Berger close range impact

Idaho Lefty

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Jan 29, 2018
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385
135gr Classic Hunters in 6.5x55 loaded about 2600 fps have performed very well on deer and cow elk from 40yrds to 280yrds. When the bullet was placed behind the shoulder the animal died quickly.

That said, I would not shoulder shoot animals with Bergers on purpose because I am afraid they might not penetrate fully with the bullets I shoot.

My buddy is a novice hunter and this year we he is chasing cow elk with a 308. I am loading Barnes for him because they are more forgiving if he hits the shoulder instead of getting it right behind the shoulder.
AGREE with, your First sentence, Bergers "work" for, MOST Hunters !!
But, you SHOULD, spend some TIME/ Ammo on, Teaching your Buddy to shoot ! Do Field positions, on 10-12" dia. Steel Plates, til' he can hit them 5 Times, in a row ! We shoot about, 60 -80 Bullets, in Practice every Year, for every, Elk / Deer that, we shoot.
"Leaning on" another, Bullet,.. in case, he MISSES, the "Boiler Room" is,.. BS !
Our Elk / Big Game, deserve,.. BETTER !
 
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Randy dawson

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Feb 14, 2018
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Location
Texas panhandle
I shot a bull elk with a .308 and 190 Berger. At about 75 yards. No pass through but he didn’t go 35 yards. Hit right at the top of the heart and both lungs. I was looking for a picture but hell you can’t even pick out the entrance wound. But it worked like a charm.
 
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Idaho Lefty

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Since, we're ( son and I ) switching to, Berger's,.. I was doing some "homework" on, successes and failures of them, when I came across, the post about, the "Tips" being damaged ( closed ) upon, Recoil and I wanted to pass the Info, along as, it MIGHT help sombody's Hunt be, a success with, a clean Kill.
All I "need", a Berger to "do" is get thru, an Elk or, Moose Hide, one Rib and "Scramble", the Heart / Lung area !
The .270 WSM with, a 140 Classic Hunter, launched at 3,150 FPS, is still going about, 2,000 FPS at 800 yards and SHOULD be able, to do, THIS ! My Maximum, SELF imposed, shooting distance is about, 650 - 700 yards, SO,. I think, I'm "good" !
Shoot whatever Bullet, "works" best, for you, but,.. Test it and,.. PRACTICE !
 
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dana bodnar

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Feb 23, 2012
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121
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PHX, AZ
I have been shooting Berger bullets for
Some time now . I have never had one fail me ,although most of my shots have been in the 300 to 650 yard range . That changed yesterday on a Whitetail meat hunt when I shot a doe at 40 yards . Shooting a 270 wsm
Berger 130 gr Hunter Classic
Muzzle velocity of 3250 my ballistic program will not give me 40 yard results but at 75 it’s still moving at 3102 FPS. I have heard horrible stories
Of the Berger bullets blowing up on impact with no pass through. I know this is just a whitetail deer and not a Moose but come on 3102 at 40 yards .
I’ve had bullets thrown from lesser velocity and destroyed everything.
Here are the results of the Berger Bullet I’m sticking with them .
I have been shooting Berger bullets for years. Every rifle I own I have made a custom hand load for it and have shot a lot of Elk and deer at close range but mostly long range. I do not squeeze the trigger unless I have a great shot and never but never have I ever had a problem with a Berger bullet. They always expand inside the animal like a hand grenade in every direction cutting up most of the vitals and achieving a very quick and humane kill every time !! My long range rifle is a Savage 300 Win-Mag model 111 LRH I shoot a 210-G Berger VLD with 79.5 Grains of Retumbo is what my barrel likes at 2938 FPS . I also do like the Hornady 212-G ELDX A lot of hunters talk about what a bullet does but first you have to have a good hit.
 

dana bodnar

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Feb 23, 2012
Messages
121
Location
PHX, AZ
I have been shooting Berger bullets for years. Every rifle I own I have made a custom hand load for it and have shot a lot of Elk and deer at close range but mostly long range. I do not squeeze the trigger unless I have a great shot and never but never have I ever had a problem with a Berger bullet. They always expand inside the animal like a hand grenade in every direction cutting up most of the vitals and achieving a very quick and humane kill every time !! My long range rifle is a Savage 300 Win-Mag model 111 LRH I shoot a 210-G Berger VLD with 79.5 Grains of Retumbo is what my barrel likes at 2938 FPS . I also do like the Hornady 212-G ELDX A lot of hunters talk about what a bullet does but first you have to have a good hit.
 

