Barrel shortening

MNbogboy

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The 303 British rim is .540 if I remember, while the 30-40 Krag is .545. The @Krag (30 US) is knocking on the door of 30-06/.308 ballistics,and would be all you need for elk.
My first rebarrel was a Candian Ross in 303 brit. I put a McGowan 6mm Krag barrel on it. The Ross had a buttress type thread (chambered square thread) at 3 tpi. Tough job for those days 70s, took a while to find a machinist who had a lathe that would cut them.
The 303 bolt worked great on the Krag brass. Actually made the wildcat brass with 303 brass.
I believe you could probably find someone to grind a 7mm Krag reamer. I've seen 25 Krag reamers listed once or twice. Reloading dies would also be a custom 1 off.
Your photo appears to reveal numerous and fatal rust pitting.
Under a good glass the lands should appear sharp and square cornered if it had correct crown.
Like others said check all screw torqued for this erratic grouping, it has been said a poor crown might also cause this.
Keep us posted on the verdict.
 

LoneTraveler

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With my computer I can blow the picture of the barrel till the bore is about 1 inch in diameter. It looks like it was fired with Corrosive Primers and Island hopped the Pacific theater in World War II, Without cleaning. The lands and groves look like an alligator's hide.
Replacing the barrel would be about the only solution to cure the accuracy problem.
The end of the barrel that was cut off may have contained some good rifling.
Trying to bring a 60 + year old rifle back to life can be a be a deep rabbit hole, If you jump in. I jumped in the rabbit hole with a friend and a 98 Mauser years ago, Ouch.
 

Laelkhunter

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We have an old Enfield that when we first shot it with the iron sites, it did OK. We did a lot of work on it and added a scope, blued it, and had the barrel shortened by a gunsmith. Now, with the scope on it, it scatters the bullets all over at 100 yards. I am talking 12-18".

My question is, when the barrel was shortened, (not by much), did the smithy forget to bevel or polish out the rifling at the end and how can you tell?

Tks.
You say it "did OK" with iron sights. What distance was that when you were shooting it with iron sights?

Shoot it using the iron sights at the same distance you shot it before you cut the barrel. If you don't get the same results as before, move on from there.
 
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adamjp

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Jan 10, 2012
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I hate to be the naysayer in this, but...

If that rifle was chambered in 303 British, then it is most likely a Pattern 1914 (P14) action. Whilst the Model 1917 (M17) action was directly built from the P14, the magazine, feed, boltface and bolt lockup were sufficiently different to make them not interchangeable (trust me, I've tried).

The P14 magazine won't feed 30/06 cases, and the M17 magazine box isn't interchangeable.
The P14 action feed rails are wrong dimension for 30/06 cases.
The P14 boltface and extractor won't secure a 30/06 rim.

So, what to do? On a P14 you are better off chasing the larger case heads like the belted magnums and 416 Rigby type cases. Whilst these actions have been and can still be made into superb safari type rifles due to their size, strength and heft. With the cost of labour and large number of suitable off the shelf actions they are a pretty poor investment of your hard earned cash.
 

Ward Thurman

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Hamilton, Montana
You say it "did OK" with iron sights. What distance was that when you were shooting it with iron sights?

Shoot it using the iron sights at the same distance you shot it before you cut the barrel. If you don't get the same results as before, move on from there.
Iron sights are gone. Scope is all there is now. Me thinks the barrel shortening is the problem. I did too many things at once; finishing, re-bluing, scope mounting, blah, blah, blah. I may have the barrel cut again by a different smithy and see if that fixes it. If not, a new barrel is the order of the day I believe.
 

Ward Thurman

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I hate to be the naysayer in this, but...

If that rifle was chambered in 303 British, then it is most likely a Pattern 1914 (P14) action. Whilst the Model 1917 (M17) action was directly built from the P14, the magazine, feed, boltface and bolt lockup were sufficiently different to make them not interchangeable (trust me, I've tried).

