300 Norma Mag Improved. Follow along!!!

[Elk Hunter 338]

Definitely dude. They kill super well within their limitations no doubt! Just such a low BC leaves you looking for more for true long range capability, especially when considering wind and not just drops.

drops are easy .. the wind will get you every time!! in my previous 300 rum I did the unthinkable, I made a load for 0-400'sh 200 accubond and a load for 400 to whatever 215 hybrid.. both shared the same ballistics too 400 and same 200 yard zero. both almost identical speed.
It worked extremely well .. i will probably do that again this year!! i will see if the 181 at 3500fps will match up to anything
just a thought...

 

[Huntnful]

drops are easy .. the wind will get you every time!! in my previous 300 rum I did the unthinkable, I made a load for 0-400'sh 200 accubond and a load for 400 to whatever 215 hybrid.. both shared the same ballistics too 400 and same 200 yard zero. both almost identical speed.
It worked extremely well .. i will probably do that again this year!! i will see if the 181 at 3500fps will match up to anything
just a thought...

Oh that would work out great! I'm not a fan of accubonds for long range, but going 3100fps or so out to 400 yards be legit for them!!

My 181 and these 225's were only .1 Mil out in vertical and left to right between the 100 yards zeros. It'll be easy to switch back and forth for sure. I've just always been wary of mixing the coppers inside the barrel when switch between bullets. You ever notice much effect from that?

Also, I intentionally didn't clean my barrel before testing the 225's to see if it made much a difference.

 

[jessej]

i will see if the 181 at 3500fps will match up to anything
just a thought...

Now your talkin my speed!
Pun intended.

 

[Elk Hunter 338]

Oh that would work out great! I'm not a fan of accubonds for long range, but going 3100fps or so out to 400 yards be legit for them!!

My 181 and these 225's were only .1 Mil out in vertical and left to right between the 100 yards zeros. It'll be easy to switch back and forth for sure. I've just always been wary of mixing the coppers inside the barrel when switch between bullets. You ever notice much effect from that?

Also, I intentionally didn't clean my barrel before testing the 225's to see if it made much a difference.

well you've sent enough rounds down range to know if the bullet mixed and matched would be a deal breaker or not and setting them in there like a boss with the very soft jacketed 225 ELDM is proving your dual load capability quite well.

I actually have a customer that shoots 210 vld and the 181 hammer in a 20" 300 RUM as described and loves the combo hasn't had a problem with them at all.

 

[Huntnful]

well you've sent enough rounds down range to know if the bullet mixed and matched would be a deal breaker or not and setting them in there like a boss with the very soft jacketed 225 ELDM is proving your dual load capability quite well.

I actually have a customer that shoots 210 vld and the 181 hammer in a 20" 300 RUM as described and loves the combo hasn't had a problem with them at all.

Yeah that's a good point lol. I can switch back and forth for myself and see if it hold tight groups.

 

[PapaSmurff]

Yeah that's a good point lol. I can switch back and forth for myself and see if it hold tight groups.

You should be fine working up a dual load using hammers and then another high bc lead core for the second. I have done it many times for several of my rifles. I usually use Berger's or Hornady ELD-M's for the high bc bullet. It also usually equates to my high bc lead cores having a 200 yard sight in while the hammers have a 150 yard sight in, not having to adjust my scope settings for sight in elevation and just running whichever ballistic chart I'm hunting with that day. However, it seems like every rifle I've dual loaded for the Hammers shoot 4 to 5 clicks to the right on windage. So I have to remember which load is sighted in windage wise when I take the rifle out hunting and adjust the windage setting accordingly if I need to switch loads for a longer range shot. It's not that big of a deal though. Have dual loaded with hammers for 26 Nosler, 28 Nosler, 7mm R'em Mag, several 300 PRC's, and 338 Lapua as well as one 300 Norma Mag.

P.S. Every 300 PRC or 300 Norma Mag I have loaded Hammers for thus far LOVE the 199's. The 199's usually shoot in the .1 MOA's if loaded 1 in 9" twist or faster barrels for the above mentioned calibers that I've load developed for, it's turning into my favorite Hammer bullet thus far.

 

[Huntnful]

You should be fine working up a dual load using hammers and then another high bc lead core for the second. I have done it many times for several of my rifles. I usually use Berger's or Hornady ELD-M's for the high bc bullet. It also usually equates to my high bc lead cores having a 200 yard sight in while the hammers have a 150 yard sight in, not having to adjust my scope settings for sight in elevation and just running whichever ballistic chart I'm hunting with that day. However, it seems like every rifle I've dual loaded for the Hammers shoot 4 to 5 clicks to the right on windage. So I have to remember which load is sighted in windage wise when I take the rifle out hunting and adjust the windage setting accordingly if I need to switch loads for a longer range shot. It's not that big of a deal though. Have dual loaded with hammers for 26 Nosler, 28 Nosler, 7mm R'em Mag, several 300 PRC's, and 338 Lapua as well as one 300 Norma Mag.

