Are the .338s becoming pointless?

phorwath

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Yeah, the 338 WM is a proven moose thumper, even when compared to the 300 WM, which is no pipsqueak when used with high quality controlled expansion bullets.
I likewise have dropped moose with the direct frontal shot. It's not my favorite, but when the next best alternative is going to be a Texas heart shot, I want a cartridge/bullet with the ability to get into the boiler room, with that head on shot.
 

VLD Pilot

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I can kill a moose with pea shooter, when everything goes well.
Things don't always go well, this recent case being just one example. Shooter not one bit happy. His experience a big disappointment. Bullet placement was reasonable. It wasn't a gut shot. The bullet was headed toward vital organs. Cartridge and bullet weren't up to the task at hand on an animal of that size. We can talk risk taking and odds of success on and on and on.
7 out of 10 times, his bullet placement may have done the job. With a .338 Win Mag and a 250gr bullet, odds improve based on my multiple observations of moose shot with differing cartridge/bullet combinations.

You need not agree, but I'm confident a majority experienced hunting moose would. It's most common for people to be defensive about their personal equipment. They have ownership in it. They're invested. That doesn't mean the differing equipment is equivalent, right? Can you accept that different equipment is indeed different? It may be perfect for you, good enough for you, but it isn't the same. It is different.

After all the time, expense, and effort (travelling 4,500 miles in this case of the failed 300 Win Mag), I will always select equipment with the goal of improving my odds for success. I like feeling good after the hunt, rather than dejected.
Bullet wasn't up to the task. Not cartridge. The 300 WM mag has been killing moose for decades. Fast AND effectively. Scratch it up to a bad experience. Many have wounded deer with less than perfect shots from 270/30-06s. Let's not scratch them off the whitetail deer cartridge list just yet !
 

phorwath

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Bullet wasn't up to the task. Not cartridge. The 300 WM mag has been killing moose for decades. Fast AND effectively. Scratch it up to a bad experience. Many have wounded deer with less than perfect shots from 270/30-06s. Let's not scratch them off the whitetail deer cartridge list just yet !
Well I'm messing with ya when I say ground squirrels, while enjoying doing so.

But I'm not when I say that as a general rule, the 338s will disable, anchor, and kill more proficiently, with the less than ideal shot profiles.

I know moose can be killed with a 243. Seen it done. That doesn't make the .243 Win the equivalent of a 300 Win Mag.

No more than the fact that moose have been killed with 300 Win Mags make them the equivalent of 338 Win Mags. They aren't the same, and some shots that become chancy with a 300WM, are almost certain death with the .338WM. Like it or not... Many hunters want a cartridge/bullet that will bring the moose down with something less than the ideal shot profile and bullet placement.

And the fact that moose are effectively killed with the 338s, doesn't make them the equivalent of 400gr bullets from .375s, 404s, 416s, 458s, and so forth. At the 338 level, I feel comfortable and confident. Can't say the same about the lesser calibers, even though I've killed moose with them. So I have multiple experiences with multiple cartridges - across the spectrum on moose. Take it or leave it.

I advise .338s or more caliber on our big moose, for those incurring the cost of that once in a lifetime hunt. Why risk it on a less capable cartridge? A guide isn't gonna let your moose run off with a wound from a cartridge he has little confidence in, no matter your view you're carrying the mother of all moose killer weapons. He'll take your money with a smile AND kill your moose. Do you want that hunt to end knowing you killed your moose, or that your guide killed it. Use a 338, if for no other reason, your guide will understand it's the more worthy moose killer, and be a little less trigger happy.

Heck, I've killed lots of moose, and have a yearly opportunity to do so. I still prefer the 338s. Also killed them with 375s, but see less additional advantage to moving up that next step in bullet diameter.
 
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VLD Pilot

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Well I'm messing with ya when I say ground squirrels, while enjoying doing so.

But I'm not when I say that as a general rule, the 338s will disable, anchor, and kill more proficiently, with the less than ideal shot profiles.

I know moose can be killed with a 243. Seen it done. That doesn't make the .243 Win the equivalent of a 300 Win Mag.

No more than the fact that moose have been killed with 300 Win Mags make them the equivalent of 338 Win Mags. They aren't the same, and some shots that become chancy with a 300WM, are almost certain death with the .338WM. Like it or not... Many hunters want a cartridge/bullet that will bring the moose down with something less than the ideal shot profile and bullet placement.