The P14 magazine won't feed 30/06 cases, and the M17 magazine box isn't interchangeable.
The P14 action feed rails are wrong dimension for 30/06 cases.
The P14 boltface and extractor won't secure a 30/06 rim.

So, what to do? On a P14 you are better off chasing the larger case heads like the belted magnums and 416 Rigby type cases. Whilst these actions have been and can still be made into superb safari type rifles due to their size, strength and heft. With the cost of labour and large number of suitable off the shelf actions they are a pretty poor investment of your hard earned cash.
This is a Model 1917 originally chambered in 30-06. Yes, I agree it is probably not worth the cost of a new barrel. We are thinking about a project rifle with some derivative of the '06; 6.5-06 AI, 30-06 AI, 280 AI, 338-06, etc. Which would you recommend?
 

adamjp

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This is a Model 1917 originally chambered in 30-06. Yes, I agree it is probably not worth the cost of a new barrel. We are thinking about a project rifle with some derivative of the '06; 6.5-06 AI, 30-06 AI, 280 AI, 338-06, etc. Which would you recommend?
I re-read your original post, and when you said 'Enfield' I read 303 Brit.

To me an Enfield is a specific manufacturing location and design, No.1 and No.4 to be exact. The P14/M17 may have been designed by the British at RSAF (in the town of Enfield), but built entirely by Winchester, ERA, etc. in the US.

If it were me, given the weight of those actions, I would be looking to 280 AI with a long heavy sporter barrel for sit and watch (stand) hunting.
 

CBH Australia

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This is a Model 1917 originally chambered in 30-06. Yes, I agree it is probably not worth the cost of a new barrel. We are thinking about a project rifle with some derivative of the '06; 6.5-06 AI, 30-06 AI, 280 AI, 338-06, etc. Which would you recommend?
Of the cartridges listed .280ai
I re-read your original post, and when you said 'Enfield' I read 303 Brit.

To me an Enfield is a specific manufacturing location and design, No.1 and No.4 to be exact. The P14/M17 may have been designed by the British at RSAF (in the town of Enfield), but built entirely by Winchester, ERA, etc. in the US.

If it were me, given the weight of those actions, I would be looking to 280 AI with a long heavy sporter barrel for sit and watch (stand) hunting.
.280ai,
What was the question?
 

CBH Australia

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Ok, I convinced myself the .280ai is the ducks nuts after a few mates suggested it and I researched it.

Just read enough positive stuff to convince yourself the opinion you formed is correct and follow your dreams. .

They all work but I like the .280ai for now.
 

adamjp

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Jan 10, 2012
Messages
90
A late addition.

Whilst the new barrel is being fitted, I would also go with a Dayton Traister Trigger and Cock on Opening kit.

Whilst the firing pin is being milled for the cock on opening kit, I would also ask that it be fluted to reduce weight.
 

Ward Thurman

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With my computer I can blow the picture of the barrel till the bore is about 1 inch in diameter. It looks like it was fired with Corrosive Primers and Island hopped the Pacific theater in World War II, Without cleaning. The lands and groves look like an alligator's hide.
Replacing the barrel would be about the only solution to cure the accuracy problem.
The end of the barrel that was cut off may have contained some good rifling.
Trying to bring a 60 + year old rifle back to life can be a be a deep rabbit hole, If you jump in. I jumped in the rabbit hole with a friend and a 98 Mauser years ago, Ouch.
Minor correction: 100 year old rifle. We looked up the serial number - built in 1920.

With the blow up image, can you see any goofiness on the end of the barrel where it was cut?

I already did a ton of work on this gun - new trigger, ground off the floor plate so it can be closed empty without sticking your thumb in front of the bolt, re-blued, scope mounts, etc. We only have about $270 cash into the gun now (lots of time though). I am struggling with it being worth a $500 barrel. It has a high quality stock and looks great now. We have another 1917 Enfield (Eddystone) that, while not sub-moa, it is a darn good shooter - 1" groups are common. I guess lightning doesn't strike twice.
 
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