264 win mag vs 6.5-284/6.5-06
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I'll take a shot at this since it seems no one else will.
1. Nothing wrong with the 264 Win, but it has a belt and the bench rest crowd doesn't like belts.
2. 6.5x284 has an excellant reputation for accuracy. (well deserved).
3. Factory rifles in 264 Win usually have twist rates >= 9" so it doesn't stabilize the 140's as well.
4. Not as efficient as 6.5x284, handloads easily equal or exceed factory 264 velocities.
5. Although, properly handloaded to equal pressures the 264 Win is capable of more velocity.
264 just hit a wall when the 7mm Rem was released and couldn't regain any momentum. I can't help but think that the 264 Win when properly loaded in the right (8" twist, 26+ barrel) rifle makes a helluva LR rifle. Just my 2 cents.
1. Nothing wrong with the 264 Win, but it has a belt and the bench rest crowd doesn't like belts.
2. 6.5x284 has an excellant reputation for accuracy. (well deserved).
3. Factory rifles in 264 Win usually have twist rates >= 9" so it doesn't stabilize the 140's as well.
4. Not as efficient as 6.5x284, handloads easily equal or exceed factory 264 velocities.
5. Although, properly handloaded to equal pressures the 264 Win is capable of more velocity.
264 just hit a wall when the 7mm Rem was released and couldn't regain any momentum. I can't help but think that the 264 Win when properly loaded in the right (8" twist, 26+ barrel) rifle makes a helluva LR rifle. Just my 2 cents.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Yep. I still can't figure out where the prejudice against belted mags is coming from.I'll take a shot at this since it seems no one else will.
1. Nothing wrong with the 264 Win, but it has a belt and the bench rest crowd doesn't like belts.
2. 6.5x284 has an excellant reputation for accuracy. (well deserved).
3. Factory rifles in 264 Win usually have twist rates >= 9" so it doesn't stabilize the 140's as well.
4. Not as efficient as 6.5x284, handloads easily equal or exceed factory 264 velocities.
5. Although, properly handloaded to equal pressures the 264 Win is capable of more velocity.
264 just hit a wall when the 7mm Rem was released and couldn't regain any momentum. I can't help but think that the 264 Win when properly loaded in the right (8" twist, 26+ barrel) rifle makes a helluva LR rifle. Just my 2 cents.
I agree with the comments in the other posts. Perhaps the biggest reason has to do with the popularity of the 6.5's is the outstanding ballistic performance of the VLD bullets. If someone doesn't want to build a custom, and buy a factory rifle, you can buy a 6.5x284 that is throated for 140 VLD's, and available with a barrel twist rate that is optimum, off the shelf. The 6.5x284 gives up nothing to to other two cartridges and perhaps offers advantages in case design, the availability of quality brass, and in the opinion of many shooters, better inherent accuracy than the others. I bought a Savage LRH in 6.5x284 that cost about $700, it isn't pretty but it will shoot as well as any custom designed for hunting purposes.
backwoods83
Well-Known Member
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Reasons the 6.5x284 and 6.5-06 are more popular
#1 Lapua brass
#2 it takes about 8-10 more grns of powder in the 264wm to equal the velocity in a given barrel length.
#3 if you want good 264wm brass you need to neck down and fully prep 7mm rm Norma brass.
#4 if you want max velocities from the 264wm it typically requires undesirable ball or double based powders such as US869 WC872 Ramshot Magnum or VV N570, and they are not so stable.
But to defend the 264wm, the belt has 0 effect on accuracy when loaded correctly, but the neck/shoulder design isn't the best.
I can break 3100 with a 6.5x284 with a 26" barrel and Retumbo, you can also get almost 3300 in a 6.5wsm with a 26" barrel and Retumbo, the 6.5x257wby will also do 3300 with H1000 or Retumbo, I'm not exactly sure why the 264wm cannot reach these velocities without going over pressure with Retumbo, I just know the 3 cases I mentioned are more effecient. Do not rule out the 264wm though it is still a decent cartridge for mid sized game at fairly long ranges, not a good idea for paper punching though unless you have a few extra barrels. Oh and as mentioned the factory offerings with a 9 twist are a joke unless you want to shoot 120 nbts or 129ssts.
#1 Lapua brass
#2 it takes about 8-10 more grns of powder in the 264wm to equal the velocity in a given barrel length.
#3 if you want good 264wm brass you need to neck down and fully prep 7mm rm Norma brass.
#4 if you want max velocities from the 264wm it typically requires undesirable ball or double based powders such as US869 WC872 Ramshot Magnum or VV N570, and they are not so stable.
But to defend the 264wm, the belt has 0 effect on accuracy when loaded correctly, but the neck/shoulder design isn't the best.
