Berger Bullets vs TSX bullets

[Broz]

Oh no i believe you like i said i just was wondering if you or anybody els has had any expirinces like i had here like i said iv herd nothing but good its just something thats haunted me since than day knowing i wounded the bull for sure but was never able to recovor it

I have used them for years and had no problems what so ever. We even tried to make them fail with a test a few years back. While hunting in Wy we took a doe antelope at 60 yads with a shoulder shot. The bullet was a 210 Berger hunting VLD. The rifle was a 30-378 Wby sending the bullet at 3120 fps MV. The results was a complete pass through with a 30 cal entry and a 4 or 5" exit. I have never seen a deader antelope or one dispatched any quicker.

I really understand your wanting to know what happened. Unfortunatly with out recovery of the animal we can only guess. In one thread you mentioned " footage" of the shot. Do you have video? Can I see it??

I shoot the same rifle as you. A 300 win with 210 Bergers. My MV is 2995 fps. I can not begin to tell you how many elk this rifle has killed. This season alone it was used by a 12 yr old boy to harvest his first elk at 325 yards, and a disabled hunter I took out to take his elk at 521, my Bull at 425,and on a huge 6x7 Bull for a friend at 643 yds. All were DRT.

Most of the recovered game pics I have seen with bad experiences were smaller much faster muzzle velocities. Also some fast twist tubes. This should be considered when looking at results for comparison. I do not hunt with ulta high velocity rifles any longer. I have no need to, for my purposes and will take a big bullet over a smaller one everytime no matter what the game.

Jeff

 

[elktaxi1]

we had the same thing happen as you but not on a bull just a real big lead cow. my friend shot her twice at 50 and 30yds. she just run off like she had not been touched. the guy over the hill shot her about 5min later so we got to see what had happened. both of the bullets had punched all the way though and not opened same size hole going in as coming out. but the same gun and bullets had killed a 6x6 bull that same morning at 455yd with one shot not sure why but that was are exprience.

 

[Broz]

we had the same thing happen as you

Then this was with a 210 Hunting VLD from a 300 Win?

Thanks
Jeff

 

[elktaxi1]

yes jeff ours was with the 210 vdl but we had a 300 wby at 3025. i have also had bad luck tring to use them out of my 7mm's but we know why with them and except there reasoning for that. the question we had for berger was were we doing something wrong while loading them. i think the hole plugs on them and they just make a solid but i dont know.

 

[Broz]

the question we had for berger was were we doing something wrong while loading them. i think the hole plugs on them and they just make a solid but i dont know.

That is a good and valid point A seating die that squeezes or presses on the tip closing the hole could cause them to expand differently or maybe not expand. Something is different here. We have guys saying at close range they blow up and do not penetrate. Then your experience says no expansion. But yet my experience has been flawless even at 60 yards over 3000 fps.

Jeff

 

[gillettehunter]

165 gr Berger in my .300 WSM. Running about 3050 FPS. In Africa 4 years ago. Blew up on the front leg of a Red Hartebeast. PH's comment.... I was about 1/2 inch too low. Distance was apprx. 125 yards. We recovered him around 4PM the next day after about 5 miles.... I wasn't thrilled. I worry about shoylder shots on elk. I love the BC's and accuracy [ after you get a load worked up...] but I'm hesitant to use them on elk. Last few years I've used the Barnes TTSX. They have done good job for me. Bruce

 

[elktaxi1]

yea i have seen the berger bullets blow up also at close range on elk(just on the hide). i can make them come apart by shooting them out of my 7mm( blow up mid flight like the old 220 swift ) havnt tryed to do it out of one of my 30 cals but that might be something to keep me occupied for a couple of days this winter.

 

[300winniemag]

165 gr Berger in my .300 WSM. Running about 3050 FPS. In Africa 4 years ago. Blew up on the front leg of a Red Hartebeast. PH's comment.... I was about 1/2 inch too low. Distance was apprx. 125 yards. We recovered him around 4PM the next day after about 5 miles.... I wasn't thrilled. I worry about shoylder shots on elk. I love the BC's and accuracy [ after you get a load worked up...] but I'm hesitant to use them on elk. Last few years I've used the Barnes TTSX. They have done good job for me. Bruce

Not to sound like a creep but i live in gillette also i only know of one guy who has gon to africa you dont hapen to be Jhon daily and the owner of the gillette gun club are you?

 

[300winniemag]

I have used them for years and had no problems what so ever. We even tried to make them fail with a test a few years back. While hunting in Wy we took a doe antelope at 60 yads with a shoulder shot. The bullet was a 210 Berger hunting VLD. The rifle was a 30-378 Wby sending the bullet at 3120 fps MV. The results was a complete pass through with a 30 cal entry and a 4 or 5" exit. I have never seen a deader antelope or one dispatched any quicker.

