Applied Ballistics Pro Support Thread

jmden,

This is a common question, and one we're happy to answer because it's an opportunity to teach about ballistic calibration.

Some programs that allow 'truing' don't provide any guidance as to what ranges you should shoot the calibration or 'true' points. Shooters will typically go for many short intervals, which, for other programs might be necessary due to fundamental inaccuracies in the solver. In other words, some solvers aren't accurate until you've told them many points of observed drop.

The Applied Ballistics solver is more refined, and is written to work with the supplied BC library and custom drag curves. For this reason, trajectory predictions are more accurate, so you don't need as many calibration points.

The few calibration points that are recommended are:

First is at the extent of the rifles supersonic range. This point will adjust your MV to coincide with your observed drop where the bullet has slowed to around 1340 fps (this is the first recommended range). Honestly, once you've calibrated at this range, you should be good for many 100's of yards past it, as well as back to the muzzle.

IF you anticipate shooting much further than the first calibration range, then you can shoot an additional point which coincides with Mach 0.9 (99% sure it's Mach 0.9, might be 0.8). Really, I don't think there's a need for a third calibration point, but we made it anyway.

The principle of ballistic calibration is to get as much distance as you can between the calibration points. It's the same principle that makes it obvious that you shouldn't calibrate at 200 yards with a 100 yard zero; there's just not enough drop to calibrate. Likewise, if you calibrate your first point at 1200 yards, and have additional targets at 1400 and 1800, ignore the 1400 yard target (because it's only 200 yards past the 1200 yard point) and go straight to the 1800 yard target.

The most common response is: "we don't have targets at the recommended ranges". It's OK to give it calibration points inside the recommended windows, the program will calibrate outside of those ranges. The recommended ranges are there to show you the optimal points to calibrate in terms of the bullet's Mach number.

To bill's question, there are some misleading statements on the instruction page, the one you mentioned is one of them. The first calibration point will always be MV. After that the program is calibrating drop.

-Bryan
 
jmden,

This is a common question, and one we're happy to answer because it's an opportunity to teach about ballistic calibration.

Some programs that allow 'truing' don't provide any guidance as to what ranges you should shoot the calibration or 'true' points. Shooters will typically go for many short intervals, which, for other programs might be necessary due to fundamental inaccuracies in the solver. In other words, some solvers aren't accurate until you've told them many points of observed drop.

The Applied Ballistics solver is more refined, and is written to work with the supplied BC library and custom drag curves. For this reason, trajectory predictions are more accurate, so you don't need as many calibration points.

The few calibration points that are recommended are:

First is at the extent of the rifles supersonic range. This point will adjust your MV to coincide with your observed drop where the bullet has slowed to around 1340 fps (this is the first recommended range). Honestly, once you've calibrated at this range, you should be good for many 100's of yards past it, as well as back to the muzzle.

IF you anticipate shooting much further than the first calibration range, then you can shoot an additional point which coincides with Mach 0.9 (99% sure it's Mach 0.9, might be 0.8). Really, I don't think there's a need for a third calibration point, but we made it anyway.

The principle of ballistic calibration is to get as much distance as you can between the calibration points. It's the same principle that makes it obvious that you shouldn't calibrate at 200 yards with a 100 yard zero; there's just not enough drop to calibrate. Likewise, if you calibrate your first point at 1200 yards, and have additional targets at 1400 and 1800, ignore the 1400 yard target (because it's only 200 yards past the 1200 yard point) and go straight to the 1800 yard target.

The most common response is: "we don't have targets at the recommended ranges". It's OK to give it calibration points inside the recommended windows, the program will calibrate outside of those ranges. The recommended ranges are there to show you the optimal points to calibrate in terms of the bullet's Mach number.

To bill's question, there are some misleading statements on the instruction page, the one you mentioned is one of them. The first calibration point will always be MV. After that the program is calibrating drop.

