6.5x284 Norma

[Wachsmann]

Has anyone done any experimenting with IMR 7828 SSC in there 6.5x284? If so could you please post. Its hard to come by retumbo these days and I always see alot of 7828ssc. Also I'm using the 140 berger as well.

 

[roninflag]

What rifle? i have used H4350, H4831sc, Mrp, Mrp2.

 

[Wachsmann]

Its a savage 116 24 inch barrel. I have tried all the other powders and actually have 4350, 4831ssc, a little retumbo but its for my ultra mag. I've mainly used hybrid 100V which is not temp stable but it yielded the highest velocity between, 4350, 4831, and 4064 without giving me pressure issues until I shot it during the summer at 85 degrees. It increases over 100fps and gave me a tight bolt lift. It was my winter hunting load. So I can reduce it but would like to find something that just shot good in the summer and in the winter. The 7828 might do the same just don't know. I used to use this in a 257 weatherby and it was fine in the summer. Berger recommends 52 grains max load at 95% load capacity. The 7828 SSC still leaves some space in the casing. So I have some right now loaded up to 53.5 grains and down to 51 to see how it will go. Just haven't got out to shoot. I posted to see if anyone else has tried this. I know a lot of guys on here really like the retumbo running about 54 to 56 grains. Yields about 2950 to 2975fps with not really any pressure issues. Its just retumbo is hard to come by.

 

[Greyfox]

I haven't tried 7828ssc but notice you have H4831sc. I have been able to get 2940 out of my 24" Savage with excellent accuracy and ES using 53 gr of H4831sc. No pressure signs.Use 210 primers. Shoots in 1.25" at 500 yards.

 

[Wachsmann]

On this rifle it shows pressure early. I had pressure at 51.5 grains of the 4831ssc. I was only in the 2760ish for velocity. It has always shown pressure early but the velocity seems to be slow for a 6.5x284. I actually considered replacing the barrel but the gun does shoot well just not fast. I actually got stiff bolt lift and an injector marks on the factory HSM 140 bergers loads. They did run at or around very close to 3000fps in the gun when I had them out shooting. The gun grouped them well also but I don't like the over pressure thing so much.

 

[Greyfox]

On this rifle it shows pressure early. I had pressure at 51.5 grains of the 4831ssc. I was only in the 2760ish for velocity. It has always shown pressure early but the velocity seems to be slow for a 6.5x284. I actually considered replacing the barrel but the gun does shoot well just not fast. I actually got stiff bolt lift and an injector marks on the factory HSM 140 bergers loads. They did run at or around very close to 3000fps in the gun when I had them out shooting. The gun grouped them well also but I don't like the over pressure thing so much.

Your velocity reading using 51.5gr of H4831sc is the same as I get using that charge in my Savage.

It's possible that your chambering is off. What is the COAL of a round that is loaded to the lands for a 140 Berger VLD using Lapua brass. This runs 3.19 in my Savage LRH in 6.5-294 and 3.185 in my Cooper. Both generate 2940-2950 velocity and no pressure with 53 gr of H4831sc.

The other check is your headspace, which if off, can be easily adjusted with the
Savage by turning the barrel. The headsace of a fired Lapua case compaired to a new Lapua case should be .005-.008" longer, and sized .001-.002" less than the fired length.

If these dimensions check out OK it's possible that the issue is with the bore. iMO.

 

[Wachsmann]

So I checked the fired cases and unfired. I'm at .006 to .007 on fired cases verses the unfired. I load to 3.100 for COL on my load. When I started loading this rifle I actually used some of your load data and others on the site and tweeked it for my rifle from one of the really long threads that was on this sight. It seemed from the get go this rifle has always shown pressure eairly. Rifle was ought brand new. Before HSM started seating the bergers in the case so fare I shot some of theirs, and I had a small injection mark and the bolt was a little stiff. I might go and buy some more factory ammo just to see if it does the same thing. Right now with the hybrid I'm running 2842 fps on the chrono. Not the best chrono but it seem to be close with drop data. I was just trying to squeeze out some more velocity out of it. I actually thought of sending my barrel to McGowen Precision Barrels to see if they could keep every thing the same as size and contour but just make me a 26 inch barrel. Also keeping it fluted as well. I also spoke with a savage rep at one of our gun shows here in Utah and they had told me to call there custom shop and they could also make me a barrel that would fit correctly with flutes and be 26 inches as well. I don't know which would cost more though since I haven't call savage or spoke to McGowen. If I decide to change the barrel out that will be the last option.

 

[Greyfox]

I have a Savage LRP in 260 that has a similar issue with lower than typical velocities needed to avoid my primer pockets from loosening up. Since I only use it for 600 yards and under competition, and it's accuracy with my lighter load is exceptional, I haven't bothered to address it. In my case though, the headspace seems to be on the tight side, with fired cases having the same headspace as new Lapua brass. Not sure that this is the cause of the problem though.

