Accuracy Issues / New 7mm Mag Win Model 70 Ultimate Shadow

[Salt Creek]

So I purchased a brand new Winchester Model 70 Ultimate Shadow in 7mm Mag this summer in anticipation of using the new rifle this hunting season. We are well into hunting season and I haven't got it to shoot correctly yet. This model is no longer in production but I just loved the feel of the gun and almost all of the reviews professional and amateur were great. I topped it with a Zeiss Terra 4-12x42 RZ8, not the most expensive scope but i have been please so far. My usual deer hunting rifle is a Savage Predator in 6.5 Creedmoor topped with a Leopold VX-6 2-12X42 CDS illuminated reticle which is phenomenally accurate. It shoots much better than I can. So my issue thus far is accuracy. This gun is seriously shooting a 2 1/2 inch to 6 inch group at 100 yards. I have tried various factory Hornady ammunition, 162 ELD-X, 139 Whitetail, 139 SST Superformance, and regular 154 SP, plus some reloads I loaded in hopes to correct the problem quickly if possible. My reloads grouped the best at about 2 1/2 inches, but that is just not acceptable. I called Winchester and got no help, actually they were rather rude, they did tell me after I asked what the in/pds should be for the action screws which should be 40. I inspected the action and stock and see nothing wrong that I can tell. I cleaned the barrel after each volley but had a horrible time of keeping copper from building up and this was after a 20 round break in session. It is difficult to tell if the crown is messed up with your naked eye but it appears to be starring the gases correctly after shooting 5 or so rounds and looking at the crown. The Copper in the barrel was some of the worst I have seen and took a full day to completely clean the copper out. After i finally got the copper and barrel clean I took a few photos of the barrel and it appears to be very rough to me but I don't really have any experience with what a barrel should look like or if it makes much difference. I have attached a few images of what the copper in the barrel looked like and what the end of the barrel shows now. None of my other barrels on my Savages, Weatherby's, Marlin's, or Remington's look like this. Could someone let me know if this is something i should take up with Winchester. I tested my scope on another gun by the way and it holds zero just fine. Thanks in advance for any thoughts or help.

 

[Shortmagman]

My thought is the barrel is not broken in yet. The barrel is still very rough so I would start over and shoot one shot and clean until you do not get the copper that you are seeing.

I bought a Wichester Model 70 Coyote in 300WSM a number of year ago and my first three shot groups were in the 21/2 to 3 inch range. I kept shooting the gun but the thing I think got the gun to shoot was J-B bore paste. I followed the directions and ran a patch covered with the paste through the barrel about 75 times. I loaded some 165 Nosler Partitions and RL-19 powder and I could not believe how well that gun shot. I also loaded some Sierra match bullets and this gun shot lights out.
That gun is one of the best shooting factory guns that I have seen. My son-in-law loved this gun. He shot a five shot group that measured about a quarter of an inch at 100yd using Sierra Match bullets.

This is his 5 shot group at 100 yards using Norma brass, 155 Sierra Match bullets, and RL-19 powder. We could not match his group, but it will shot a good load into 3/4 of and inch or less. So you can still get the gun to shoot if there is nothing major wrong with it.

 

[Salt Creek]

Thanks for the advice Shortmagman. I will try the shoot and clean method. I use Hornady bullets when I reload so I may try some other brands to also see if that cuts down on the copper issue. I was using shooters choice and Hoppe's 9 to clean it during the initial shooting and sight in. This stuff didn't faze it so I moved on to Montana Extreme (which smells like anhydrous) and KG-12 which appeared to cut the copper cleaning time in half. I will most likely buy a Leupold VX-3 of some sort for it but it has to shoot better than that first... I have had a few friends and a reputable gunsmith tell me about J-B paste but I was always afraid to use it as it appeared abrasive which I feared I would screw it up. I think now is a good time to start. If this doesn't work I will more than likely contact Winchester and see if they can correct the issue. I really want this gun to work well. Your target is great, I would settle for anything around an inch.

 

[the444shooter]

Shouldn't be shooting that bad for just needing a barrel break in. Call Winchester back, and don't be an ***, but don't let them off the hook. Ask them to provide a label, or at least and RMA number for a return so they can inspect it. Don't mention that you used handloads, because sometimes manufacturers can use that as their ticket out of the situation, saying you voided their warranty.

Otherwise, take it to a gunsmith and have him scope the bore.

Hold Winchester accountable would be my first choice.

 

[NCKILROY]

So I purchased a brand new Winchester Model 70 Ultimate Shadow in 7mm Mag this summer in anticipation of using the new rifle this hunting season. We are well into hunting season and I haven't got it to shoot correctly yet. This model is no longer in production but I just loved the feel of the gun and almost all of the reviews professional and amateur were great. I topped it with a Zeiss Terra 4-12x42 RZ8, not the most expensive scope but i have been please so far. My usual deer hunting rifle is a Savage Predator in 6.5 Creedmoor topped with a Leopold VX-6 2-12X42 CDS illuminated reticle which is phenomenally accurate. It shoots much better than I can. So my issue thus far is accuracy. This gun is seriously shooting a 2 1/2 inch to 6 inch group at 100 yards. I have tried various factory Hornady ammunition, 162 ELD-X, 139 Whitetail, 139 SST Superformance, and regular 154 SP, plus some reloads I loaded in hopes to correct the problem quickly if possible. My reloads grouped the best at about 2 1/2 inches, but that is just not acceptable. I called Winchester and got no help, actually they were rather rude, they did tell me after I asked what the in/pds should be for the action screws which should be 40. I inspected the action and stock and see nothing wrong that I can tell. I cleaned the barrel after each volley but had a horrible time of keeping copper from building up and this was after a 20 round break in session. It is difficult to tell if the crown is messed up with your naked eye but it appears to be starring the gases correctly after shooting 5 or so rounds and looking at the crown. The Copper in the barrel was some of the worst I have seen and took a full day to completely clean the copper out. After i finally got the copper and barrel clean I took a few photos of the barrel and it appears to be very rough to me but I don't really have any experience with what a barrel should look like or if it makes much difference. I have attached a few images of what the copper in the barrel looked like and what the end of the barrel shows now. None of my other barrels on my Savages, Weatherby's, Marlin's, or Remington's look like this. Could someone let me know if this is something i should take up with Winchester. I tested my scope on another gun by the way and it holds zero just fine. Thanks in advance for any thoughts or help.

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This is very strange and very effin aggravating my friend. I was almost ready to throw my scope in the trash but I took it off intead and shot these Superformance shells with my iron sights as well. I shoot a model 70 7mag also. I really don't know what to tell u besides the shells I always shoot (rem. Core-lokt) shot 1/2 group directly after the Hornady shot all over the paper... hitting here, there, and everywhere with no rhyme or reason. Chalked it up as $50 lit on fire...shot half the box in disbelief at how badly my rifle shot them. Back to the Core-lokt for me.

 

[NCKILROY]

Another thing I suppose I should throw in. My rifle is circa1968, barrel broke in just fine. Killed countless whitetail and several elk. The rifle will never leave my possession till I croak then my son will be the proud owner. If I had to guess I would say the propellant is the culprit.