-Bryan

Bryan,

Bill here. When you say the first calibration point is MV, then drop, I'm confused. When you open the calibration screen, you choose a range and input your actual drop. As I understand it, the app recalibrates the MV to match the actual trajectory. After that, are you calibrating drop as a separate step?

From what I thought that I understood from Modern Advancements in Long Range Shooting You want to first true velocity and then BC.
 
Sorry for the confusion, I worded that poorly.

You will always input range and drop at all calibration points.

Behind the scenes, the program will apply the corrections appropriately, which is MV first.

-Bryan
 
Bryan,

I think I understand what you are saying. But, at the ranges suggested (especially 3500+ yards for the second range), I don't even have a way, (and I'm not sure of anyone who does) to measure that accurately, let alone a place to shoot that far and then come the issues and myriad of variables of whether or not the data I might collect (even at the closer range 1 near the transonic range of the rifle) is valid. In short, I really wonder how practical and how valid a test this could be at suggested range 1, let alone range 2 or 3. So, I understand what u are saying theoretically, but I wonder about the practicality of those ranges.

Now, perhaps this is simple minded, but what I was looking more for in this kind of calibration feature is say my V2 says I'm at 2981fps so I go out to validate that at long range at say 900 and 1300 yds and find I'm 1/2 minute high at both ranges. I can then putz around manually entering velocities to get drops to match or the program can have a function that finds that velocity that matches the drops for me. That's more of what I'm looking for. Do I have a basic misunderstanding of what's going on here?
 
The ballistic calibration feature does your requested calculation, which is to calculate MV based on observed drop at the first point around 900-1300.

After that, if it's saying you don't need to calibrate again until 3500+, and you can never, will never, could never shoot that far, then you simply don't need another calibration point.

In other words, the program doesn't require you to use all the calibration points. If it's suggesting points further than you'll ever shoot, then don't worry about it.

-Bryan
 
Sorry for the confusion, I worded that poorly.

You will always input range and drop at all calibration points.

Behind the scenes, the program will apply the corrections appropriately, which is MV first.

-Bryan

I get it. That's what I thought. In the ammo profile there is the option to input bcs based of fps. Is this only applicable if you are using g1 with stepped bcs ( hope I said that properly) or will it become applicable when the custom curves are available for iOS. Any idea when those are coming?
 
I use the calibration tool a lot to fine tune, it's key to NAIL all your other inputs, my 308 is a great example of the tool working, I put targets up at 100, 300, 1030 and 1535 yards then shot them based on the data from when I zero'ed. My 300 and 1030 were a little of, a minor tune to the zero high put the 300 dead on, then I ran the calibration tool for 1030 which lowered my MV by 4 fps from what I got from the magneto. The 1535 was also of a little so I ran the correction in the second range which changed it just a touch, I'm saving the range 3 for dialing in once I pass transonic. This took little time and some ammo and careful inputs and it has yielded first round hits at 1535 yards on a target rock that is just under 1 moa, with a 308 Win!
We did a very similar procedure dialing in Broz Terminator but using the custom drag and in such a chambering we took it beyond 2000 yards running about 1/2 MOA with NO calibration, but you can see that at some point a little tune may be good but it's at such a range that getting a day with the right conditions to put it on paper to 3000 yards with confidence of what your seeing just is not happening.
 
The ballistic calibration feature does your requested calculation, which is to calculate MV based on observed drop at the first point around 900-1300.

After that, if it's saying you don't need to calibrate again until 3500+, and you can never, will never, could never shoot that far, then you simply don't need another calibration point.

In other words, the program doesn't require you to use all the calibration points. If it's suggesting points further than you'll ever shoot, then don't worry about it.

-Bryan

OK. But for my 338 Allen Xpress (Lap Imp), the first range it suggests is: Range 1 should be between 1921 and 2469yds. The furthest I've shot this thing at this point is 1850 yds or so in the five years I've had it. Under good conditions, I've gotten the rangefinder on my Swaro EL range binos out to 2250 yds consistently, but under some shooting conditions, 1800-1900+ would be a real challenge. So, again, the numbers the program is giving me to use even for Range 1, for that chambering at least, are just not very practical in terms of rangefinding for most folks and to perhaps to produce solid repeatable data at that distance given all the possible variables along a bullet path that long, not to mention finding somewhere to shoot that far. My point is that is the suggested ranges are just too far to be practical. Is there a way to 'force' the program to use a closer range for calibration?

