6.5 saum ladder test, with pics

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by odoylerules, Jun 27, 2018.

  1. odoylerules

    odoylerules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    264
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2016
    F8699B84-114C-4644-89BD-C3D65AF115B1.jpeg 69979B28-5DBB-495B-9EAF-C32432620F32.jpeg 72FB3396-4D71-40C3-BBB0-A6196A710468.jpeg 6.5 saum gap 4s, .081freebore, Hornady head stamped brass. H-1000 pushing Berger 140 hybrids, .015” off. Brux 24” barrel #5 contour. Target at 650 yards, 8mph winds gusting to 12.
    Looks to me like 2 pretty distinct harmonic nodes to play with. Both have nearly the same vertical (sub 2.5”).
    I never had a stiff bolt lift. I can see light ejector marks on almost all the fired brass, but it got more noticeable in the higher cluster. I sighted in with 58.0 of h-1000 and had the magnetospeed on with average velocity of 2988fps. Took it off during the ladder.
    What I’m wrestling with is which node to tune/work on. I’m sure the higher node will beat up the brass faster.
    Thoughts? Experiences?
    Thanks guys
     
  2. codyadams

    codyadams Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,182
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2015
    Either node looks good, I would shoot for the middle of either, 59ish or 61ish, if they group well, which it appears they do. I'm just suprised that it's reaching pressure at that velocity. I'm running my .260 Ackley at 3070 fps with 140 VLD's, and had 12 fireings on my lapua brass before I started to loose them due to lostening primer pockets, and that is with 49.1 grains or Reloder 26. My load in my new brass is the 147 at 3040, and I expect the same results. With that much more capacity, I would think 3100 would be easy. What velocity do you think your higher node is? Perhaps it's the softer hornady brass showing pressure signs?
     
  3. odoylerules

    odoylerules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    264
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2016
    I’ll load up some in each node and test groups and record velocities today or tomorrow. I suspect the higher node will be between 3100-3150fps.
     
  4. Elk Hunter 338

    Elk Hunter 338 Well-Known Member LRH Team Member

    Messages:
    819
    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2010
    my experience is 59.5-60.5 h1000 dependent upon a lot of things 140 hybrid .015-.030 off.
     
    Rick Richard likes this.
  5. odoylerules

    odoylerules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    264
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2016
    Do you think it matters what freebore? Mine is the .081.
     
    Elk Hunter 338 likes this.
  6. odoylerules

    odoylerules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    264
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2016
    The reason I ask is that powder range you’re saying is right where the 2 clusters split with my ladder test. From 59.5 to 60.5 is where the vertical jumped significantly.
     
  7. Timnterra

    Timnterra Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    879
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2012
    If it was me I’d load a 5 round group of 59gr and one of 61gr and shoot them at 100 or 200 yds, which ever grouped best is the one i’d use. If the groups I got were around 1/2 moa I’d be done, if not I’d take the better and load three or four groups of different seating depths and take the best group.
     
    rfurman24 and Canhunter35 like this.
  8. Elk Hunter 338

    Elk Hunter 338 Well-Known Member LRH Team Member

    Messages:
    819
    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2010
    nope .081 is the good too go and used for just about every rifle built out there if its ran with a DBM, if its on a longer XM or bdl setup where the mag box is 3.00 or longer it will have .120 or longer in it. the .081 FB is bad *** youll see it speed up around 100-200 rounds, this FB will allow you to burn in the sweet spot for the entire life of the barrel. also this powder range I suggested is for I would say 90% of rifles it will lay in about 3025-3075 and on fired hornady brass for any case life..
     
    Rick Richard likes this.
  9. odoylerules

    odoylerules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    264
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2016
    88F23DE6-0CED-4E71-B905-7CAB9006C565.jpeg C09E79A3-1A7E-4315-857C-6ECCCC1BEFAE.jpeg F200224F-0A09-4E73-9AED-EFBDE27898CA.jpeg 02757037-C754-408A-976C-AB1F8885BF7C.jpeg 6A680961-36C1-40BD-8316-76529533FC2A.jpeg 0B564C53-9D03-4A4F-B28B-394360FBDCA9.jpeg F6BD2B26-F034-45B5-8EA6-1AC0CBB1CF10.jpeg When to shoot groups at 100 yards and check chrono numbers with the magneto speed. The mirage was terrible but still every group seemed to be around half MOA or less with occasional flyers. I’ve done no seating depth testing yet. Running at .015” off.
    Here’s the breakdown-
    58.8- 3060fps avg SD 3.7
    59.1- 3065fps avg SD 3.8
    59.4- 3076fps avg SD 4.3

    60.4- 3119fps avg SD 8.1
    60.7- 3129fps avg SD 11.2
    61.0- 3135fps avg SD 10.0
    61.3- 3157fps avg SD 14.3
     
  10. cathead

    cathead Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    122
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2012
    Need to try 59.8
     
  11. cathead

    cathead Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    122
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2012
    Magneto speed on barrel will also affect group size
     
  12. Crowe284

    Crowe284 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    494
    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2016
    I recently developed a load with the hornady brass in a 6.5 4s built by GAP for a buddy of mine. I could not go any higher than than 57.2 grains without beating the tar out of the brass and losing primer pockets after 1 firing....The load I settled on might yield 3 loadings before pockets are gone....

    57.2 grains of h1k and the 143 eldx yielded 2954 fps with an Es of 7 and an sd of 2.4 with 10 cold bore shots over magnetospeed and 1/4 moa accuracy out to 600 yds which is as far as I have tested the load.

    Its a shame that the hornady brass is this poor...the performance of this load with the 143 eldx is similar to the 6.5 PRC....The load will be just fine for him shooting south Texas whitetails but leaves 100 fps on the table compared to my personal rifle with 60 grains of h1000 in worked Remington 300 saum Brass. Bought the hornady brass just to see for myself if it had gotten any better...apparently not. This brass was the 3rd run stuff which was supposed to be better...When his brass is toast, I’ll probably work some Norma brass for him...should have done this from the beginning.
     
  13. Elk Hunter 338

    Elk Hunter 338 Well-Known Member LRH Team Member

    Messages:
    819
    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2010
    is this all with new brass?? the reason I ask like many have stated to keep the brass worth a crap for very long it needs to be ran in the 59 60gr range with some a little lower .. if you have Bertram or Remington brass rod the piss out of it and it wont matter the primer pockets will last as long as the barrel.

    remember that it will speed up so don't look at the speed to much, one of mine that I have now went from 3050 new to 3175 after 250 rounds and hasn't budged.
     
  14. odoylerules

    odoylerules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    264
    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2016
    It’s used and came with 250 rounds on the barrel when I got it.