280AI with too much head space...options?

[Hayudog]

If you intend to keep the rifle I wouldn't mess with setting the barrel back; just re-fire form and shoot the thing until it's shot out. Size and expand the case neck .001 under bullet diameter. With no primer seat a bullet long in the case. Chamber this dummy round in your rifle. It may take a small amount of effort, but it should go. Extract the round and you should now have a round that is seated to touch the rifling. Seat your bullets in your loaded rounds about .002 or so longer and maybe with a bit more neck tension. When you fire them you should have a case sized to the rifle's chamber. The idea behind seating to touch or lightly jam is to keep the case from moving when the firing pin hits te primer so that all of the pressure is directed forward.

I make a dummie round at zero off the lands for each bullet I load. So, it's easy to set it into the rifling. Did this today. Cases all moved the shoulder forward .oo6. Length of case stayed the same.

 

[25WSM]

That's one way to make it work. Now just be careful how far you push the shoulder back when sizing. So you can call it a 280AI+
Shep

 

[Hayudog]

That's one way to make it work. Now just be careful how far you push the shoulder back when sizing. So you can call it a 280AI+
Shep

Fire forming plus one reload, no further shoulder movement. I'll probably be extra attentive with my notes on this rifle.
BTW. The original gunsmith was a shop with multiple smiths working in it. I spoke with the actual gunsmith that worked on my gun. He straight up said, " if your not happy, we'll redo it". It would involve shipping, so for the time being, I'm going to run it. I know what it is, and will be mindful.
Again thanks for all the support.
Doug

 

[nvschütze]

I hope you find the answer to your problem. I've created two mildcats, and am in the process of creating a third. I draw the cartridge, determine the measurements of the case and have the reamer and headspace gauges made by Dave Manson. I then have Ben Syring at Hornady design the forming and reloading dies from the case drawing. When you as the originator of a shell provide all the measurements, the only avenue for failure is in those who made the tools for you to form the cases and cut the chamber.

 

[25WSM]

There was no failure in the tools used. The failure was the smith who didn't understand how an Ackley needs to be chambered. Your tools can all be perfect. But someone still has to know how to use them. This rifle is not perfect but it seems to belong to a competent reloader who understands what he has now. I would check and see how much the chamber is too deep and mark the barrel somewhere with a +.006 or whatever the number is. Just in case it goes to a new owner they will know. I'm getting ready to build another 280ai for myself. It's a dang nice cartridge. It's just about the perfect cartridge. Plenty of power. Lots of high bc bullets. Not bad on recoil. Not bad on barrels either. Very accurate. I really can't say one bad thing about it. Good luck with it Doug.
Shep

 

[shortgrass]

As easy and simple as the 'fix' is for this, I'd have it set back for proper head space. Any firearm, rifle, shotgun or handgun, that you have to jump through hoops to shoot has far less value than one you don't (have to jump through hoops to shoot). Working up loads for a particular rifle is one thing, having to 'make' the cases first is another,,,,, especially for a hunting rifle. Rifles (or handguns or shotguns) used in competitions are another...

 

[Hayudog]

There was no failure in the tools used. The failure was the smith who didn't understand how an Ackley needs to be chambered. Your tools can all be perfect. But someone still has to know how to use them. This rifle is not perfect but it seems to belong to a competent reloader who understands what he has now. I would check and see how much the chamber is too deep and mark the barrel somewhere with a +.006 or whatever the number is. Just in case it goes to a new owner they will know. I'm getting ready to build another 280ai for myself. It's a dang nice cartridge. It's just about the perfect cartridge. Plenty of power. Lots of high bc bullets. Not bad on recoil. Not bad on barrels either. Very accurate. I really can't say one bad thing about it. Good luck with it Doug.
Shep

Thanks. Good info on marking the gun. It's already in my note book that I keep on each gun. I can see another 280AI in my future.

 

[Hayudog]

As easy and simple as the 'fix' is for this, I'd have it set back for proper head space. Any firearm, rifle, shotgun or handgun, that you have to jump through hoops to shoot has far less value than one you don't (have to jump through hoops to shoot). Working up loads for a particular rifle is one thing, having to 'make' the cases first is another,,,,, especially for a hunting rifle. Rifles (or handguns or shotguns) used in competitions are another...

I don't disagree. And that may be the final outcome.

 

[Troutslayer2]

The problem is that the shoulder of the case in not indexing against the beginning of the shoulder of the chamber. That's how Ackley designed it To work. Have you tried using regular 280 brass instead of Nosler 280AI brass? The Nosler brass does not index against the chamber, or maybe does if it's a minimum headspace chamber which you don't have.

 

[Hayudog]

The problem is that the shoulder of the case in not indexing against the beginning of the shoulder of the chamber. That's how Ackley designed it To work. Have you tried using regular 280 brass instead of Nosler 280AI brass? The Nosler brass does not index against the chamber, or maybe does if it's a minimum headspace chamber which you don't have.

The 280 Rem factory ammo is the ones I've had fail to fire. All of my fire form cases that I seat the bullet touching the rifling have fired and formed correctly. I've now shot new Nosler 280AI brass, and it measures the exact same shoulder datum as fired 280 Rem brass that I loaded. All new Nosler 280 AI shoulders have moved .oo6 forward upon initial firing. And now they are stable.

 

[Troutslayer2]

The 280 Rem factory ammo is the ones I've had fail to fire. All of my fire form cases that I seat the bullet touching the rifling have fired and formed correctly. I've now shot new Nosler 280AI brass, and it measures the exact same shoulder datum as fired 280 Rem brass that I loaded. All new Nosler 280 AI shoulders have moved .oo6 forward upon initial firing. And now they are stable.

Weird. My shoulders were moving .014 farther when shooting Nosler brass in an older format and excessive headspace chamber. I never had failure to fire but like I said earlier- the web was getting so thin from just that first firing that I could and did have case head separation on my 2nd firings. I too was getting great accuracy out of the brand new brass so I just said F it and bought new brass every time which was an expensive way to get there.

 

[25WSM]

.014 is nothing to fire form forward if done properly. Look how far the Dasher is blown forward and getting 10 to 15 firings afterward. Once you knew it was . 014 long you should have fireformed properly from that point on. .014 is getting into the territory of making a false shoulder and fireforming from that. Plus you should use some light oil and slightly reduced load when forming. The oil and lighter load let the case slip back to the bolt face before the front expands forward. This keeps your web area thick and prevents case head separation. People have shot Gibbs and Dasher rifles for yrs with no issues from head
separation.
Shep