The .30-.338 may be more practical in terms of range, but my 338 EDGE would have somewhat, but not as severe issues as the 338 Allen Xpress. Am I missing something here?
 
I'm looking forward very much to be able use custom drag curves with the iPhone. How is it going with getting the custom drag curves available through the Apple store?
 
OK. But for my 338 Allen Xpress (Lap Imp), the first range it suggests is: Range 1 should be between 1921 and 2469yds. The furthest I've shot this thing at this point is 1850 yds or so in the five years I've had it. Under good conditions, I've gotten the rangefinder on my Swaro EL range binos out to 2250 yds consistently, but under some shooting conditions, 1800-1900+ would be a real challenge. So, again, the numbers the program is giving me to use even for Range 1, for that chambering at least, are just not very practical in terms of rangefinding for most folks and to perhaps to produce solid repeatable data at that distance given all the possible variables along a bullet path that long, not to mention finding somewhere to shoot that far. My point is that is the suggested ranges are just too far to be practical. Is there a way to 'force' the program to use a closer range for calibration?

The .30-.338 may be more practical in terms of range, but my 338 EDGE would have somewhat, but not as severe issues as the 338 Allen Xpress. Am I missing something here?

So, am I right that you are saying use the range you want (900 yds for Range 1 and 1300 yds for Range 2 in my example above) and disregard the "should be" statements in regards to the ranges in this feature of the app? I'm happy to do that, but want to make sure I understand the concepts here.
 
If you can't reach the first calibration point, then shoot your calibration as far as you can get a good target and see impacts.
 
If you can't reach the first calibration point, then shoot your calibration as far as you can get a good target and see impacts.

OK. I'm feeling pretty foolish here. I haven't played around with AB as much as I should have perhaps. I guess when I see the app say 'should be', (especially when it's written by a true long range authority like you) I took that too literally and then didn't bother even trying putting other yardage values in the empty boxes below those 'should be' statements.

In other words, due to the language above the boxes ('Range 1 should be...' and then the boxes are labeled Range 1 or 2 or 3), I didn't even bother using this function at the yardages I usually would due to essentially being told that Range 1 should be such and such a range and realizing that even if I did shoot that far, the data could be very suspect. Feel pretty stupid, but I guess I should've just put in the ranges I was shooting at to see what would happen. Perhaps you could provide a quick explanation in the next update in that wording to somehow indicate that closer yardages other those 'should be' yardages can be used and the app will recalibrate off of those closer yardages?
 
Iam running your app on my I phone 4 s and I am un able to delete created profiles. Is there a fix?
 
OK. I'm feeling pretty foolish here. I haven't played around with AB as much as I should have perhaps. I guess when I see the app say 'should be', (especially when it's written by a true long range authority like you) I took that too literally and then didn't bother even trying putting other yardage values in the empty boxes below those 'should be' statements.

In other words, due to the language above the boxes ('Range 1 should be...' and then the boxes are labeled Range 1 or 2 or 3), I didn't even bother using this function at the yardages I usually would due to essentially being told that Range 1 should be such and such a range and realizing that even if I did shoot that far, the data could be very suspect. Feel pretty stupid, but I guess I should've just put in the ranges I was shooting at to see what would happen. Perhaps you could provide a quick explanation in the next update in that wording to somehow indicate that closer yardages other those 'should be' yardages can be used and the app will recalibrate off of those closer yardages?

Iam running your app on my I phone 4 s and I am un able to delete created profiles. Is there a fix?

staab have you tried swiping the profile left to bring up the edit/delete options?

jmden I will discuss the wording with the development team.
 
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