Hoss50

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Apr 7, 2019
Messages
317
Location
Arizona
AGREE with, your First sentence, Bergers "work" for, MOST Hunters !!
But, you SHOULD, spend some TIME/ Ammo on, Teaching your Buddy to shoot ! Do Field positions, on 10-12" dia. Steel Plates, til' he can hit them 5 Times, in a row ! We shoot about, 60 -80 Bullets, in Practice every Year, for every, Elk / Deer that, we shoot.
"Leaning on" another, Bullet,.. in case, he MISSES, the "Boiler Room" is,.. BS !
Our Elk / Big Game, deserve,.. BETTER !

He will be getting a good amount of range time in, that won't be a worry. He is a less experienced shooter though so I want him to be as prepared as possible, and every advantage to making it work.

I have started working more with Barnes and I am liking them alot in certain rifles.

Also more of the experiences I see with Bergers not working well seems to happen more in 30 cal rifles. That is anecdotal, but the trend I seem to see.
 

Idaho Lefty

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Jan 29, 2018
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385
Hoss50,..
After, we find our best loads, Chronograph them, VERIFY them at, 200, 400, 600 yds, my son makes, Turret "Tapes" for our scopes to, "Dial" for, range. One Revolution on my Scope gets me to, 725 yards with, the Berger 140's, Zero'ed at 200 yds.
Then, we head out to, the rolling Canyon country, to practice Field Positions at varied distances on, steel plates.
Off Hand to 100 yards, but, mostly sitting position with, "Sticks" and with, our packs on our Chests, using a knee cap, to keep the pack in place, to support, the Rifles "Toe", which makes for, a steady "hold" to about, 400 yards. We're sitting on one side of a small Canyon, the Steel plates, on the other. We walk the Ridge down to, the approx shooting area then, we "time" our getting, the Packs and Rifle off, "range" the Target, etc. til' time of the shot. This, usually takes from, 45 seconds, minimum to a Minute and a half to, get steady, take a couple of, breaths and,.. shoot.
We shoot til' we hit, 5 in a row sitting at, about, 385 yards then, we practice, Prone to, 650 - 700 yards over our packs.
We do this practice, 3 - 4 times, BEFORE, we Hunt. This type of practice CANNOT be done at most,.. shooting Ranges!
You will NOT have, a Bench, in the Field ! Good luck with, your loads and practicing.
 
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Hard rock

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Dec 20, 2020
Messages
291
Location
Tomball Texas 77377
After, we find our best loads, Chronograph them, VERIFY them at, 200, 400, 600 yds, my son makes, Turret "Tapes" for our scopes to, "Dial" for, range. One Revolution on my Scope gets me to, 725 yards with, the Berger 140's, Zero'ed at 200 yds.
Then, we head out to, the rolling Canyon country, to practice Field Positions at varied distances on, steel plates.
Off Hand to 100 yards, but, mostly sitting position with, "Sticks" and with, our packs on our Chests, using a knee cap, to keep the pack in place, to support, the Rifles "Toe", which makes for, a steady "hold" to about, 400 yards. We're sitting on one side of a small Canyon, the Steel plates, on the other. We walk the Ridge down to, the approx shooting area then, we "time" our getting, the Packs and Rifle off, "range" the Target, etc. til' time of the shot. This, usually takes from, 45 seconds, minimum to a Minute and a half to, get steady, take a couple of, breaths and,.. shoot.
We shoot til' we hit, 5 in a row sitting at, about, 385 yards then, we practice, Prone to, 650 - 700 yards over our packs.
We do this practice, 3 - 4 times, BEFORE, we Hunt. This type of practice CANNOT be done at most,.. shooting Ranges!
You will NOT have, a Bench, in the Field ! Good luck with, your loads and practicing.
With Hammer bullets close range long range impact doesn't matter as much been reading these post your missing out if you haven't tried Hammer bullets unbelievable terminal performance on game accuracy and easy load development I've been impressed with the velocity gain accuracy and performance on game they are a game changer
 

