6.5 Creedmor- the Holy Grail?

Bullseye said:

Dude... old news. http://soldiersystems.net/2018/12/12/hornady-to-supply-300-prc-ammunition-to-us-dod/

RE 6.5 CM/260 - you've stumbled on part of the problem. The SAAMI spec has been 1:9" forever on the 260, 6.5 Rem Mag, 264 Win Mag. Tons of rifles have been chambered in that. For Hornady do start putting modern, high bc bullets in factory 260 ammo, for example, is just asking for trouble with people trying to run them in the old twists. Tech support nightmare. Let alone all there was to gain by improving the throat design and seating the bullets out. Imagine shoving a 147gr ELD M into 2.8" on a 260 to meet SAAMI spec? That's why they did the Creedmoor. It's always been spec'd at 1:8" twist. It's better for long, heavy-for-caliber projectiles and can be hand loaded or used with factory ammo. Apparently that is evil...

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Remington has been producing 8 twist .260's for some time including my Gen2 Milspec .260.

rustyshackleford said:

300 Norma beats the brakes off 300 PRC and 300 Win.
Hornady has been peddling turnkey versions of old standbys to get lazy people into the sport.

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There's a lot of truth in this. THey planned well ahead, created the market and already had the supply.

We're Americans and as such we're always inclined to believe the "newest" is the best and reach for it. It's just how we've all been raised for several generations.

The truth though is that none of their proprietary cartridges are really outperforming what's long existed.

In the end we will all take heads of game with whatever and have spirited conversation around the fire as brothers in arms.

WildRose said:

Hornady recognized the potential of a short action 6.5 and had the advantage of about 7 years advancement in bullet tech.

Their team was also competing against .260's throughout that era who came back and told them of it's success.

Hornady then realized that with the new bullets it could do amazing things and came up with their own improvement over the .260.

When however you run the two size by side, same bullets, same twist rates etc they are pretty well ballistic twins.

About the only two things Remington has come up with in the last sixty years they didn't screw up were the 7RM and the 300 Rum; Somehow they got those two about right.

It had to be a complete accident in both cases.

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HAHAHA!!! As a huge Rem 700 fan, I've got to laugh at this...Because it's true! They're the only weapons company that could have been around since 1816, and managed in the last 20 years, to **** up more good guns and cartridge designs than anyone else. I blame the board of Fudds... They like their profit margins and don't want to come off some cash to update anything that could be potentially huge sellers.

Bullseye said:

okay, and also developed the 6.5 PRC for those that like the benefits of the 6.5 Creedmoor but want more energy.

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They saw the gap between the .260, 6.5x55, 6.5L, 6.5CM and the 26 Nosler and knew there would be a ready market to fill by those concerned about throat erosion but still wanted a "high performance" 6.5.

They also had a great deal of influence in setting the standards for precision rifle competition 6.5's and again had the supply for the demand they were creating.

adam32 said:

And people believing marketing hype over real life proven numbers.

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Why do you think advertising is so profitable? We eat it up.

MudRunner2005 said:

I'm starting to realize that despite age, those of us who have been hunting and shooting guns our whole lives are now being looked at by these newbies and younger generation, like we're that old guy trying to give advice... And they're just standing there with bad attitude, thinking we're dumb, and telling us, "No man, you geezers just don't understand my generation...!"

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What they don't realize is that we do, we were all once "that generation".

WildRose said:

Why do you think advertising is so profitable? We eat it up.

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Well... Some of us do. I'm a Sigma personality...We're naturally wired not to fall for trends or hype. Sometimes we even go out of our way to NOT be trendy or to push back against the envelope (authority), and go against the grain. It's just how our brains are wired.

RockyMtnMT said:

You forgot the ballistics. Try again.

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Bad dude with a 110gr hammer! Faster than a 6.5 needmoor to!

MudRunner2005 said:

To say it was the cartridge's "fault", and to blame an inanimate object is just stupid. We're saying the hunters chose poorly on their cartridge selection for the job. Stop acting indignant over 4 random people's blatant stupidity, and stop acting like by pointing out the obvious flaw in their choice happened to be an undersized cartridge/bullet for the job (apparent based on their outcomes), that it is somehow attacking your "precious" favorite cartridge.

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Now what would you say if the OP had singled out the 260 AI ?
It really amazes me how vitriolic the hatred for the Creed is with a few people.
Unless the shooters had photo proof that they actually hit where they claim they did ??????
I would much more blame poor shooting, too far , wrong bullet, bad wind call ect ect. Than I would 1 specific caliber/ cartridge.

The .25 WSSM was also a fast little cartridge.

Cold Trigger Finger said:

Now what would you say if the OP had singled out the 260 AI ?
It really amazes me how vitriolic the hatred for the Creed is with a few people.
Unless the shooters had photo proof that they actually hit where they claim they did ??????
I would much more blame poor shooting, too far , wrong bullet, bad wind call ect ect. Than I would 1 specific caliber/ cartridge.

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I still would have said he shouldn't have gone elk hunting with a .260AI. It's not an elk cartridge, IMO.

Whitetail, Coues, Blacktail, Mulies, and Lopes, yes. But it's not elk, caribou, or moose cartridge.

I like the idea of the 6.5/06

Shoot it hot for hunting season,,, then tap it kool for plinking.

3 load categories for the beast.

Pet load for gopher season, mid range all summer long at the range. Then load it up for hunting season,,, kinda like owning a 4 season gun to cover all the bases.

MudRunner2005 said:

If someone can't shoot the big bores at long distances with precision, they shouldn't be a sniper...They should be running a DMR and sticking inside of 800 meters.

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Having shot a lot of the LR sniper rifles the Military was flieding in the 80's and 90's I have to say you're not just wrong, you're wrong all over here.

Often times particularly in country like Afghanistan and Iraq you may be behind the gun for dozens of rounds in a fight and the big boomers beat the hell out of you. That kind of fatigue reduces the effectiveness of the sniper in the field in a hurry.

Worse, we often have to work from hides in urban terrain in a small enclosed room shooting through a very small hole across the room. In those cases you're trapped in a small room with all of that muzzle blast and noise and one shot from the Barrett is enough to make your eyes, ears, and nose bleed no matter what kind of hearing protection you're wearing.