And the fact that moose are effectively killed with the 338s, doesn't make them the equivalent of 400gr bullets from .375s, 404s, 416s, 458s, and so forth. At the 338 level, I feel comfortable and confident. Can't say the same about the lesser calibers, even though I've killed moose with them. So I have multiple experiences with multiple cartridges - across the spectrum on moose. Take it or leave it.

I advise .338s or more caliber on our big moose, for those incurring the cost of that once in a lifetime hunt. Why risk it on a less capable cartridge? A guide isn't gonna let your moose run off with a wound from a cartridge he has little confidence in, no matter your view you're carrying the mother of all moose killer weapons. He'll take your money with a smile AND kill your moose. Do you want that hunt to end knowing you killed your moose, or that your guide killed it. Use a 338 on up, if for no other reason, your guide will understand it's the more worthy moose killer, and be a little less trigger happy.

Heck, I've killed lots of moose, and have a yearly opportunity to do so. I still prefer the 338s on up. Also killed them with 375s, but see less additional advantage to moving up that next step in bullet diameter.
When I go on a Moose hunt, I'll take my 338 Lapua improved. Only because I have it. If I only had a 300 WM, PRC or 300 NM, I'd take one of those. I've killed Elk with a .270 easily. I wouldn't hesitate to use a 6.5 either. Everyone has a different comfort zone. I've lost many deer to well placed(IMO) arrows. I can't change weapons or projectiles so I'll keep learning. I never make the same mistake twice if I can help it.
 

phorwath

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When I go on a Moose hunt, I'll take my 338 Lapua improved. Only because I have it. If I only had a 300 WM, PRC or 300 NM, I'd take one of those. I've killed Elk with a .270 easily. I wouldn't hesitate to use a 6.5 either. Everyone has a different comfort zone. I've lost many deer to well placed(IMO) arrows. I can't change weapons or projectiles so I'll keep learning. I never make the same mistake twice if I can help it.
That's what I currently use. I'd be comfortable with .338 Win Mag. Can't say the same with the lesser calibers and cartridges I've used, and observed used on moose. I've killed 3 with broadheads. Not that those experiences are relevant to rifle cartridge selection...

Using lesser calibers, I'd kill the moose and have done so, but it's done with additional concern and care regarding shot distance, animal profile, and bullet placement. Because some of those calibers simply aren't up to the task, given the multitude of opportunities that present where I hunt moose.

You could list twenty more cartridges you have complete faith in. Use what you want. Doesn't impress me nor disappoint. I get nothing out of it one way or the other. We're doing nothing more than exchanging our opinions. If you had more experience than I hunting moose, I'd have reason to re-evaluate my opinions. As it is, I feel no need. But best of luck to you, should you ever hunt moose. You'll be fine with your .338 Lapua.
 

445 supermag

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This is getting ridiculously funny. Probably 100's of thousands moose gut piles gave up the ghost to the Big 7mm and 300's and a perfectly happy hunter. Do u need a 338 to kill a moose heck no and to say otherwise is truly ridiculous. Is it better umm. Maybe? But dead is dead. While I am a 7mm fan boy!! love them they are tremendously effective way down range. 28 nosler with 195 or 177 hammers way north of 3100fps especially the hammers i would gladly walk anywhere in NA and know full well I have what it takes to bring down what entered my cross hairs.

Oh and one of my hunting experiences 7mm RM. Deer. 100 YARDS DRT
338 WM. Handloaded 200 gr Hornady SP at 3000 fps. Sub 50 yards 1 shot put buck down but required a 2nd shot to end affair. So by this philosophy 338 is not adequate and now 7mm is much better medicine than a 338.

Oh and about that 300 and moose failure was all due to poor bullet choice and nothing more. If that had chosen a TBBC he would be dancing at his moose he just harvested. Its projectile and placement being Most important
 

Swamplord

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Twell.
The moose has pretty big bones to be targeting the shoulder. Better shot placement would help. My experience with many long range kills says lung shots are quick and deadly. How far can you go with both lungs punctured? That being said I think given the area hit even a 338 would have required a follow up shot to quickly end the chase.

Same Barnes 180 gr MRX bullet, same 300 WSM rifle and same shooter,

1st video, shoulder shot = anchor down

2nd video, double lung = moose ran off, luckily in the good direction ... if he ran to the right from where he was standing, it would have been a nightmare getting him out of that bog

In both situations the cartridge & bullet were up to the task , the potential for bullet blow up & shallow penetration goes up dramatically when using small diameter, light weight, jacketed lead core bullets, whether you hit shoulder bone or a rib bone, animal takes off and things can end up sour

I prefer to smash'em & dash'em to the dirt where they stand

makes for a fun hunting trip instead of a stressed out, wounded game, search party



 

phorwath

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This is getting ridiculously funny. Probably 100's of thousands moose gut piles gave up the ghost to the Big 7mm and 300's and a perfectly happy hunter. Do u need a 338 to kill a moose heck no and to say otherwise is truly ridiculous. Is it better umm. Maybe? But dead is dead. While I am a 7mm fan boy!! love them they are tremendously effective way down range. 28 nosler with 195 or 177 hammers way north of 3100fps especially the hammers i would gladly walk anywhere in NA and know full well I have what it takes to bring down what entered my cross hairs.

