Berger load help or possible alternative?

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by teampete, Sep 26, 2011.

  1. teampete

    teampete Well-Known Member

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    Hey all I really need some help. I have a 300 win mag and am shooting 210 berger hunting vlds. I load them with WW brass, 75 gr of H1000, fed 215m primers. I tried seating them at different lengths like a thread on here says to do. The best group I can get at 100 yards is 1.5 inches. That is not acceptable. I even dropped my H1000 back down to 73 gr and still same results. I shoot a Savage LRH. Today I loaded a few 208 gr A-max and shot them. I shot a 5 shot group with every bullet touching. Sub moa accuracy. I seated them just .010 off the lands.

    A few questions I have = Is the A-max bullet suitable for Elk? I have read tons of reviews of hunters demolishing whitetails with them. I plan on using this rifle for loooong range. Out to about 900 yards so I need to know if the A-max can do it. If not what is an alternative bullet I can use? I am really getting tired of the Bergers so any help is appreciated. Three trips to the range trying all kinds of stuff and still cant get sub moa accuracy with bergers. Please give me any tips or suggestions.

    Thanks,
    Dennis
     
  2. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    Dennis, have you shot any 300 yard groups yet? I would load the most accurate load you have had with both bullets and shoot a few groups at 300 yards with each. The Bergers just might be sub moa at the longer diatances.

    worth a try

    Jeff
     
  3. Cordell

    Cordell Well-Known Member

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    Try what Jeff said and see what happens.

    I have a 300 RUM and shoot 210's over 91.3 grs Retumbo with 215m's. At 100 yards i get groups of an inch. At 300 yards it groups at 1.5 inches.
     
  4. teampete

    teampete Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the information guys. Would 200 yards suffice?? So should I try my most accurate load at 200 - 300 yards? I sure hope this works. If not I will be going crazy.

    Thanks,
    Dennis
     
  5. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    Dennis, I would do all you can to get to 300 yards. In some rifles it takes a bit for the Bergers to settle in. I would choose the load that shot most consistant. If it helps any, most of the 300 WM's I work with like the load at 75 to 77 gr of H-1000 an .005 to .015" off the lands with 210 Bergers. As always work up watching for pressure signs.

    Jeff
     
  6. Johnboy

    Johnboy Well-Known Member

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    here is one way to look at an A-max.to me I look at the A-max as a NBT.both have poly tips right.its just that the A-max has a better design and BC to go with it.

    for me if you are able to place the A-max in a good kill zone it will do its job.just as a NBT will.took out a doe last year at 100 with my 30wm useing the 208gn A-max.the bullet went in and came out makeing a hole about the size of a 50 cent pice.I know that its not the same as a 500 or great shoot but really think it will work.after shooting the doe and seeing the exit on the doe.I think that the 208gn bullet will just turn the insides out of a deer just right at greater distances.and like most along with a friend of mine love the 178gn A-max on deer.heck just the weight alone is to much for a deer even an elk I think.

    for me the berger in my 308 at 168gn's did not open up like I want a bullet to open up at 100 this year.shoot a 170# buck last week at 100 and the low 43gn charge of varget under the 168gn berger VLD just went right through the buck.small hole in and out.but he droped 4 feet away from where he was hit.so I guess just go with your gut.for me even the SMK works great for deer.but cannot say for an elk.its bullet placement more than anything.the bullet does the rest I think.

    one more thought.some like the Nosler accubond 200 grainer in a 300wm.or the berger might just like another powder of some sort.have you tried 4831 yet?most 300wm's like 4831.
     
  7. teampete

    teampete Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all the help guys. I guess will try and go out to 300 yards this week. I havent tried any other powder but I suppose it could make a difference. Maybe after I try 300 yards and dont get what I like I will try the 4831.
     
  8. teampete

    teampete Well-Known Member

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    Hey guys I shot today at 300. My best group was 2.5 inches at 300 yds. I would get 2 bullets to touch and then get a flyer that flew 7 inches. I know that I am not that bad of a shotter to get bullets to fly 7 inches from the others. I'm about ready to throw away these vlds. I am looking for alternative bullets. Please give me effetive options. Are the nosler accubonds any good? Remember I'm looking for a 1000 yd bullet.

    My stock is not perfectly free floated. I think there is one little pressure point at forend of stock. I plan on sanding it down and seeing if that helps too. Could that be the reason for the flyers?
     
  9. Broz

    Broz Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, big time. Depending on the coutour of the barrel you need plenty of room. Sounds like a lighter contour barrel and if so as it heats up the pressure point will push it off. 7" at 300 yrds is 3 1/2 moa. am betting this was the same problem at 100.

    FWIW, I just shot a 4" 3 shot group at 998 yards in a 5 ~ 7 mph full value wind with Berger VLD's.

    I would get the rifle floated and start over.

    Jeff
     
  10. bigngreen

    bigngreen Well-Known Member

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    That can definitely cause flyers, also make sure the tang is free floated as well, I've had a solid half MOA Savage go to to 8in groups over a slight bedding issue.
     
  11. teampete

    teampete Well-Known Member

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    The thing that really pisses me off is that I sent the gun back to savage because when I bought it, the barrel wasnt free floated. They said there was a bur in the stock which I thought was the case. They sanded it to where I can get a dollar bill through. But the left side of the forend stock barely has a gap and it looks like it is touching. In comparison the other side of the stock is full freefloated and I can see a major gap. That is what I call badquality control. Savage had to change their accustocks because someone had a patent on their design and I have the new design which I have seen issues with in free floating. Go to your local gun store and look at a Savage LRH with the new stock and you will see its not freely floated. I am very frustrated.
     
  12. Dano1

    Dano1 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah,

    That stinks when you don't get what you want. But The free floating is easily fixed. And I would also full bed the Action and Recoil Lug along with floating the barrel.

    You'll definately see a big diffrence and those Bergers will impress you. It's really hard to work backwards when the rifle isn't sound.

    When I was shooting Factory guns, I would always do the same thing with each one. Bed the action, float the barrel, and a trigger job. Then I would start the load process. I usually got them to shoot sub MOA every time.

    I'm not trying to school any one here, just sharing my process. This even had to be done with a Remington 700 Sendero. But Like you, that one I had to do in reverse.

    Dan
     
  13. Cordell

    Cordell Well-Known Member

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    I would offer the same advise, give the gun every chance at being consistent. My factory 300 RUM is a Rem 700, I have added a new box mag, and an HS stock that has an aluminum bedding block and then my smith bedded the action. I was out last night shooting to 1425 yards with it and the 210's I can not say any thing bad about the 210's. Give the gun and bullets a chance.
     
  14. teampete

    teampete Well-Known Member

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    Ive given it lots of chances so far... My hunt is in November so Idk if I will have time to has everything looked at. I know that I can fix the small stock issue myself. It has the accustock which has the alluminum bedding so I think I should be fine there? I live in Phoenix, AZ. Who do you recomend I take it to for having the gun worked on? How much am I looking at spending?