Any last ditch effort advice on this 338 Edge?

buckbrush

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Nov 26, 2008
Messages
282
Location
Eastern Montana
I've been fighting this thing for close to a year. It won't shoot under 1.25 MOA. Groups at distance seem even worse. The last time out, at 350 yards, netted a 4.5" group. 1000 yards was 13.5". I have pulled a few sub MOA groups out of my backside but they were at 100 yds. I "stepped up" from my long range 300 WM Savage that would shoot 0.3 MOA as far as I cared to shoot it so I am about at the end of my rope with this thing. I have a bone stock SPS in 7 mag that shoots under 0.5 MOA consistently and I have 20% of the money invested.

Here are the gun specs:

Stainless 700 trued action with 4.050" Wyatt's box
Sako extractor
0.250" recoil lug
30" heavy Sendero contour barrel, six flutes, cut rifled, 1:9.5 twist, Holland Brake
Factory trigger, tuned up a bit.
Gre-Tan light firing pin and spring assembly
Bedded into a new HS Precision Sendero Stock
Full Nightforce setup with NXS 5.5-22x56, bedded one piece base and lapped rings

This thing has a long throat. I can seat to 3.975" before hitting the lands.

I have tried various loads of RL25, Retumbo and H-1000. Same group size just different velocities.

I've tried seating from 0.080" away from to jammed 0.010" into the lands. All about 1.25 MOA groups.

This barrel copper fouls bad and appears to be doing so the full length of the barrel when looking through a bore scope. My gunsmith says that the bore looks great...after it's been cleaned. I've got 250 or so rounds through it after "proper" break-in and the copper fouling is not showing signs of improvement. This gun also seems to give low velocity readings. The go-to load of 92 gr H-1000 is giving me 2760 fps.

Any ideas what to do next? Do some of these things refuse to shoot the 300 gr SMK's? Should I try 250 or 300 gr Scenars? I just feel this gun should do much better than it is. My gunsmith has built me three other guns with the same barrel maker and they have all shot excellent so for the time being I am ruling him out. Is this a bad barrel issue? I've contacted the barrel manufacturer and they said if it continues, they will replace it.

Any help would be appreciated. Thank you for any insight.
 

Topshot

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Nov 3, 2008
Messages
1,085
This long throat 3.975" before hitting the lands. This will have the 300gn SMK seated out a long way. Have you checked the runout on your loaded ammo?

Not surprised that velocity is down a bit with bullets seated to such a long overall length. Bit more powder room to fill up.

Have you tried accuracy with the the box magazine removed? It may not be fitted properly?
Check for contact with bolt and or stock.

What torque you running on bedding screws?
 

buckbrush

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Nov 26, 2008
Messages
282
Location
Eastern Montana
This long throat 3.975" before hitting the lands. This will have the 300gn SMK seated out a long way. Have you checked the runout on your loaded ammo?

Not surprised that velocity is down a bit with bullets seated to such a long overall length. Bit more powder room to fill up.

Have you tried accuracy with the the box magazine removed? It may not be fitted properly?
Check for contact with bolt and or stock.

What torque you running on bedding screws?
I haven't shot it with the mag box removed, but I can move it around slightly while the gun is assembled so I am thinking it's not binding. I have no idea what the torque on the screws is. Snug. :D
 

Topshot

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Nov 3, 2008
Messages
1,085
I haven't shot it with the mag box removed, but I can move it around slightly while the gun is assembled so I am thinking it's not binding. I have no idea what the torque on the screws is. Snug. :D
On my Edge, I relieved the bedding stress under the barrel and dropped the torque setting from 65in-lb to 47in-lb and the rifle went from a 1.5" gun to a 0.5" gun.
 

buckbrush

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Nov 26, 2008
Messages
282
Location
Eastern Montana
On my Edge, I relieved the bedding stress under the barrel and dropped the torque setting from 65in-lb to 47in-lb and the rifle went from a 1.5" gun to a 0.5" gun.

I am thinking that a new barrel is inevitable and hopefully it won't cost too much since I blew most of my wad on what I've got now. I can't figure out why it fouls so bad. I try to keep run-out under 0.002". I will try loosening the screws. I don't have a torque wrench that indicates under 20# so I will just have to go by feel I guess.
 

nddodd

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Aug 30, 2005
Messages
1,413
Location
Murray, Ky.
I can tell you from my personel experience that torque on the action screws on all of my rifles has made a big diff in group size. Usually I'll find a load that shows some promise play with seating depth and then I'll back off on the torque 5-10lbs from where it was at if they worsen I'll just go 5-10 higher than were it was usually I'll always see an improvement on groups.

This is just my experience, hope it helps


-Nathan
 

nddodd

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Aug 30, 2005
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Location
Murray, Ky.
I am thinking that a new barrel is inevitable and hopefully it won't cost too much since I blew most of my wad on what I've got now. I can't figure out why it fouls so bad. I try to keep run-out under 0.002". I will try loosening the screws. I don't have a torque wrench that indicates under 20# so I will just have to go by feel I guess.

It would be well worth your money IMO to run to sears and by a craftsman inch pounds tourqe wrench I think there around $50 or so.


-Nathan
 

3006savage

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Jul 16, 2008
Messages
279
With the excessive fouling I would spend $30.00 and give Tubbs Final finish a try. I tried it on a Savage 116 with great results. The barrel fouls much less now and groups have shrunk.
 

BMcKell

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Nov 15, 2005
Messages
144
Location
Wasatch Front
Sounds like a barrel issue to me if it is copper fouling that bad. I built my Edge with a 30 inch Broughton and have never had any copper fouling in it. My rifle was a Rem 700P and I used to get quite a bit of copper out of it, but I wouldn't be too happy if my custom barrel was doing it.
 

Willys46

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Oct 4, 2006
Messages
516
Location
Oregon City, OR
No need to mention barrel maker, but I had the same issue with a barrel. It shot horrible and would not stop copper fouling. I talked to the manufacture and they had me send the gun to them. After they bore scoped it, the replaced the barrel and said they had a bad lot of steel around the time mine was built.

The new one stopped Fouling in 5 shoots and to this day does not hold copper and shoots like a Dream. 3 out of 5 shots were hits on a 18X18 steel plate at 1500yrds today. Took two rounds to get elevation corrected.

I would give them a call and see what they have to say. They may just help you out. I would call them first before a shot Tubs FF down the bore that will void all warranties for sure on a custom barrel!

Willys
 

groper

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Sep 2, 2008
Messages
327
sounds like your having the same dramas as me mate.... i just dunno why mine wont shoot under 1-1.5 MOA....

Im trying different powder and bullets this week to see if things change, but so far i have zero luck with the 300SMK and H1000...

i havnt played with the action bolts torque either, you blokes reckon it makes that much of a difference as opposed to just tight by feel
?
 

locotrician

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Sep 19, 2007
Messages
181
If you haven't done so already i would start with the obvious . Check your bedding and or free floating ; barrel torque action screw torque, are your rings lapped too much ? Is your scope slipping in the lapped rings ? Try other bullets powder and primers , check the consistency of your ammo. Are both your lugs making good contact ? If all this Is eliminated re barrel.
 
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