Spreadsheet to determine best long range hunting cartridge

Newbweatherby said:

wow no mention of any of the RUM cartridges 338 338 edge ,300 or 7mm?

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johnlittletree said:

This is not F-Class or Bench Rest shooting that is the sort of nonsense infecting real hunting. the BC of a hunting bullet should be the last thing you consider not the first thing. The most important factor about a bullet that no one on this sights seem to mention is penetration and expansion at the velocity you expect the cartridge to have at the distance you intend to shoot the animal at. The bigest problem with long range hunters is their ignorance to bullet construction from the stand point of producing a quick merciful kill. They spend far too much time looking at numbers that are almost meaningless to hunting. They ignore the single most important detail about a cartridge and bullet combo which is how it behaves on impact with structure on large game. I can almost guarantee that 99% of the hunters on this sight are shooting the worst possible bullets at large game because they worry to much about drop and wind drift and not enough about the construction of the bullet as it applies to on target performance. People on this sight act as if getting the bullet to the animal is the end of bullet performance and hunting but really that is just the beginning. Boat tails bad, VLD's bad, thin jackets bad, hollow points with thin jackets the worst!

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packgoatguy said:

In case anyone else finds this (often debated) topic interesting: Ive been planning on setting up another long range capable rifle. With SO SO SO many caliber and cartridge choices available, it is difficult to evaluate which one has the most to offer. The following link is to a Google Sheet spreadsheet that I created that compares some of the more popular long range hunting cartridges.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/156KStH-VKLIwILKsmubbCZDm6XzUvyz47oro0nR5hxY/edit?usp=sharing

The spreadsheet ranks the various cartridges based on the point in their flight when they drop below 1600fps (the minimum velocity when the popular Hornady ELD-X bullets are said to be designed to reliably expand upon impact.) For the purpose of this analysis, I am calling this the "max effective range" of the particular cartridge.

SPOILER ALERT, this spreadsheet puts the 28 Nosler at the top of the list (unless you can get 2900fps or more out of a 270gr 338 bullet.)

The spreadsheet uses the advertised velocities on Hornady's and Nosler's websites.

Also included is the wind drift and drop of each cartridge at 500, 1000, and 1500 yard increments.

Also included is the KPS (Killing Power Score) of each bullet at the corresponding yardages and velocities. (the KPS scale accounts for energy, velocity, bullet weight, sectional density, and the diameter of the bullet to give a "score" that more or less defines its "oomph" on target). Bear in mind that a 10mm pistol at point blank range has a KPS score of 12-17 depending on barrel length and how hot the ammo is.... and that is a round many would argue is adequate medicine for protection in bear infested woods...

So, my question to you all would be: in real life, do you see these velocities as advertised? What other considerations should be included in evaluating the "best" overall long range hunting cartridge?

If you were trying to put together the lightest weight, but still half MOA accurate rifle, which of these cartridges would you choose and why?

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johnlittletree said:

This is not F-Class or Bench Rest shooting that is the sort of nonsense infecting real hunting. the BC of a hunting bullet should be the last thing you consider not the first thing. The most important factor about a bullet that no one on this sights seem to mention is penetration and expansion at the velocity you expect the cartridge to have at the distance you intend to shoot the animal at. The bigest problem with long range hunters is their ignorance to bullet construction from the stand point of producing a quick merciful kill. They spend far too much time looking at numbers that are almost meaningless to hunting. They ignore the single most important detail about a cartridge and bullet combo which is how it behaves on impact with structure on large game. I can almost guarantee that 99% of the hunters on this sight are shooting the worst possible bullets at large game because they worry to much about drop and wind drift and not enough about the construction of the bullet as it applies to on target performance. People on this sight act as if getting the bullet to the animal is the end of bullet performance and hunting but really that is just the beginning. Boat tails bad, VLD's bad, thin jackets bad, hollow points with thin jackets the worst!

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Newbweatherby said:

well I've always been concerned about bullet construction and accuracy at the same time.the big problems is getting a bullet that will perform well at short range magnum velocities or at 1000 yards much slower and mail not expand well ,so far when I load my son and my .300 run I've been using either 165 or 180 grain scriracco lls boat tail or Accubonds and limit to 600 yards max.200 yards groups are a out .75-.100"

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Canhunter35 said:

And yet a 168eldm/amax is one of the best hunting bullets I've ever used from my 308.
Others tout the 215hybrid as one of their favourite 30cal bullets because of their performance on game. I've had great success with a 212eldx and the 143eldx so far.
But they're all bad apparently.

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fonzy702 said:

There is some good info here. You are correct, because there are so many good options with bullet choice, calibers, and cartridges that it's tough to settle on one. I think that one really good contender that was omitted is the 6.5x284 Norma. There are some really good high bc high as bullets available in this caliber that this cartridge is capable of pushing at very good velocities. It is also very pleasant to shoot with far less felt recoil than other cartridges in the comparison.

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Hand Skills said:

Better plug in a 280AI 150gr ABLR @2930fps BC .611 apparently that will beat a factory 300Win too.

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Hand Skills said:

.....I appreciate the work and I enjoy reviewing other's data, but I don't think there is such thing as a master spreadsheet to calculate the best long range cartridge for everyone......

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johnlittletree said:

This is not F-Class or Bench Rest shooting that is the sort of nonsense infecting real hunting. the BC of a hunting bullet should be the last thing you consider not the first thing. The most important factor about a bullet that no one on this sights seem to mention is penetration and expansion at the velocity you expect the cartridge to have at the distance you intend to shoot the animal at. The bigest problem with long range hunters is their ignorance to bullet construction from the stand point of producing a quick merciful kill. They spend far too much time looking at numbers that are almost meaningless to hunting. They ignore the single most important detail about a cartridge and bullet combo which is how it behaves on impact with structure on large game. I can almost guarantee that 99% of the hunters on this sight are shooting the worst possible bullets at large game because they worry to much about drop and wind drift and not enough about the construction of the signbullet as it applies to on target performance. People on this sight act as if getting the bullet to the animal is the end of bullet performance and hunting but really that is just the beginning. Boat tails bad, VLD's bad, thin jackets bad, hollow points with thin jackets the worst!

Click to expand...