I can break 3100 with a 6.5x284 with a 26" barrel and Retumbo, you can also get almost 3300 in a 6.5wsm with a 26" barrel and Retumbo, the 6.5x257wby will also do 3300 with H1000 or Retumbo, I'm not exactly sure why the 264wm cannot reach these velocities without going over pressure with Retumbo, I just know the 3 cases I mentioned are more effecient. Do not rule out the 264wm though it is still a decent cartridge for mid sized game at fairly long ranges, not a good idea for paper punching though unless you have a few extra barrels. Oh and as mentioned the factory offerings with a 9 twist are a joke unless you want to shoot 120 nbts or 129ssts.
dragman
Well-Known Member
that sums that up about as perfect as you can.I'll take a shot at this since it seems no one else will.
1. Nothing wrong with the 264 Win, but it has a belt and the bench rest crowd doesn't like belts.
2. 6.5x284 has an excellant reputation for accuracy. (well deserved).
3. Factory rifles in 264 Win usually have twist rates >= 9" so it doesn't stabilize the 140's as well.
4. Not as efficient as 6.5x284, handloads easily equal or exceed factory 264 velocities.
5. Although, properly handloaded to equal pressures the 264 Win is capable of more velocity.
264 just hit a wall when the 7mm Rem was released and couldn't regain any momentum. I can't help but think that the 264 Win when properly loaded in the right (8" twist, 26+ barrel) rifle makes a helluva LR rifle. Just my 2 cents.
WildRose
Well-Known Member
Pretty well. I'll add though that if we had the same high BC superior hunting bullets in 6.5 that we have today the 7mag would probably have never gained a foothold.
ICANHITHIMMAN
Well-Known Member
I'm voting lack of knowledge and good marketing
I shoot 6.5-06 because -
1. 264 Win Mag is belted - headspaces on the belt.
2. 6.5 x 284 case was originally designed for a lever action. For proper feeding a center feed must be used.
3. 6.5-06 magazine is perfected (30-06, 270, 25-06).
4. You can make good 6.5-06 brass by simply necking down Lapua 30-06 brass.
5. I get 264 Win Mag velocities from my 6.5-06.
My gunsmith talked me out of a 6.5 x 284 due to the magazine issue. I'm glad. I shoot 142 grain SMKs at 3050 fps. It's a tackdriver.
1. 264 Win Mag is belted - headspaces on the belt.
2. 6.5 x 284 case was originally designed for a lever action. For proper feeding a center feed must be used.
3. 6.5-06 magazine is perfected (30-06, 270, 25-06).
4. You can make good 6.5-06 brass by simply necking down Lapua 30-06 brass.
5. I get 264 Win Mag velocities from my 6.5-06.
My gunsmith talked me out of a 6.5 x 284 due to the magazine issue. I'm glad. I shoot 142 grain SMKs at 3050 fps. It's a tackdriver.
Michael Eichele
Well-Known Member
That is one of the most interesting opinions I have ever heard regarding the 6.5x284.
Has anybody experienced any feeding problems. I personally have not. Maybe I am just lucky....??
I have seen that listed as a negative by Smiths on this site but those comments were from a few years ago. There may now be a best known method of correcting or mitigating the risk that has proliferated.
I myself went the -06 route and as such have no personal experience with feed issues in the 284 version.
I myself went the -06 route and as such have no personal experience with feed issues in the 284 version.
I have never heard of that one either. I never had an issue with my 6.5x284's feeding either staggered or straight stacked. I can't believe the case design had anything to do with feeding. Winchester designed the 284 because they wanted to promote 30-06 length case capacity for use in their short action lever and auto loading rifles. The rim design is identical to the 30-06 case with the case body a little fatter. If anything, the overall length of the 6.5x284 loaded with VLD's could be an advantage if a donor rifle action/magazine length is on the short side and you are seating VLD's close to or in the lands with a 6.5x06.
Here are a couple old threads that discuss it in differing levels of detail.
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f37/6-5x284-75858/index3.html
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f25/wts-semi-custom-6-5x284-reduced-again-76959/index2.html
And one of the sites more trusted sources discusses here:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f17/6-5-06-vs-6-5-284-a-20541/index2.html
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f37/6-5x284-75858/index3.html
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f25/wts-semi-custom-6-5x284-reduced-again-76959/index2.html
And one of the sites more trusted sources discusses here:
http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f17/6-5-06-vs-6-5-284-a-20541/index2.html
Michael Eichele
Well-Known Member
Looks like the one of the most trusted sources listed above is referring to the control round feed found in some Winchester actions. Now that makes sense. Still does not make any sense for a 700...
