WildRose
Well-Known Member
26" works great for me, but 162gr is the highest weight I see any need to shoot.
I've shot it side by side with the 7mm mag and it's a clearly superior caliber.
300 RUM or 7mm with 180 bergers at 3000 fps
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I've shot it side by side with the 7mm mag and it's a clearly superior caliber.
We've rechambered 7RM's to 7 STW in 24" barrels and the difference is less than 100fps. A lot of times it's closer to 50. At 26" the STW can be quite a bit faster and at 28+" it's stretching it's legs. The more powder through a given bore the more it benefits from a longer barrel.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Comparing the same powders that will certainly be true. However you can also use a faster burning powder to accomplish pretty much the same thing.
A slow powder in a 7RM is generally a faster powder for a 7STW. So comparing the same powder, no matter what it is, makes it already faster in the STW. If you go even faster you can get some velocity back but a lot of times you lose accuracy. There is definately a point of diminishing returns when you go to shorter barrels in high capacity cases.
I know 7 STW's quite well. I currently have 3 of them and have built 10+ for myself and several for friends over the last 20 years. I've shot bullets from 120-180gr in 24" to 30" barrels. 130gr Sierra Single Shot pistol bullets and 180gr JLK's/Bergers do amazing things to rockchucks, squirrels, crows, coyotes, etc. It and a couple different .30 caliber magnums use to be my go to rockchuck guns. I personally wouldn't build one in a 24" barrel again. I'd build something like a 7mm-.300 Win Mag. or a standard 7RM.
I know 7 STW's quite well. I currently have 3 of them and have built 10+ for myself and several for friends over the last 20 years. I've shot bullets from 120-180gr in 24" to 30" barrels. 130gr Sierra Single Shot pistol bullets and 180gr JLK's/Bergers do amazing things to rockchucks, squirrels, crows, coyotes, etc. It and a couple different .30 caliber magnums use to be my go to rockchuck guns. I personally wouldn't build one in a 24" barrel again. I'd build something like a 7mm-.300 Win Mag. or a standard 7RM.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
"Point of Diminishing Returns" is somethign I see throughout the 7's. You can just push them so fast and when you pass that point it seems like no matter how much more powder you put in there you just aren't getting much in return.
It doesnt' seem to much matter if you are talking .280 Rem or 7 Rum, they all seem to be that way.
I like the 26" for a rifle I'm going to have to carry, but when I rebuild my current 7STW It's losing the magnum sporter taper 26" and moving up to either a 28 or 30" in a Sendero Taper.
It does get to be a PITA though finding cases to fit them... .
And it's a PITA to pack them on a motorcycle into deer country too
. Hell it's a PITA to pack a 30" barrel over your shoulder. They tend to snag on everything you try to walk under.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
That's one reason I carry everything barrel down whether it's slung over my back or across my chest... .gun)And it's a PITA to pack them on a motorcycle into deer country too
Anyway you do it though you are right. The added length is just a PITA any way you are transporting them.
etisll40
Well-Known Member
More velocity, less meat. At these ranges I'd build a 6mm for whitetail.
4xforfun
Well-Known Member
ohhh......mmmyyyy.....god!!
pyroducksx3
Well-Known Member
I haven't got back in touch with the smith yet, he's out hunting but just to clarify I'm going with a 26" barrel, no longer no shorter. The rem mag has the lead right now but looking at the 7 stw. Also starting to think I'd run 168 either way I go
but just to clarify I'm going with a 26" barrel, no longer no shorter. The rem mag has the lead right now but looking at the 7 stw. Also starting to think I'd run 168 either way I go
4xforfun
Well-Known Member
I haven't got back in touch with the smith yet, he's out hunting
If you are going 7mm rem/stw...good for you. We have been shooting both 168 and 180 JLK's.....I gotta go with the 180's, unless, of course, the 168's group noticably better. BC's are over the top and have performed well on the critters.
Not alot of experiance with the STW, but H1000 and RL 25 in the 7mm RM with the big bullets works well. And if you are thinking 800+ yards, go with the big bullets. The 140-150's pushed fast are a touch flatter up close, but by 800 yards are getting smoked in both velocity and energy by the 180 class bullets pushed 200 fps slower out the muzzle!! Yes, the 154 interbond will still be 6" flatter at 800...but so what, you need to dial/hold over anyway, like 115+ inches anyway (at 800 with a 300 yard zero @ 2900/3100 fps) ) .... what is an extra 3/4 moa?
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pyroducksx3
Well-Known Member
I am going the 7 RM/STW route, which is a hard choice because I am in love with the idea of a 300 RUM. But I asked this smith, who shoots more in a year than I do in a lifetime and builds more guns and does many different hunts a year, what he thought. I told him my hunting conditions and what I wanted to do with the rifle and without hesitation he recommended the 7 RM. I asked him even over the 300 RUM and he had very valid reason why the 7 over that big 30. So I thought why ask a very experienced professional what I should do and then not listen to him.
