6.8 & 6.5 Question

[md66948]

Pa legislators have past a bill to allow semi autos to be used for hunting. This bill must be signed by the anti gun Governor of Pa then put into play by the Game Commision.

Since I am now 65 and in poor health I was thinking about a lighter deer rifle. I have several ARs and one being a Factory Colt Commando 6933 SBR. I am looking at barreled uppers or building an upper. It seems ARP has a nice selection of barrels for a build.

What would be a good choice to use as a deer rifle, 6.8 spc II, 6.5 creedmoore, or a 6.5 grendal?

I want to keep the barrel to 14" to 16". Most of the area I hunt will be shots from 50 to 200 yards. When I was 12 I did get a 6 point buck at 400+ yards but I don't hunt that area anymore.

Your opinions and advice will Greatly be Appreciated!

Dane

 

[yorke-1]

I think the Grendel is the better of the two, but both are great cartridges. My little 6.5 Grendel took two small deer this year and I'm very impressed with the results. I typically hunt with either handguns or medium bore rifles so the small bore 6.5 was a bit of a change for me. My rifle is a CZ 527 I had converted to 6.5 Grendel with a 19" barrel.

This little blacktail was shot at about 45 yards head on with a 130 Accubond at 2430 FPS. The bullet entered the brisket, clipped the heart, shredded one lung, trashed the liver and came to rest just under the skin inside the pelvis. Penetration was just over 27" in an almost perfect straight line. Recovered bullet retained 82% of it's weight.



The whitetail was shot at a touch over 100 yards with the same gun and load. Standing broadside shot broke one rib, tore up the heart, and broke a rib while exiting.


My only real issue was with blood trails. The head on shot didn't leave any blood on the ground. The deer only went 5 yards and most of that was rolling down a hill. The broadside shot left a small, but usable blood trail for about 15 yards before the deer hit the ground. Some of that I'm sure is because the heart was hit in both cases. I'm told that the small bore rounds just don't always leave a blood trail that a blind man can follow though!

 

[wbm]

I think the Grendel is the better of the two, but both are great cartridges.

Considering the health issues you mentioned I think the Grendel would be just dandy.

 

[md66948]

Wow Yorke, what a Great Write Up! Thank You.

I am being told by other Pa Hunters that the Game Commission said that they will not allow semi autos to be used on Big Game.

If I get a few spare $$$ I may look into a bolt rifle in 6.5 Grendel.

Thank You Yorke & wbm.

Dane

 

[TC338]

Howa is bringing a small bolt action to market chambered in 6.5 Grendel. Looks like a great little deer rifle.
Howa MiniAction Rifle – Legacy Sports International

 

[thatguyshm]

I just ordered an ARP 20" Triad 6.8 barrel. I currently have a Bison Armory 18" I built in early 2010, it is extremely accurate with hand loads. I'm waiting on a line for 90gr gold dots, they seem to be amazing on game, and currently load the 120 SST over AA2200. Haven't sighted in the new load, but I worked with many different powders before settling.

I plan on next year using it for deer. This year i just didn't have time to sight it in, and was very fortunate to have my 338 federal when a monster 10 pt whitetail stepped out. Go over to 68forums and check the hunting section. You can see plenty of dead critters gotten with both hand loads and factory 90 GD and 120SST.

I don't have any 6.5gren experience, so I'm biased towards what I know. Always willing to give any advice though!

SHM

 

[J E Custom]

The 6.8 SPC and the 6.5 Grendel will fit the AR 15 Platform. But the 6.5 Creedmoore needs a AR 10
receiver.

If you intend to hunt white tails I would recommend the 6.8 SPC because of the velocity and energy.
(2800 ft/sec and 2002 ft/lbs ME compared to the Creedmoor's 2375 ft/sec & 1505 ft/lbs of energy.
(These velocities and energy's are when using the best factory ammo available for both).

Both are good cartridges and work well in the AR 15 Platform.

Just My opinion

J E CUSTOM

 

[yorke-1]

Wow Yorke, what a Great Write Up! Thank You.

I am being told by other Pa Hunters that the Game Commission said that they will not allow semi autos to be used on Big Game.

If I get a few spare $$$ I may look into a bolt rifle in 6.5 Grendel.

Thank You Yorke & wbm.

Dane

If you hold out for a few weeks (maybe months) I've been told by a pretty reliable source that CZ is going to make the 6.5 Grendel a standard chambering in the 527 very soon. Probably announced at SHOT show 2017.

I just ordered an ARP 20" Triad 6.8 barrel. I currently have a Bison Armory 18" I built in early 2010, it is extremely accurate with hand loads. I'm waiting on a line for 90gr gold dots, they seem to be amazing on game, and currently load the 120 SST over AA2200. Haven't sighted in the new load, but I worked with many different powders before settling.

I plan on next year using it for deer. This year i just didn't have time to sight it in, and was very fortunate to have my 338 federal when a monster 10 pt whitetail stepped out. Go over to 68forums and check the hunting section. You can see plenty of dead critters gotten with both hand loads and factory 90 GD and 120SST.

I don't have any 6.5gren experience, so I'm biased towards what I know. Always willing to give any advice though!

SHM

You'll be very happy with the ARP barrel. I have 2 of his barrels, a 6.5 BRX and a 270 AR that I'm just finishing up today. The 6.5 BRX is an honest 175 fps faster than the Grendel and it looks like the 270 AR should be about 200 fps faster than the 6.8 SPC.

