Roughneck018
Well-Known Member
I carried my 300 wby with 27" barrel one time an that was enough to know I needed sumthing alot shorter especially if I want to run a suppressor.
280ai barrel length?
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Hand Skills
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Fair enough
I don't think a 20" .280AI will do anything your 7-08 can't. In fact it promises to yield near identical performance in a package that is 2" shorter. I think you misread me, sir. My thinking is that a 7-08 is a short action. That means it will start out shorter and lighter by its very nature. Couple this with a short barrel and the result is a light and handy package. Do you follow the logic? A 7-08 makes a better carbine than a 280.
The 280AI has ~17% more case capacity than the 7-08. As a cartridge, it is better suited to long range by its very nature. Playing to its strengths, a longer barrel can 'leverage' that potential into real gains downrange.
You seem to be implying that no 'leverage' is available. That the performance difference (or ratio) between a 7-08AI and a 280AI is static and linear.
In my experience, this fps 'advantage' possessed by the larger case scales with bullet weight - the heavier the bullet, the larger the difference will be. Lighter bullet, smaller difference. There is some leverage available, depending on how one looks at the equation.
The OP asked a very general question about thoughts on barrel length. 'Better' is a subjective thing - my opinion is no better than yours, but your ego seems hungry today... I know you have some good data on the subject, and I'm always keen to learn.
(For the sake of discussion, let's keep it S.A.A.M.I - the lines can become blurred when using Palma brass in a match chamber with .200+ freebore, and the OP was referencing a Savage Axis afterall
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Roughneck018
Well-Known Member
Thx you sir that's what I was wonderingFair enough
I think you misread me, sir. My thinking is that a 7-08 is a short action. That means it will start out shorter and lighter by its very nature. Couple this with a short barrel and the result is a light and handy package. Do you follow the logic? A 7-08 makes a better carbine than a 280.
The 280AI has ~17% more case capacity than the 7-08. As a cartridge, it is better suited to long range by its very nature. Playing to its strengths, a longer barrel can 'leverage' that potential into real gains downrange.
You seem to be implying that no 'leverage' is available. That the performance difference (or ratio) between a 7-08AI and a 280AI is static and linear.
In my experience, this fps 'advantage' possessed by the larger case scales with bullet weight - the heavier the bullet, the larger the difference will be. Lighter bullet, smaller difference. There is some leverage available, depending on how one looks at the equation.
The OP asked a very general question about thoughts on barrel length. 'Better' is a subjective thing - my opinion is no better than yours, but your ego seems hungry today... I know you have some good data on the subject, and I'm always keen to learn.
(For the sake of discussion, let's keep it S.A.A.M.I - the lines can become blurred when using Palma brass in a match chamber with .200+ freebore, and the OP was referencing a Savage Axis afterall
keithcandler
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 30, 2005
- Messages
- 650
I would run a 27" plus a Gentry muzzle break, screw the supressor. 180g pushing 3000 is a "get'r done" type of deal.
Longer barrels get a lot of the concussion away from your head.
I would not give up 150 fps to use a suppressor, especially for a tractor gun!
Longer barrels get a lot of the concussion away from your head.
I would not give up 150 fps to use a suppressor, especially for a tractor gun!
Fair enough
I think you misread me, sir. My thinking is that a 7-08 is a short action. That means it will start out shorter and lighter by its very nature. Couple this with a short barrel and the result is a light and handy package. Do you follow the logic? A 7-08 makes a better carbine than a 280.
The 280AI has ~17% more case capacity than the 7-08. As a cartridge, it is better suited to long range by its very nature. Playing to its strengths, a longer barrel can 'leverage' that potential into real gains downrange.
You seem to be implying that no 'leverage' is available. That the performance difference (or ratio) between a 7-08AI and a 280AI is static and linear.
In my experience, this fps 'advantage' possessed by the larger case scales with bullet weight - the heavier the bullet, the larger the difference will be. Lighter bullet, smaller difference. There is some leverage available, depending on how one looks at the equation.