As to powders I tried H1000 in my RM with the 168 bergers and it did ok but the H4831 gave me much better ES but depending of which bullet I go with I might try it again
4xforfun
Well-Known Member
Don't make your decision based totaly on ES numbers. My main "deal" is shooting 1000 benchrest....and in 1K, I was told, ES is EVERYTHING!!!! I'm here to tell you it is not......long range group size and shape is king. It is all that matters!! My LG at this years IBS nationals was horse sh^% comparied to most of what I am used to as far as ES goes. The result.... The moral of this story is don't place to high a standard on ES.
H or IMR 4831 is to fast, in my opinion, for the 7mm rem, and I think maybe in everyones opinion with the 7 STW with the heavyer bullets. Like I have said before on other threads...I have been in love with the H1000/7mm/big bullet combination since thay came out with H1000. I have been a RL 25 lover in the 300 WBY with big bullets since RL 25 came out. I was messing with my dads origonal, factory, 24" bbled 7mm rem mag from the early 60's and 180 JLK's and tried RL25.....wow. I then tried My brothers custom 7mm with a 26" Hart....wow again!!! Silly speed with silly accuracy.
I would imagin with the STW that H1000, RL 22-25, Retumbo, and maybe a few that slip my mind would be awsome with the 168/180 class bullets. Big boilers love big bullets and slow powders!!!
Now, in 1000 yard comp. I will give up MASSIVE amounts of speed for extream accuracy. My very first comp BBL was a 300 wby. It had two very accurate loads....74 gr rl 25 and 82 grains of rl25....the difference....... about 2" at 1000 yards. That is HUGE....HUGE in 1K comp.....Result....3rd overall in The IBS SOY points race and rookie of the year. To a deer, we are talking an extra inch from center. Nothing.....Take the speed. Sure...if we are talking 1" 300 yard groups vs 4" 300 yard groups it is a no brainer...take the accuracy rout!! I guess what I am saying here is pick a burn rate that gets you the most speed and start your search for accuracy there. Don't try and re-invent the wheel by trying non standard powders...sure, you might stumble upon something, but more likely than not, you will find the answer with the proper burn rate. With the STW and big/bigger bullets, that is powder in the s...l...o...w catigory!!
This is the FUN part.....the load development....the bench time.....time at the loading bench...It's all good.....BIG FUN!!
Good luck...I was just re reading my post, and you know what.....I sure am a long winded SOB!!!
The moral of this story is don't place to high a standard on ES.H or IMR 4831 is to fast, in my opinion, for the 7mm rem, and I think maybe in everyones opinion with the 7 STW with the heavyer bullets. Like I have said before on other threads...I have been in love with the H1000/7mm/big bullet combination since thay came out with H1000. I have been a RL 25 lover in the 300 WBY with big bullets since RL 25 came out. I was messing with my dads origonal, factory, 24" bbled 7mm rem mag from the early 60's and 180 JLK's and tried RL25.....wow. I then tried My brothers custom 7mm with a 26" Hart....wow again!!! Silly speed with silly accuracy.
I would imagin with the STW that H1000, RL 22-25, Retumbo, and maybe a few that slip my mind would be awsome with the 168/180 class bullets. Big boilers love big bullets and slow powders!!!
Now, in 1000 yard comp. I will give up MASSIVE amounts of speed for extream accuracy. My very first comp BBL was a 300 wby. It had two very accurate loads....74 gr rl 25 and 82 grains of rl25....the difference....... about 2" at 1000 yards. That is HUGE....HUGE in 1K comp.....Result....3rd overall in The IBS SOY points race and rookie of the year. To a deer, we are talking an extra inch from center. Nothing.....Take the speed. Sure...if we are talking 1" 300 yard groups vs 4" 300 yard groups it is a no brainer...take the accuracy rout!! I guess what I am saying here is pick a burn rate that gets you the most speed and start your search for accuracy there. Don't try and re-invent the wheel by trying non standard powders...sure, you might stumble upon something, but more likely than not, you will find the answer with the proper burn rate. With the STW and big/bigger bullets, that is powder in the s...l...o...w catigory!!
This is the FUN part.....the load development....the bench time.....time at the loading bench...It's all good.....BIG FUN!!
Good luck...I was just re reading my post, and you know what.....I sure am a long winded SOB!!!
pyroducksx3
Well-Known Member
Lol I appreciate all the input, thank you. I may try the Rl but most likely the H1000. The smith is nice enough to give you load data for barrels he chambers so hopefully I won't spend to much time tinkering and more time in the field shooting and less Rome at the range. I just got back from an elk hunt, no luck, but did find a rock at 412 that was looking at me wrong. I know that's not far for most but it's my longest. This longrange shooting is fun and I can't wait till duck season is over to get out shooting and get out further
I appreciate all the input, thank you. I may try the Rl but most likely the H1000. The smith is nice enough to give you load data for barrels he chambers so hopefully I won't spend to much time tinkering and more time in the field shooting and less Rome at the range. I just got back from an elk hunt, no luck, but did find a rock at 412 that was looking at me wrong. I know that's not far for most but it's my longest. This longrange shooting is fun and I can't wait till duck season is over to get out shooting and get out further
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