Talley Anti-Cant Indicator Ring

Does anyone have one of these or has used one in the past. I'm looking to pick up a new set of Talley LW rings and this bubble level caught my eye as a simple addition to my setup... if it works.

https://store.talleyscoperings.com/...ght-alloy-scope-mounts?variant=12419540680748

IMO they are useless. I level my rifle at the raceway or, if thing are funkys, I level the bell of the optic over the barrel ( there is a tool that does this). Then I level the crosshair with a plum line. Now the cross hair is level with the universe. THEN I add a bubble level to the scope and while everything is lined up as it should be I adjust the bubble so that it reflects the level conditions I have set up. Levels that are attached to the rings cannot be used this way. What happens if one side of your rings are a little tighter than the other side? You end up canting the whole rifle to compensate for it. Anyway IMO....

Barrelnut said:

IMO they are useless. I level my rifle at the raceway or, if thing are funkys, I level the bell of the optic over the barrel ( there is a tool that does this). Then I level the crosshair with a plum line. Now the cross hair is level with the universe. THEN I add a bubble level to the scope and while everything is lined up as it should be I adjust the bubble so that it reflects the level conditions I have set up. Levels that are attached to the rings cannot be used this way. What happens if one side of your rings are a little tighter than the other side? You end up canting the whole rifle to compensate for it. Anyway IMO....

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I've often wondered about that problem with screwing down rings, but figured I'd ask anyway just because it'd be nice to have things be so simple. I mount my scope similar to how you do and wonder if there's a way to get my rings tightened in such a way that the bubble still sits in the center...

Probably would work in a lot of cases, but invariably seems you will end up with one side of the ring not torqued the same as the other.
Now if they made one attached to the ring that had an allen screw and a wedge that would allow adjustment the level witorque on the rings themselves would be great.

Barrelnut said:

Probably would work in a lot of cases, but invariably seems you will end up with one side of the ring not torqued the same as the other.
Now if they made one attached to the ring that had an allen screw and a wedge that would allow adjustment the level witorque on the rings themselves would be great.

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I may call Talley and ask them the same question. So far, they've been extremely willing to be of help any way they can. My M7 came with the 8-40 holes and when I called to ask what my options might be, they were happy to open up the holes and include the needed screws at no extra charge! I wish PTG's CS was on this level.

I'm fairly new to having a bubble on my rifle.

FWIW, at first I thought mounts, rails and rings with integrated levels were really cool, but soon came to question the value of having a level SO low profile I can't even see it when I'm behind the scope.

Personally I like being able to confirm level without breaking position, and having a level that sticks out seems to be a simple solution.

Barrelnut,

A scope level USELESS? Au contraire!

IF you have the time to use them in a hunting situation then USE them. The average crosshair sight above the bore enter is 1 1/2 inches. Canting your rifle causes windage misses. A level can be a "reminder" that says "Hey!, you're off level and could easily miss that 456 yard shot."

Eric B.

Sorry I wasn't very clear. Was just saying that the bubble levels that are integrated to the top of a scope ring might be useless. I'm a believer in scope levels and try my best to make sure they are adjusted and accurate.

Barrelnut,
I use a level on my Ruger Precision Rifle. Now that I see that Talley makes a level I could use on the Talley rings for my new hunting rifle I just may get it.

For my new Browning X-Bolt Pro rifle I think I'd put it on the ring nearest to me since my competition level is in about the same place but over to the left.

I see levels integrated into Pic rails but that seems more awkward to use than one above the scope.

What I would really like is to have a SIG scope with their internal illuminated level indicator. But I don't trust a scope at such a low price so I'll wait to see if they put it on a higher quality scope.

Eric B.

UPDATE:
Got the Talley rings and top ring level in burnt bronze Cerakote to match my X-Bolt Pro. (Matchy-matchy ya know ;o) I will use LOCKTITE BLUE to keep all scope ring screws from slipping. Should have no problems after doing that.

To me this is great for a long range rifle if I have the time to use it. I'm used to doing it in PRS competition with my 6.5 CM RPR so should automatically do it when hunting.

@Litehiker Vx6hd has electronic anti-cant also.

WOW! So Leupold is doing this too. I hope internal scope electronic levels become an industry standard B/C it is by far the easiest to use. Plus an internal electronic level indicator is moire accurate than bubble levels.

If many scope makers offer this feature it will have the effect of educating shooters who previously had no clue about the importance of shooting from a level rifle. I know I used to be one of them until I got into competition.

Very interesting how competitive long range rifle matches like PRS have upped the standards for hunting rifles and scopes - and shooting skills. Most hunters never compete in LR shooting but now they know about things like cant, spin drift and high/low angle effects on trajectory. Kinda like auto racing. A lot of the good stuff eventually gets into the average automobile.

Eric B.

Another reason it seems better to have a level mounted (electronic or otherwise) to the scope, comes into play if you remove the scope and reinstall it for whatever reason.
When a scope is mounted to the scope, it is aligned to the reticle of the scope even after removing and reinstalling it. No more need to adjust the level at all. Now, if you remove the scope with a level on the scope ring (like Talleys) you are going to have to realign the scopes reticle to a plum bob, etc. Then probably have to run another tall target test to verify.

Litehiker said:

I hope internal scope electronic levels become an industry standard B/C it is by far the easiest to use. Plus an internal electronic level indicator is moire accurate than bubble levels.

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I'm not sure about SIG, but I believe Leupolds are set to indicate cant exceeding 2deg. I know bubbles can be more accurate than that.

2deg of cant error at 24moa of elevation works out to ~0.84moa of horizontal error.

I think precision is going to come down more to design/manufacture than whether a device is analog or digital, and more importantly the users requirements.

Hand Skills said:

@Litehiker Vx6hd has electronic anti-cant also.

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I just finished putting together a 28 nosler with a vx-6hd and the level cap from Talley. I look at it as a back up to the internal level(or to check both). I'm not in on all the science behind toqueing the cap screws making it level with the gap being different on each side of the top ring(I did use a torque wrench to torque them all the same). If the makes sense.

Using it on top means I have to open my off eye to see it but it's not hard.