The OP asked a very general question about thoughts on barrel length. 'Better' is a subjective thing - my opinion is no better than yours, but your ego seems hungry today... I know you have some good data on the subject, and I'm always keen to learn.
(For the sake of discussion, let's keep it S.A.A.M.I - the lines can become blurred when using Palma brass in a match chamber with .200+ freebore, and the OP was referencing a Savage Axis afterall
The question was about the viability of a 20" 280 AI. Since the OP has a 23" 7-08 AI, which I assume he's happy with, a 20" 280 AI will offer the same or slightly better performance in a package that's roughly 4" shorter (23" plus brake on his 7-08). That's all I was trying to say, sorry if it came out wrong.
Roughneck018
Well-Known Member
It's just a 7mm08 not ai version. Figured I'd start with that an I'll always have the option to make it ai. Have only shot it about 20 times to start breaking in the barrel. Had the action left over from 2014 when I shot in the ibs. It was a 6.5x47 an shot very well but had 284 dia barrel in varmint contour so figured I'd make hunting rifle out of it. Hard to pack around a bench gun for shooting
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Roughneck018
Well-Known Member
Shilen barrel, tubb lug, timney wide trigger, Hart bolt stop, and boyds stock
Shooting big bucks from the cab of a tractor?
BallisticsGuy
Well-Known Member
Given your use case and the fact that there's a suppressor involved, I've decided to pull back from my earlier position. I never count suppressors into the equation because you can't have them in my state but that's (the added blast from short barrels) really the only objection I'd have if someone handed me such a thing. Taking advantage of suppression is a huge deal. Couple that with heavy for caliber (180gr) bullets; even giving up 100-150fps from the shorter barrel, you're still getting a good bit more beef than a 7-08 and it will in fact do long range quite well, you just give up maybe 150-200 yards of supersonic range which I don't think you'll care about. A 7-08 is actually a heck of a long range rig in its own right. A darned sight more ballistically efficient than a .308 with similar bullet weights.
nicholasjohn
Well-Known Member
I would want a longer barrel on a rifle that is chambered for a cartridge like that one. Everybody has a different view on this one, but going much below 24" would negate the performance that I would want from a 280 AI. Large capacity cartridges lose more velocity with barrel length reduction than is commonly believed. The often-quoted number is 25-35 fps/inch. I have not found this to be true. I have a 30-06 AI that showed up with a 26" barrel, and I got around 3000 fps with 180-grain Swift A-Frames. After I hunted with it for a season, I found it to be pretty clumsy, and had it cut back to 24". With no other changes, I was getting 2900 fps muzzle velocity - same load, same chronograph, same everything. Yes, I was surprised, but that's what I got. With lighter bullets, the velocity loss may not have been as much, but it would likely still be more than I had planned on. So, with a short tube on a 280 AI, I would expect velocities somewhere between those generated by the standard 280 and the 7-08. If that's going to do the trick for you, fine & dandy. You'll definitely find the rifle to be quite handy with a 20" barrel, but it may feel a little butt-heavy if you're used to longer barrels than that. One of the reasons a fine bird gun feels so good in the hands is because the typically longer barrels of a shotgun shift the balance of the gun forward. Something to think about there ………...
Roughneck018
Well-Known Member
Not exactly how it works is you see alot of deer while doing chores throughout the day like feeding cattle. And they don't really pay much attention to the tractor. So once you spot a deer it's nice to have the weapon with you so you can get out an stalk into position for a shot. As a farmer I don't get vacation days or time off to go hunting. So I have to do what I can to harvest a deer an take advantage of targets of opportunity. It's not like I'm running them down in the buggy with an ar15 and 60 round mag killing everything I see.
16.25" 308 Winchester
Troutslayer2
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- Joined
- May 28, 2010
- Messages
- 755
I have 22" on mine and pushing 168 grain 2905 FPS. I'd happily accept 2850 and a 20" barrel. For me it is all about how easy it is to carry in the woods while strapped on my backpack.