P.S. Every 300 PRC or 300 Norma Mag I have loaded Hammers for thus far LOVE the 199's. The 199's usually shoot in the .1 MOA's if loaded 1 in 9" twist or faster barrels for the above mentioned calibers that I've load developed for, it's turning into my favorite Hammer bullet thus far.

Great info!!! Thanks a bunch!!

I may actually just toy with having a true dual load, and being comfortable with switching from each bullet at a given yardage. Their 100 yard zeros are almost identical zeros so it's a very practical situation.

 

[Huntnful]

It's nice that it's daylight so early I can actually shoot before work haha. Yesterday I tried seating bullets a little deeper, and groups opened up slightly. I didn't have any bullet seated longer to test out though.

Today I seated some bullets extra long and just seated them to depth at the range. The bottom group was my original starting load. I adjusted up and then tried .01 longer and .025 longer. It got rid of the vertical with .01 longer depth and maintain a pretty good group considering how windy it was. I was holding .2 Mils left for every shot.

Also, the velocities over the last 18 rounds while testing the 225's.

 

[Quicksilver338]

Try making smaller seating depth adjustments from 3.616 in .005" increments out to 3.631. Not sure how picky the eld bullets are, but for my experience for bergers you can go from a good group to a phenomenal group by tuning in that narrow seating depth window. I've had a couple rifles go from 1/2 to 1/3-1/4 groups from that. I usually get them down too a .003" window then maintain that distance and measure the lands after every cleaning. A lot of work but seems to keep the rifle in its happy place.

 

[Huntnful]

Try making smaller seating depth adjustments from 3.616 in .005" increments out to 3.631. Not sure how picky the eld bullets are, but for my experience for bergers you can go from a good group to a phenomenal group by tuning in that narrow seating depth window. I've had a couple rifles go from 1/2 to 1/3-1/4 groups from that. I usually get them down too a .003" window then maintain that distance and measure the lands after every cleaning. A lot of work but seems to keep the rifle in its happy place.

Oh I'm definitely sure I coulda ultra fine tune it, but being totally honest, I don't want a load/bullet that I have to measure the lands every time I clean and constantly make seating depth adjustments to keep up with it. Also why I'm still avoiding the Berger's, even though I have them on the shelf lol. I'd definitely prefer a wider seating depth window with .5-.6 accuracy throughout the duration of maybe 100-200 rounds, than a .003 window that I constantly have to chase to get 3/8 MOA. I'm just trying to kill things at decent yardages. That's my one and only goal. Now I would LOVE a .3-.5 consistent shooter, don't get me wrong on that, but not if it's not a little forgiving when it starts getting to the edge of the node.

I'm also pretty new at all this and could be thinking about it totally wrong lol.

 

[Huntnful]

Try making smaller seating depth adjustments from 3.616 in .005" increments out to 3.631. Not sure how picky the eld bullets are, but for my experience for bergers you can go from a good group to a phenomenal group by tuning in that narrow seating depth window. I've had a couple rifles go from 1/2 to 1/3-1/4 groups from that. I usually get them down too a .003" window then maintain that distance and measure the lands after every cleaning. A lot of work but seems to keep the rifle in its happy place.

I should also be clear that I do like the idea of of them .005 depth tests! I just don't think I would chase 3/8" accuracy if it landed in the middle of two 1/2" accuracy depths if that makes sense? I'd rather have 1/2 MOA accuracy for .015 throat erosion and not have to touch it, than 3/8 MOA for .005.

 

[willfrye027]

Off topic but that is a really nice shooting setup you have there. Where did you get that huge plate?

And I'm jealous of your shooting range..load work up at distance is a PIA on my range because the morning sun is right in my eyes and the wind is always tricky..I'm about an hour and a half south of you. Pretty much limited to 100 yards and shooting as the sun goes down in the summer time.

 

[Huntnful]

Off topic but that is a really nice shooting setup you have there. Where did you get that huge plate?

And I'm jealous of your shooting range..load work up at distance is a PIA on my range because the morning sun is right in my eyes and the wind is always tricky..I'm about an hour and a half south of you. Pretty much limited to 100 yards and shooting as the sun goes down in the summer time.

I been meaning to post a thread about those plates recommending them to people! https://dragontargets.com/dragon-ta...18-x-24-rectangles-3-8-laser-cut-made-in-usa/

 

[Quicksilver338]

I should also be clear that I do like the idea of of them .005 depth tests! I just don't think I would chase 3/8" accuracy if it landed in the middle of two 1/2" accuracy depths if that makes sense? I'd rather have 1/2 MOA accuracy for .015 throat erosion and not have to touch it, than 3/8 MOA for .005.

I get that! A benefit to doing the test anyway would be finding your window or seating depth node. You could load on the lower side of it and be able to let the lands grow while still working through your accuracy window.