Oh and one of my hunting experiences 7mm RM. Deer. 100 YARDS DRT
338 WM. Handloaded 200 gr Hornady SP at 3000 fps. Sub 50 yards 1 shot put buck down but required a 2nd shot to end affair. So by this philosophy 338 is not adequate and now 7mm is much better medicine than a 338.

Oh and about that 300 and moose failure was all due to poor bullet choice and nothing more. If that had chosen a TBBC he would be dancing at his moose he just harvested. Its projectile and placement being Most important
Got it. You're a moose killing expert. And how many moose have you shot or witnessed shot? Enlighten us. Did you once read about a moose killed somewhere, by someone?

Or is it that you happen to own a slew of small caliber rifles? Buyer's remorse? If that's the source of your resentment and frustration, simply dump them for a larger caliber, moose-worthy cartridge. Hahaha. Your doubts of inferior cartridge ownership will diminish, and you'll heal over time. Follow that prescription, and the odds favor you feeling better.

BYW, If you had the least bit of consideration for the forum membership you'ld have jumped in and set us straight long ago. The moose related portion of this thread could have begun, and ended, with your single post. Almighty oracle of everything MOOSE
 

445 supermag

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Same Barnes 180 gr MRX bullet, same 300 WSM rifle and same shooter,

1st video, shoulder shot = anchor down

2nd video, double lung = moose ran off, luckily in the good direction ... if he ran to the right from where he was standing, it would have been a nightmare getting him out of that bog

In both situations the cartridge & bullet were up to the task , the potential for bullet blow up & shallow penetration goes up dramatically when using small diameter, light weight, jacketed lead core bullets, whether you hit shoulder bone or a rib bone, animal takes off and things can end up sour

I prefer to smash'em & dash'em to the dirt where they stand

makes for a fun hunting trip instead of a stressed out, wounded game, search party



Impossible video. You can't drop a bull moose with a 300 let alone a WSM. You need a 338 to be able to do it. I am calling it. Its fake. No moose can drop like a sack of potatoes unless its a 338 of some flavor.

And I like 338s. But its just getting a bit too deep.
 

445 supermag

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Got it. You're a moose killing expert. And how many moose have you shot or witnessed shot? Enlighten us. Did you once read about a moose killed somewhere, by someone?

Or is it that you happen to own a slew of small caliber rifles? Buyer's remorse? If that's the source of your resentment and frustration, simply trade them in a larger caliber cartridge. Hahaha. Your doubts of inferior cartridge ownership will diminish, and you'll heal over time. Follow that prescription, and the odds favor you feeling better.

BYW, If you had the least bit of consideration for the forum membership you'ld have jumped in and set us straight long ago. The moose related portion of this thread could have begun, and ended, with your single post. Almighty oracle of everything MOOSE
Now thats just funny. I have owned 338 WM for a few years. Just moved on.
 

phorwath

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Impossible video. You can't drop a bull moose with a 300 let alone a WSM. You need a 338 to be able to do it. I am calling it. Its fake. No moose can drop like a sack of potatoes unless its a 338 of some flavor.
How cwould you know?
Now thats just funny. I have owned 338 WM for a few years. Just moved on.
Well that completely explains the source of what ails you. Enough said right there! Tee hee hee:D
 

445 supermag

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How cwould you know?

Well that completely explains the source of what ails you. Enough said right there! Tee hee hee:D
:) MY NEXT MOOSE HUNT WILL BE WITH MY
454 CASULL OR MY 445 SUPERMAG. DONT WANT TO RISK IT AND BUILD A 338 ANYTHING i need big bore to bring a moose down. :) Its all in fun . So Enjoy what you shoot.
 

Swamplord

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Impossible video. You can't drop a bull moose with a 300 let alone a WSM. You need a 338 to be able to do it. I am calling it. Its fake. No moose can drop like a sack of potatoes unless its a 338 of some flavor.

And I like 338s. But its just getting a bit too deep.
I assure you kind sir .... that moose was not acting ....
 

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