6.5mm-303 Epps data

[Varmtr]

G'Day

I'm wondering if anyone has reload data for the 6.5mm-303 Epps, quick load or load from a disk.
The rifle is a Winchester P14. Powder wise ADI or Reloader or Hodgdon's ( which some is made by ADI ). I'm thinking I will most likely need a burn rate around the ADI2213SC powder or equivalent, give or take.
Not sure what projectiles will be running as yet so hopefully a bit of a spread sheet for different weight projectiles and powder if possible.

Cheers
Rossco

 

[HARPERC]

Intersting! I had not heard of this one many years. No info-just tagging in curious as to what you learn.

 

[Varmtr]

Intersting! I had not heard of this one many years. No info-just tagging in curious as to what you learn.

Yeh its an oldie. I got a reply from ballistic studies in New Zealand with some data but for the 25-303 Epps. With 117gr SST start around 43gr of AR2213SC at least it's a start even thou I'm running the 6.5-303 Epps.
Read a couple of articles of the 25-303 Epps here and from what they say you can get them fairly honkin.

 

[Deleted member 46119]

I don't have my Ackley book handy and I can not find the dimensions online.

Do you have more information so I can model it properly?

 

[Varmtr]

I don't have my Ackley book handy and I can not find the dimensions online.

Do you have more information so I can model it properly?

G'Day

The case dimensions are from what I can find is:

Neck length 0.334".
Shoulder angle 35 degrees
Case diameter at shoulder. 0.445"
Base to shoulder 1.735"
Case head diameter 0.455"
Case length 2.175" I think
Case capacity 55.2 grains of water

Cheers
Rossco

 

[Deleted member 46119]

G'Day

The case dimensions are from what I can find is:

Neck length 0.334".
Shoulder angle 35 degrees
Case diameter at shoulder. 0.445"
Base to shoulder 1.735"
Case head diameter 0.455"
Case length 2.175" I think
Case capacity 55.2 grains of water

Cheers
Rossco

Does this look right or close enough (a few .0001 doesn't matter)

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Case capacity of that drawing is 58 so we are close.

I can get QL to do Reloader, some ADI and Hodgdon where H4831 is the same as ADI 2213SC Hodgdon and ADI Powder Equivalents « Daily Bulletin

 

[gunners]

I have developed a 303 Mad wild cat based off the Brit case like the EPPS but with even more capacity. Reloder 17 seems to go well even in a pressure handicapped action like a No4 mk1. AR 2209 has proven quite accurate as well, I don't think you should have to many issues with a reasonably strong action like a P14 starting around the 25-303 EPPS and working up. Also it looks like similar capacity to a 6.5x55 apart from shoulder angle. I would probably weigh some water in a fired neck resized case, and if close use the starting data for that and work up from that.
I used 30-06 starting loads -2 grains when I started my development as it seemed to be the closest comparable case, I have 66+ gr H2O capacity and I think a 30-06 is about 67-68 and comparable charges seem to yield comparable velocities

 

[Varmtr]

Case capacity of that drawing is 58 so we are close.

I can get QL to do Reloader, some ADI and Hodgdon where H4831 is the same as ADI 2213SC Hodgdon and ADI Powder Equivalents « Daily Bulletin

G'Day
That picture looks pretty much spot on. Thanks for that.
A QL loading data would terrific would give a few options on powders charge weights etc.
Cheers
Rossco

 

[Varmtr]

I have developed a 303 Mad wild cat based off the Brit case like the EPPS but with even more capacity. Reloder 17 seems to go well even in a pressure handicapped action like a No4 mk1. AR 2209 has proven quite accurate as well, I don't think you should have to many issues with a reasonably strong action like a P14 starting around the 25-303 EPPS and working up. Also it looks like similar capacity to a 6.5x55 apart from shoulder angle. I would probably weigh some water in a fired neck resized case, and if close use the starting data for that and work up from that.
I used 30-06 starting loads -2 grains when I started my development as it seemed to be the closest comparable case, I have 66+ gr H2O capacity and I think a 30-06 is about 67-68 and comparable charges seem to yield comparable velocities

Would very intersted in this 303 wildcat you have

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Cartridge : 6.5-.303 Epps
Bullet : .264, 129, Nosler AccuBond LR 58943 G7
Useable Case Capaci: 51.521 grain H2O = 3.345 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.985 inch = 75.82 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch = 609.6 mm
Powder : Hodgdon H4831

Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.326% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !

Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms

-23.3 71 32.99 1911 1046 18823 6131 73.1 1.888
-20.9 74 33.99 1966 1108 20108 6434 74.8 1.840
-18.6 76 34.99 2023 1172 21481 6739 76.5 1.792
-16.3 78 35.99 2080 1240 22950 7045 78.1 1.746
-14.0 80 36.99 2138 1310 24521 7351 79.7 1.700
-11.6 82 37.99 2197 1383 26203 7657 81.3 1.656
-09.3 84 38.99 2256 1458 28002 7961 82.9 1.613
-07.0 87 39.99 2316 1537 29932 8261 84.4 1.571
-04.7 89 40.99 2376 1618 31999 8558 85.8 1.529
-02.3 91 41.99 2437 1702 34216 8850 87.2 1.489
+00.0 93 42.99 2499 1788 36595 9135 88.6 1.450
+02.3 95 43.99 2560 1878 39151 9413 89.9 1.403
+04.7 97 44.99 2622 1970 41901 9682 91.1 1.359 ! Near Maximum !
+07.0 100 45.99 2685 2064 44859 9942 92.3 1.316 ! Near Maximum !
+09.3 102 46.99 2747 2162 48047 10190 93.4 1.275 ! Near Maximum !
+11.6 104 47.99 2810 2262 51488 10426 94.4 1.235 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!

Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 93 42.99 2658 2024 43698 9626 95.4 1.337 ! Near Maximum !
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 93 42.99 2311 1530 30283 8274 78.9 1.562

 

[Deleted member 46119]

G'Day
That picture looks pretty much spot on. Thanks for that.
A QL loading data would terrific would give a few options on powders charge weights etc.
Cheers
Rossco

Ok, I made one with a Nosler 129 ABLR.

I need to know your actual bullet and COAL.

 

[gunners]

That's some terrific work jfseaman, the pressure could run a bit higher though seeing its in a P14 action ( essentially a Mauser style action) not a weak SMLE action. Need the COAL and actual case capacity to refine it, I'm thinking H 4831 is too slow to fully utilise your rifles capability
Varmtr I'll have to take some pictures to show you, it's running 2810 for a 150 gr and 2620 for a 174gr from a 22 inch barrel on a No 4 action. Had some faster loads but my chrono fell over and bent the screens

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Yeah, you probably can go higher on the pressure in a P14.

Still need to know which bullet and COAL for more accurate load tables. Faster powder that could reach the max of the action makes this important to me. Safety first.