 

[Wachsmann]

I have loaded the retumbo at 3.100 COL, fed210 match primer with 54 grains and it produced 2925ish. It didn't seem to have any pressure issues on the retumbo. I don't remember the spread on the ones I shot. It was only about 10 rounds as well, since I did not have a lot of retumbo left. It was all loaded into my 300 ultra mag. But I may try it again as soon as I find some more. I had a couple of pounds of the 100V. It groups right at .5 inch 200yrds. So I stuck with that. Still have some left but just consistently see 7828SSC almost everywhere. So I thought I would give it a try and see if I can get some more velocity out of the gun. If not I'll shoot it till I save up some money for a new barrel or until I wear out this one. It's actually probably my favorite gun to shoot out of the ones I own..... I also tried H1000 and it was just all over the place. Really large spread like 40fps. I thought it may had been me or the scale was off cal. Not sure but I have not revisited H1000. Also it was on the slower 2875 to 2910 compared to retumbo.

 

[tobehunted]

My boy shoots a savage 6.5x284 but his gun uses 130 grain bergers with 51.2 gr of IMR7828 , just off the lands and that combo gives right at about 2812 on velocity. deadly accurate , really mild and just a joy to shoot !

 

[Wachsmann]

So hopefully I can actually reproduce the same velocity or possible add a little with the charges but it may show pressure. Don't know. I can't shoot today because I have to go into work in about an hour. I think the 7828 is a little bit more temp stable than the 100V and its a slower powder burn. So hopefully the velocity will be better without the pressure spike. I which there was more retumbo avabile. Also if some one around here starts stocking RL26 or 23 then I might try them as well. My original goal was to try and stretch this gun out to 900 to 1000yrds for deer and similar size animals. Will see what happens, hopefully get out Friday morning.

 

[Wachsmann]

I was able to get out today and tried the 7828ssc. At 52 grains I am about the same speed as the hybrid 100V. At 53 grains I got good results. I was firing 4 shot groups and I really did not let the barrel cool enough but I had a spread from 2942 to 2949 for 4 shots. Here is were some thing got really weird. At 52.5 grains I had a case that gave me tight bolt lift and injectors marks. The 53grns was all ok for bolt lift but had injector marks. 53.5 only about 20fps faster with 2 having stiff boat lift. I had 2 left at 54grns which produced 2990ish fps but one was ok and the other had a really stiff bolt lift. I starting reading over a couple of other threads this morning and started to wonder about a few things. If possible I wonder if my case neck are 2 thick from not trimming neck thickness and causing extra pressure and if not annelling the neck is also causing non consistent neck tension? That might explain the large spread at 52.5grns. I got like 40fps spread for the same charge.

 

[tbrice23]

I was able to get out today and tried the 7828ssc. At 52 grains I am about the same speed as the hybrid 100V. At 53 grains I got good results. I was firing 4 shot groups and I really did not let the barrel cool enough but I had a spread from 2942 to 2949 for 4 shots. Here is were some thing got really weird. At 52.5 grains I had a case that gave me tight bolt lift and injectors marks. The 53grns was all ok for bolt lift but had injector marks. 53.5 only about 20fps faster with 2 having stiff boat lift. I had 2 left at 54grns which produced 2990ish fps but one was ok and the other had a really stiff bolt lift. I starting reading over a couple of other threads this morning and started to wonder about a few things. If possible I wonder if my case neck are 2 thick from not trimming neck thickness and causing extra pressure and if not annelling the neck is also causing non consistent neck tension? That might explain the large spread at 52.5grns. I got like 40fps spread for the same charge.

Did you get any other advancements with 7828?
I was just about to try h1000 with 140 vld but decided to do a search for 7828.
Any suggestions?

 

[Ccctennis]

Has anyone done any experimenting with IMR 7828 SSC in there 6.5x284? If so could you please post. Its hard to come by retumbo these days and I always see alot of 7828ssc. Also I'm using the 140 berger as well.

Here are my loads with my 284 Norma
6.5-284 WIN LR nosler Winchester 760 45.5 Hornady BTHP Match 100 grain 20 2.84 0.492
6.5-284 WIN LR nosler Hodgdon Hybrid 100V 51.5 Hornady BTHP Match 100 grain 20 2.84 0.528
6.5-284 WIN LR nosler Accurate MagPro 57 Hornady BTHP Match 100 grain 20 2.87 0.533
6.5-284 WIN LR nosler Hodgdon H414 46 Hornady BTHP Match 100 grain 20 2.8 0.501
6.5-284 WIN LR nosler Hodgdon 4831 53 Hornady BTHP Match 100 grain 20 2.8 0.5
6.5-284 WIN LR Hornady Hodgdon Hybrid 100V 45 Hornady Spitzer 140 grain 20 2.91