 

[thatguyshm]

You'll be very happy with the ARP barrel. I have 2 of his barrels, a 6.5 BRX and a 270 AR that I'm just finishing up today. The 6.5 BRX is an honest 175 fps faster than the Grendel and it looks like the 270 AR should be about 200 fps faster than the 6.8 SPC.

Consider yourself lucky to have those. I believe he is done with wildcats and will be staying with only standard chamberings from here on out.

 

[yorke-1]

Consider yourself lucky to have those. I believe he is done with wildcats and will be staying with only standard chamberings from here on out.

I know! I bought his last 6.5 BRX a while back and then found out he wasn't going to make his 800 series bolts and extensions any more. I saw that he had one last 270 AR with the 800 series bolt left about a month ago so I grabbed it for $189 including the bolt!

I've heard rumors that there was some sort of legal dispute between ARP and another manufacturer about the design of the 800 series bolt. I'm pretty sure that you can still get a bolt that's remarkably similar from the 7mm Valkyrie guys. Not sure if that's connected to the ARP problems or not.

 

[thatguyshm]

The 6.8 SPC and the 6.5 Grendel will fit the AR 15 Platform. But the 6.5 Creedmoore needs a AR 10
receiver.

If you intend to hunt white tails I would recommend the 6.8 SPC because of the velocity and energy.
(2800 ft/sec and 2002 ft/lbs ME compared to the Creedmoor's 2375 ft/sec & 1505 ft/lbs of energy.
(These velocities and energy's are when using the best factory ammo available for both).

Both are good cartridges and work well in the AR 15 Platform.

Just My opinion

J E CUSTOM

Those numbers you got for the 6.8 are a bit more than optimistic. It's well known that the Remington ammo in 6.8 is underpowered and will not reach those velocities and impact power... Just food for thought.

SHM

 

[J E Custom]

Those numbers you got for the 6.8 are a bit more than optimistic. It's well known that the Remington ammo in 6.8 is underpowered and will not reach those velocities and impact power... Just food for thought.

SHM

I was surprised by the listed velocities differences also when I first started researching the two
cartridges and found out that the data for the 6.8 that was being compared to the Creedmoor with a 24" barrel and the Remington was for the 16" barrel length, and the 20" barrel would produce the velocity Remington ammo advertised. (They designed the 6.8 and developed it for a 20 to 22 " barrel). I did find out that Remington does make ammo in a lower velocity (The UMC brand
velocity is 2625 ft/sec for 1759 ft/lbs that still has 250 ft/lbs more energy that the best Creedmoor load)unlike there premium ammo.

My 6.8 AR has a 22" barrel and will duplicate the listed velocities. And In my bolt action rifle that carries a 23" barrel, it will exceed the listed velocity of 2800 by 31 ft/sec (It has a premium hand lapped stainless barrel and that could account for some of the velocity increase) but it does great
with the Remington ammo and also with the slower Hornady (2460 Ft/sec listed, and actual velocity
is 2610 average)

I have not been able to match the factory ammo velocities with reloads by an average of 35 ft/sec,
probably because the factory loadings are proprietary use proprietary powders. (Common in many factory ammo's)

Alexander Arms (The designer of the Creedmoor) really took liberties with there posted velocities of
the 6.8 and even loaded ammo for a while that would not even match the Creedmoor velocities to make there cartridge look better. Its a shame, because the Creedmoor is a great cartridge and needs no help by posting false information on its competitors.

I wanted the rifle for Hog hunting and went with the most power between the two and have been pleased.

J E CUSTOM

 

[thatguyshm]

I was surprised by the listed velocities differences also when I first started researching the two
cartridges and found out that the data for the 6.8 that was being compared to the Creedmoor with a 24" barrel and the Remington was for the 16" barrel length, and the 20" barrel would produce the velocity Remington ammo advertised. (They designed the 6.8 and developed it for a 20 to 22 " barrel). I did find out that Remington does make ammo in a lower velocity (The UMC brand
velocity is 2625 ft/sec for 1759 ft/lbs that still has 250 ft/lbs more energy that the best Creedmoor load)unlike there premium ammo.

My 6.8 AR has a 22" barrel and will duplicate the listed velocities. And In my bolt action rifle that carries a 23" barrel, it will exceed the listed velocity of 2800 by 31 ft/sec (It has a premium hand lapped stainless barrel and that could account for some of the velocity increase) but it does great
with the Remington ammo and also with the slower Hornady (2460 Ft/sec listed, and actual velocity
is 2610 average)

I have not been able to match the factory ammo velocities with reloads by an average of 35 ft/sec,
probably because the factory loadings are proprietary use proprietary powders. (Common in many factory ammo's)

Alexander Arms (The designer of the Creedmoor) really took liberties with there posted velocities of
the 6.8 and even loaded ammo for a while that would not even match the Creedmoor velocities to make there cartridge look better. Its a shame, because the Creedmoor is a great cartridge and needs no help by posting false information on its competitors.

I wanted the rifle for Hog hunting and went with the most power between the two and have been pleased.

J E CUSTOM

You mean the Grendel, correct?

 

[J E Custom]

You mean the Grendel, correct?

Correct !!! sorry the OP ask about the Creedmoor and it got stuck in my thick head. the numbers are correct for the Grendel and the 6.8 are correct. I would edit/correct it, but the edit feature is gone and it is to late. (I wish it would give you more time to correct errors).

I also compared the Creedmoor to the Grendel and the 6.8 but the difference in price when you add the AR 10 receiver made it
prohibitive.

J E CUSTOM