6.5mm Craze? 264WM vs 6.5 SAUM vs 6.5 PRC?

[Hand Skills]

Because if I have to listen to one more Fudd explain to me how the belt makes the case head super-duper strong and it's what they use in Africa on real Africa-Lions because the belt fixes all the head spacing issues that make rifles fail when being charged by elephants, then the Fudd is going to find out for sure if the belt really strengthens the case head or if they can still get a head separation as the doc is pulling a belted case out of the Fudd's sinuses.

There's nothing WRONG with it, it just doesn't DO anything if the cartridge has anything resembling a shoulder.

In all fairness I still love the 30-30, so I'm not opposed to outdated design features. Just the Fudds that Fudd around about them.

Come on, every fudd knows that RIMMED cases without an extractor groove cut in them (like the 30-30) have the strongest case heads - it's basic engineering!

 

[WildRose]

I am curious, because I was looking into building a 6.5-284, then thought maybe a 6.5 PRC. However, I have heard of problems with the PRC case and dies are not able to size them correctly, what are you doing to correct this problem?

I've not seen that to be the case. If people have had that issue they probably need to contact their die maker and figure out what's wrong.

 

[WildRose]

The PRC is just another hyped up failure made by Hornady. It offers no advantage over existing rounds…..much like it's big brother.
Doesn't come close to either the 264WM or 6.5 WSM or 6.5 SAUM.
If you want fast and accuracy, the 6.5-300 Weatherby is the real deal.

Cheers.

That's why the 6.5-300PRC or a straight 6.5-375Ruger would be my preference.

I'm not limited to competition standards and I like gassing them up.

The problem with WBY is the cost and lack of availability of ammo and frequently long stretches when brass cannot be found.

 

[Hard rock]

I've never understood the hate for belted cases. Yeah the new fat belt less cases look cool and all but what is the issue with the belt? If you are building custom especially, you can set it up to headspace on the shoulder just like every other cartridge out there.

Regarding freebore, what is the issue with a longer freebore? I stopped chasing the lands a long time ago. My 257 Wby has .375" freebore and it's a .25 MOA gun. Eric Cortina also thinks chasing the lands is a waste of time.

Mike I have plenty of belted magnums I usually found my best accuracy touching or not far from the lands when your touching you have one way too go ,but since I have switched too Hammer bullets ,bullet jump isn't as critical in my experience their is nothing wrong with the 264 win mag with a fast twist preferably a 1-7 or 1-7,5 min for my liking personally I've found the 6.5 prc loaded too it's potential runs pretty close too the 264 win mag .My long action mod 70 pre 64 with a 7.5 twist Bartlien run the 131 gr Hammer right at 3200 fps and the 123s 3450 plus with no problems .good luck with your 264 improved win mag keep me posted you have my curiosity

 

[Mike D Texas]

Mike I have plenty of belted magnums I usually found my best accuracy touching or not far from the lands when your touching you have one way too go ,but since I have switched too Hammer bullets ,bullet jump isn't as critical in my experience their is nothing wrong with the 264 win mag with a fast twist preferably a 1-7 or 1-7,5 min for my liking personally I've found the 6.5 prc loaded too it's potential runs pretty close too the 264 win mag .My long action mod 70 pre 64 with a 7.5 twist Bartlien run the 131 gr Hammer right at 3200 fps and the 123s 3450 plus with no problems .good luck with your 264 improved win mag keep me posted you have my curiosity

Thanks for the kind words. I have stopped chasing lands because I have 2 guns with ridiculously long throats/freebore and the are both 1/2" or better guns. One is my 257 Wby I mentioned the other is a R700 5R Milspec in 308. I run accurate mags in it with bullets seated at 2.95 and I still have on average .0050" to touch the lands with most bullets I shoot. It that gun is a 1/2" gun as well. What also appears to happen with more freebore is you can drive the cartridge harder without pressure signs as easily. I have run my 257 Wby up to 3650fps with 115 VLDs before getting stiff bolt lift. I've run the .308 up to 2968fps with 168 ABLR and it only has a 20" barrel. I know speed isn't everything but it is nice for keeping down range velocity up for a bit further.

I get what you are saying, most BR shooters kiss or jam into the lands but I'm not so sure it matters as much as previously believed.

 

[Frank in the Laurels]

What's all the amazement about, I've been shooting the 6.5 rem short mag for 5 DECADES !!! BIG GREEN tried this concept back in the early 70's or late 60's, they even used the short barrel in there 600/660's, your all way behind the times....where have you guys been...astonishingly some of you have never even heard of the original short magnum super 6.5....rookies !!

 

[Wild Monkey]

What's all the amazement about, I've been shooting the 6.5 rem short mag for 5 DECADES !!! BIG GREEN tried this concept back in the early 70's or late 60's, they even used the short barrel in there 600/660's, your all way behind the times....where have you guys been...astonishingly some of you have never even heard of the original short magnum super 6.5....rookies !!

 

[Hard rock]

Thanks for the kind words. I have stopped chasing lands because I have 2 guns with ridiculously long throats/freebore and the are both 1/2" or better guns. One is my 257 Wby I mentioned the other is a R700 5R Milspec in 308. I run accurate mags in it with bullets seated at 2.95 and I still have on average .0050" to touch the lands with most bullets I shoot. It that gun is a 1/2" gun as well. What also appears to happen with more freebore is you can drive the cartridge harder without pressure signs as easily. I have run my 257 Wby up to 3650fps with 115 VLDs before getting stiff bolt lift. I've run the .308 up to 2968fps with 168 ABLR and it only has a 20" barrel. I know speed isn't everything but it is nice for keeping down range velocity up for a bit further.