Idaho Lefty

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Jan 29, 2018
Messages
385
@ Hard rock,..
I had heard they were, "good" but, haven't played with, them, yet ! But, I'll keep an open Mind and read about, them.
I already have, a couple Hundred 140 Classic Hunter Berger's and HAVE, a load that shoots, sub 1/2 MOA in my rifle.
I fully understand, HOW the Bergers "work" and am not afraid to use them, on Elk / Moose with, "Boiler Room" shots.
I didn't come here to "sell anyone", on the "merits" of, Berger's !
SEE my post on Page 10, post #136 ( trying to help with, the "Penciling", complaint / Tip closing, problems ).
I am willing to let this Thread Die, as People LOVE their Favorite Bullet and Hate,.. everything else,.. LOL !
 
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Buttermilk

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Dec 19, 2005
Messages
671
Location
Good Ol' Oklahoma
My sample of close shots using Bergers is limited to three deer.

Rem 700 300RUM rifle:
One dropped at the shot. This was a good mature buck shot at 82 yards. Bullet exited with only a moderate exit hole. Buck was shot in the rib cage. It's back was broken without the spine actually being hit (bullet impact and exit was 1/2 way up the body). Gun was a 300 RUM, 210 VLD-H bullet at 3150 FPS muzzle velocity (impact velocity est. ~3026 fps).

T/C Encore 30-338WM handgun:
This deer ran maybe 70 yards leaving behind a massive blood trail. The deer was a mature doe, shot in the rib cage at 60 yards. Bullet exited, leaving two exits, one about the size of a golf ball, the other 2/3rds that size.

T/C Encore 30-06AI handgun:
Using a 30-06AI from an Encore handgun 15" bbl, I shot a young buck at 41 yards. This deer dropped at the shot, dragged itself ~10 feet, then expired. Bullet was a Berger 168 VLD-H with a MV of 2650 FPS, with est impact velocity of 2586 fps. Shot was quartering hard towards me, bullet impact behind nearside shoulder. This bullet came apart with no exit. I found bullet shrapnel all the way back to the back end of the deer while cleaning it.
Adding this:

the 30-338WM load was a Berger 175 VLDH at 2846 fps MV (16.5” bbl Encore handgun).

A couple years ago I shot a ~250 lb hog with my 300 RUM at 50 yds. Used the Berger 210 VLDH at 3150 fps MV. Hog dropped at the shot. Like a sack of tators. Shot the hog broadside in the ribs. Bullet exited the hog in three places. Smallest exit was opposite side ribs. Part of the bullet exited behind the offside ear, while another part of the bullet exited in the offside ham.

The exits behind the ear and in the ham were quite large holes. Fist sized in the ham, and half that behind the ear. The exit in the ribs was pencil sized.
 

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Hard rock

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Dec 20, 2020
Messages
291
Location
Tomball Texas 77377
With Hammer bullets close range long range impact doesn't matter as much been reading these post your missing out if you haven't tried Hammer bullets unbelievable terminal performance on game accuracy and easy load development I've been impressed with the velocity gain accuracy and performance on game they are a game changer
[/QUOTE
 

dana bodnar

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Joined
Feb 23, 2012
Messages
121
Location
PHX, AZ
Adding this:

the 30-338WM load was a Berger 175 VLDH at 2846 fps MV (16.5” bbl Encore handgun).

A couple years ago I shot a ~250 lb hog with my 300 RUM at 50 yds. Used the Berger 210 VLDH at 3150 fps MV. Hog dropped at the shot. Like a sack of tators. Shot the hog broadside in the ribs. Bullet exited the hog in three places. Smallest exit was opposite side ribs. Part of the bullet exited behind the offside ear, while another part of the bullet exited in the offside ham.

The exits behind the ear and in the ham were quite large holes. Fist sized in the ham, and half that behind the ear. The exit in the ribs was pencil sized.
I love the 210-G Berger VLD.................They should call them instant hamburgers
 

Idaho Lefty

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Jan 29, 2018
Messages
385
Getting AWESOME, "Cloverleaf", 1/2 MOA groups, out of my .270 WSM, Tikka at 3,135 FPS with 65.7 grs of IMR 7828
using, the 140 gr Classic Hunters !
I seriously doubt that, they will "Splash" on,.. an Elk / Moose Hide !
Bettin', on IT,.. "working" just,.. FINE !
 

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