ATTN: sr90 velocity loss with 2" shorter barrel

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Nicholas, Feb 11, 2002.

  1. Nicholas

    Nicholas Well-Known Member

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    Is the accuracy point at the same velocity as before? Thanks for remembering.

    I haven't really decided on an action yet. I really like Prairiegunworks LRT-2 action, they make it in a single shot or repeater (their repeater will allow a maximum OAL of 4.5 inches, WOW!). Only problem is it costs $1,600 (single) $1,900 (repeater).

    I would probably be served just fine with a single shot, just thought it would be nice to have a repeater. I Think a 2" diameter action would be too big for my application, somewhere around 1.5" would be perfect. I was hoping to get a good action for about $1000.00 or less.


    Any reccommendations would be appreciated. Also any links to websites with the actions.
     
  2. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    Is the accuracy point at the same velocity as before?

    don't have it fully tuned yet, but right now it's very close. My old accuracy load was at 2929fps average for 10 shots the last time I chrono'd it. If this last R25 laod works better on the next trip I'm switching powders and it appears this load is going to be around 2930fps +-. So it's very close.

    BAT Actions are very good and what I currently have. Bruce makes some smaller diameter actions also. Checkout his web site to see how small you can get one in a .590" bolt face. Also Nesika Bayhas some scaled down action that support the .590 bolt face. Jim Borden of Borden Rifles also makes hunting weight actions and rifles. Allan Hall of Hall Manufacturing also makes actions for the 590 bolt face. Jerry Stiller is starting to make bigger actions now also. His web site is at Stiller Precision. There's other I'm sure, just can't remember them all right now.

    Good Luck,
    Steve
     
  3. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    sr90,
    Finally able to shoot for approx 2hrs this weekend. Didn't get to load up the original Lot# of H1000 to have a 1-to-1 comparison of velocity loss, but with the R25 loads I was using I'm back to within 40fps of where I was. This chamber throat is .100" shorter also and that could account for some of that difference. Remember because I'm going for all out accuracy and not max velocity, I may not be seeing the true effect of the shorter barrel also. But even so with the 30 1/4" barrel now, I was able to easily get 2940fps with R25 powder without pressure. I could easily go over 3000fps if I used any of the slower powders. How much over 3000fps would be speculation.

    good luck with your project. Have you made any decisions on it yet? Last I knew you were considering single shot actions.

    Steve
     
  4. Nicholas

    Nicholas Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the all the Links, looks like I will be adding a lot of bookmarks.
     
  5. Nicholas

    Nicholas Well-Known Member

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    I got another question; lets say I put a 34+ inch barrel on the 338 Yogi, it would increase velocity but would the point of best accuracy stay at 2920 fps or do you think it would increase porportionally to the length of the barrel?

    I think it would increase but how much, I don't know.
     
  6. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    Sr90,
    It will go up some. I don't know if I can answer how much though. Another shooter from the NC 1000yd club, Bill Shehane has a 338 Yogi on a 45" barrel and he got 3165fps with a 96gr load of R25 and 300gr bullets. His chamber was cut with the same reamer right after mine. After he got done screwing around with about 5 different barrel block setups he finally got it shooting pretty consistant, but then stopped shooting it. So I don't know the real accuracy potential with the higher velocity. He hasn't shot it in over a year or so now.
    Then the question is.... would the best accuracy at the higher velocity node match the best accuracy of the low velocity node? My thinking right now is no, but it's all speculation and nobody has any proof one way or the other. That's why the quest continues for that elusive .000" group. But I did come within 58 thousands of that perfect group this past weekend with my Light Gun class rifle. We're having fun now!! whhaaa hooooo

    FYI: notice the relatively small velocity increase of that 45" barrel over my old 32". Find and read Dan Lilja article on using extra long barrels and velocity loss. I'm may be going out on a limb here, but there's probably a reason why Darryl's 338/416 barrel is in the high 30" range.

    Good Luck,
    Steve
     
  7. Nicholas

    Nicholas Well-Known Member

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    I have already seen Dan Lila's article, it is very informative. My thoughts are the same as yours, that the best accuracy will be seen at the lower velocity (2920 fps). Tell me a little more about the amazing group you shot last weekend, what rifle did you shoot it with, how far, etc...
     