I get what you are saying, most BR shooters kiss or jam into the lands but I'm not so sure it matters as much as previously believed.

Weall know that's how Weatherby lowered the chamber pressure on his mag Cartridges it must work because they are alive and well .. I experience some of these new cartridges operate at higher pressure than some mag cartridges allowing more vel with less powder, also the brass is way better than it used too be Lapua versus Win., rem ,Nosler etc . The Lapua brass in my 25-284 allows me too achieve 3874 fps with a 90 gr hammer I know you know that is 257 Weatherby territory.The 284 case is a wild- caters dream case it already had a very thick Webb now made even stronger with Lapua .Back too the magnums most hand loaders probably don't know the tricks too the trade getting the most out of a given cartridge I do , you do and many members on this forum do I'm glad te 6.5 Cartridges are getting noticed these days because there has been a lot of great ones over the years.The only thing there lacking is a faster twist barrel too take advantage of all the bullet offerings of today ,if I can say one good thing about the Creedmore it helped bringing back the 6.5 cal giving us more bullet offerings , but but you and I know the 6.5x55 Swede had figured it out a long time ago.

 

[Hard rock]

Weall know that's how Weatherby lowered the chamber pressure on his mag Cartridges it must work because they are alive and well .. I experience some of these new cartridges operate at higher pressure than some mag cartridges allowing more vel with less powder, also the brass is way better than it used too be Lapua versus Win., rem ,Nosler etc . The Lapua brass in my 25-284 allows me too achieve 3874 fps with a 90 gr hammer I know you know that is 257 Weatherby territory.The 284 case is a wild- caters dream case it already had a very thick Webb now made even stronger with Lapua .Back too the magnums most hand loaders probably don't know the tricks too the trade getting the most out of a given cartridge I do , you do and many members on this forum do I'm glad te 6.5 Cartridges are getting noticed these days because there has been a lot of great ones over the years.The only thing there lacking is a faster twist barrel too take advantage of all the bullet offerings of today ,if I can say one good thing about the Creedmore it helped bringing back the 6.5 cal giving us more bullet offerings , but but you and I know the 6.5x55 Swede had figured it out a long time ago.

Once again please excuse my punctuations and wording , I'm on my 1st cup of trying too get over the COVID nothing better too day , but might slip over too my private range

 

[TXTrained]

Stumbling around into all these old threads I decided a why not thread is in order. Lets compare the three Cartridges. Specify Necked down 7mm Rem Mag Brass for the .264 against the PRC and SAUM of the same Caliber. Who's got the skinny? ( I don't have any PRC or SAUM Brass anyway )

I shoot the 6.5 PRC and 300 PRC and I can shoot 2 miles with the 300 PRC or 1 mile with my 6.5 PRC.
I shoit the 6.5 PRC More because of real estate constraints. Our range has a goid mile shot.I have to go to a friends to practice shooting the 2 mile shots.

 

[Wild Monkey]

What's all the amazement about, I've been shooting the 6.5 rem short mag for 5 DECADES !!! BIG GREEN tried this concept back in the early 70's or late 60's, they even used the short barrel in there 600/660's, your all way behind the times....where have you guys been...astonishingly some of you have never even heard of the original short magnum super 6.5....rookies !!

No Doubt today the Ole 6.5 Remmy would be a candidate with proper twist barrel. I believe I've remembered a cartridge to put the old Remmy down for good. Originally in 30 Cal and down sized with 40 degree shoulder. The 300 RCM is the perfect dog for this fight in .264.

 

[TXTrained]

I mainly am looking at accuracy first then speed, wanting one that is good for 800 + yards. I have a 28 Nosler that is good for 1000+ for anything in North America.

Oh yeah,, I agree .I shoot the 6.5 PRC and 300 PRC. There is not any animal that the 300 PRC can not kill.
Two years ago the elk fell in 3 steps from the 6.5 PRC and rolled down the hill.The shot was 415 yards.
48 years prior I shot an elk in WY on same mountain at almost same distance with my Remington 700 ADL in 270 Win with 130 grain silver tip.Elk also stumbled and fell after 3 steps.Almost Identical.My Uncle was my guide on both hunts..
This year the 300 PRC The bull elk humped up and fell over in NM.
So with all that said
I'd take the 6.5 PRC over the other 6.5's because of readily available Hornady 147gr and 143 grain factory ammo.
I was able to buy $1000. Worth of Hornady Match 147 grain during the bad covid.It took me and my wife and my son several trips with the limits Academy had..But I got it and thats all that matters.

I have and really like the PRC with the 153.5/156 and H1000 it really works. Hits a lot harder than the Creedmoor

 

[Michael Eichele]

What's all the amazement about, I've been shooting the 6.5 rem short mag for 5 DECADES !!! BIG GREEN tried this concept back in the early 70's or late 60's, they even used the short barrel in there 600/660's, your all way behind the times....where have you guys been...astonishingly some of you have never even heard of the original short magnum super 6.5....rookies !!

I wanted to build a 6.5 Rem except brass availability was nil. A year later the PRC was introduced with ammo and brass along with high quality rifles. Unfortunately, the Rem is dead.

 

[ridgeline300]

No flies on the PRC. Expect to see Berger factory loaded ammo now there's Lapua brass.

ADG makes 6.5 SAUM brass too….

I did see some previews of Berger ammo loaded with 156's... that'll be huge. I know ADG makes saum brass but I was just arguing the point that the PRC has several different options.

If I was building another, I would no doubt do a 6.5 SAUM. But I have a complete reloading set up and tons of powder - all I would need is brass. For the guy that isn't terribly serious and maybe wants to shoot factory until he gets set up to reload, or he doesn't have the cash to build a custom, the 6.5 PRC makes perfect sense.