy R Snyder

    Jeremy R Snyder Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    52
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2019
    Wish we could here in NY but our state is terrible. I get 1 buck tag a season and it's a lottery system for doe tags, you can get 2 if your lucky and in the right zone but I'm lucky to get 1 doe tag a season. Really sucks only being able to harvest 2 a year and any meat lost makes it even worse cause we go through it fast! It's illegal to use 00b in NY as well lol. 12 a year must be a riot!
     
  12. Bob Wright

    Bob Wright Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    241
    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2018
    So many variables today, it's mind boggling. I must say in my younger years the 30-06 dropped many animals from elk to deer on a 165 grain core lokt or a Hornady spitzer point flat base. Longest shot then was 365 yards. As I reach out further today with high accuracy, all that experience is less certain. I set up a rifle for a youth doe hunt with copper monos a "must" by game and fish request. It magnificently dropped a small deer with a 7mm 145 Barnes at 80-90 yards but cost 2 front shoulders in the process. We were taught 40 years ago to shoot behind the shoulder for less meat loss. Now that the blood shot meat is showing up, in the shoulders, that doesnt seem to be the perfect answer. Right now, we aim for vitals and if a blood track is the requirement or DRT, then that is our issue to deal with. No easy answer for an open country highly variable hunt in the southwest. Long or short, you work with the ammo that can deliver immediate lethality if the range is right. But the stars rarely line up that way. My vote is accuracy first and generally good expansion at a distance I try to understand from the manufacturers. Then I hope my shot does what I believe it will do. The variables are endless and the debate rages on.
     
    Jeremy R Snyder likes this.
  13. Mram10us

    Mram10us Well-Known Member LRH Team Member

    Messages:
    455
    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2019
    Seen two deer in the wild with broken jaws from the guy who tried to be a super sniper. Vitals are the safer and more humane route. Don’t have to hit the high shoulder. This is coming from a western high country guy though. My partner was from Wisconsin and took short shots his whole life. Different animal
     
  14. David Lindler

    David Lindler Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    105
    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2018
    Hard to beat the old 35. Have you tried the 200 grain Hornady flex tip in the lever reveloution load. Shoots flatter. Hits hard. Winchester just came out with 350 legend. Its basically a 35 Remington ballistics in a AR-15 Platform. All reviews so great results.