I really understand your wanting to know what happened. Unfortunatly with out recovery of the animal we can only guess. In one thread you mentioned " footage" of the shot. Do you have video? Can I see it??

I shoot the same rifle as you. A 300 win with 210 Bergers. My MV is 2995 fps. I can not begin to tell you how many elk this rifle has killed. This season alone it was used by a 12 yr old boy to harvest his first elk at 325 yards, and a disabled hunter I took out to take his elk at 521, my Bull at 425,and on a huge 6x7 Bull for a friend at 643 yds. All were DRT.

Most of the recovered game pics I have seen with bad experiences were smaller much faster muzzle velocities. Also some fast twist tubes. This should be considered when looking at results for comparison. I do not hunt with ulta high velocity rifles any longer. I have no need to, for my purposes and will take a big bullet over a smaller one everytime no matter what the game.

Jeff

ya my buddie from montana was with me he fillmed it let me have him send me the video but i might need some instruction on how to put it on this site

 

[bigngreen]

Like Broz brought up, I think maybe tip damage while seating or riding around in your bullet case can cause issues. Another thing that will cause issues is shooting a light bullet fast, you can turn almost any bullet into a grenade if you push it to that point. Shorter, light for cal, fat Bergers with larger meplats pushed harder could turn into an issue if you put them in the wrong place.
I've made some serious attempts to blow them up and I've been unable to with a hard direct hit, I've seen issues due to poor placement but those issues would have been repeated with any other bullet IMO.
In all likely hood there will be true failures, it happens in all makes of bullets. I had a couple barnes fail to penetrate an elk and I haven't shot them for anything other than varmints since, is it the bullets fault, not really, I made the choice to shoot light for cal bullets fast and hit big bone (300 WBY and 168 TSX), it's operator error but it was enough to shake my confidence. You gotta shoot a bullet your confident in, no matter what it is!!!!

 

[300winniemag]

Like Broz brought up, I think maybe tip damage while seating or riding around in your bullet case can cause issues. Another thing that will cause issues is shooting a light bullet fast, you can turn almost any bullet into a grenade if you push it to that point. Shorter, fat Bergers with larger meplats pushed harder could turn into an issue if you put them in the wrong place.
I've made some serious attempts to blow them up and I've been unable to with a hard direct hit, I've seen issues due to poor placement but those issues would have been repeated with any other bullet IMO.
In all likely hood there will be true failures, it happens in all makes of bullets. I had a couple barnes fail to penetrate an elk and I haven't shot them for anything other than varmints since, is it the bullets fault, not really, I made the choice to shoot light for cal bullets fast and hit big bone (300 WBY and 168 TSX), it's operator error but it was enough to shake my confidence. You gotta shoot a bullet your confident in, no matter what it is!!!!

Y i agree iv shot barnes tsx in previous years short to medium range 50-600 at elk without a hitch but i wouldnt push them past this range on elk due to their size and how hard they need to be hit to put em down. but last year was the most gut wrenching expirience i was confident that a 210 vld shoulda droped him in his tracks but maby i was to close for the speed idk. this is the only animal iv ever lost and it got to me i dont like wounding animals i wont take a shot im not positive i can make i like all my shots to be drt with no suffering on the animals end but i wana try the vld again its just after that experience since its the only time iv ever thrown a berger at an animal let alone iv never seen any of my friends/ family shoot them. wors of all my brother has never let it go everytime elk hunting comes up he has to add (It you were using barnes you would have that elk on your wall) to the conversation. I guess im making a big deal about it its just haunted me i think about it everyday wondering how long and painfull of a death i put that animal through and its something i hate to see.

 

[300winniemag]

Has anybody had any real life experience with the new
Barnes LRX/ Long Range X Bullet

 

[300winniemag]

165 gr Berger in my .300 WSM. Running about 3050 FPS. In Africa 4 years ago. Blew up on the front leg of a Red Hartebeast. PH's comment.... I was about 1/2 inch too low. Distance was apprx. 125 yards. We recovered him around 4PM the next day after about 5 miles.... I wasn't thrilled. I worry about shoylder shots on elk. I love the BC's and accuracy [ after you get a load worked up...] but I'm hesitant to use them on elk. Last few years I've used the Barnes TTSX. They have done good job for me. Bruce

sry i guess i shulda read the last word

 

[elktaxi1]

i have switched to the 145lrx in 7mm and taken 4 anamals with them one cow elk passed a 1000 yds. also are useing them out of my 300 wby. the 200gr lrx at 2950 and taken 3 whitetail doe's at 400yds,584yds and 735yds all made nice one shot kills