  8. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    sr90,
    That was a 4 shot group that measured .058" the best I can measure it with my eye and a std set of calipers @ 100yds. The first shot was out of an oily bore that sat all winter and went about a half a bullet hole to the left, and the next four just litterly punch the same hole. I had 5 rounds left over from last match season. I figured I would double check my 100yd zero settings and shoot these last 5 cases so I could load them up for the upcoming matches. Shot right before dark and it was calm. It was dark enough my chrono wouldn't work from low light.

    The rifle (pictured below) was built by David Tooley, 6.5x55AI chambering (simply the Swede case with a 40 degree Ackley shoulder), using a Kelbly Panda LBRP action, jewel trigger, Lilja 30" - 9" twist barrel, Kelbly rings, Weaver T24 scope, aluminum pilled bedded into a Shehane Tracker stock made out of Obeche laminated wood from Africa. This rifle is nicknamed Little Woody. (I'll refrain from explaination on a public message board as to the true meaning of that nickname. ;^)) This rifle has shot a .436" 6 shot group at 250yds and has 7 relay wins and placed 6th in the LG Group Aggregate at the Pa World Open last year. The smallest 5 shot 1000yd group is 3.562". I had a 4.5" group that had 4 shots in less than 2" with 1 going right to give me the overall 4.5" group. This rifle has done nothing but shoot tight groups since day #1.

    [​IMG]

    I think it's a keeper,
    Steve

    [ 02-14-2002: Message edited by: Steve Shelp ]
     
  9. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

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    Steve,..........you have beautiful weapons! Oh, very accurate ones too!
     
  10. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Brent. My Competition guns have been a long time coming, while raising 2 young boys and spending 4 yrs in the service. E5 pay with kids doesn't leave much left over to buy toys with. But that's behind us now.
    I've always liked good looking rifles and never really cared for the fiberglass look of competition guns. But a rifle has to shoot first then look good in my book. But I'm a tradionalists, so when I orderd the stock above from Bill Shehane, I ordered his regular brown/brown laminated wood stock that has a good reputation. I figured if I can't have walnut, I'll go with soemthing that is stable and accurate and make it look like a good piece of wood the best I can. Well Bill surprised me with this Obeche wood. He just got it in and I got the first ST-1000 stock made out of it I believe. It is pretty and very functional. The finish on that stock is a Dupont automotive clearcoat and is rugged! No solvent will touch it.

    And the accuracy isn't bad to boot. [​IMG]

    Thanks again and have a good day!
    Steve
     
  11. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

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    Hello Steve,

    Did you inlet, bed it and do the finsh work yourself too?
     
  12. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    Brent,
    I normally do my own stock work with bedding and finishing. But this one I didn't. The short story of why is...... I'm color blind and Bill Shehane and Dave Tooley had themselves a laugh at my expense because of that. They kept saying oh you'll like it, and dropping hints it was a purple/orange/yellow/etc or something really off the wall laminate and I wouldn't know the difference. So Dave did the bedding and Bill had the finish applied so he could surpise me with the completed rifle. And obviosuly it wasn't orange/purple/yellow. It was a nice surprise to say the least!

    I still owe them for that one now that I think of it.

    Steve
     
  13. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

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    Steve,

    It is most definatly oarnge/purple/yellow, they HAVE fooled you.

    No, no I'm kidding. My foreman at work is color blind too. I give him a hard time when we get loads of color coded pipe in and he asks me what color they are. Differant color pipe goes to differant places depending on what the manifest says. This hunting season I thought my Leica binos were messed up in one lens, I flipped them upside down and found one eye (my right) not the lens doesn't pick up greens as well, instead they look more yellow or maybe it's the other way around it was fall. I have never tested color blind though either for flying or my CDL, strange.

    I would love to learn how to do that type of work too is why I ask. Where do you start, what tools, finishes etc. are used is what I often wonder.

    The BROWN/BROWN stock is a very nice piece.
     
  14. Steve Shelp

    Steve Shelp Well-Known Member

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    Brent,
    Do I have to add your name to the get revenge list also? [​IMG]

    I didn't know I was color blind until highschool. Then when I went into the service, they did the official test and I failed miserably. But yet I can tell colors. All depends on which colors and the shade and contrast of them.

    As for the stock and bedding work.... I refinshed a couple cheap stocks on single barrel shotguns when I was a teenager and really grew into it from there. Now I bed all of my rifles and have even done some neighbors and friends and a little metal work but not much. I'm not a gunsmith by any means, more like a tinkerer that has patience. Got a couple of checkering tools now also and messing with that.

    If there's anything else I can help with, or answer more questions feel free to email directly at my email address in my profile here.

    Steve