What the hell Fierce !!!
- Thread starter Trm82
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I was typing while you responded. But you are stating things I said earlier. I stated that the difference between custom and saami was only .1.
What the gain with the .1??? 50 FPS??
What the gain with the .1??? 50 FPS??
I just measured a 180 HVLD and it came out to .609 vs Bergers .491 based on my data, Bergers data and your 180 ELDM data that would be with .020 with I would say is close enough with all the variables in play. The point for me is not about the 50 fps or even 100 fps. I can assure you I would never build a custom rifle with the chamber not throated for the bullet I desired to shoot. I will always have the boattail junction seated at the neck shoulder junction, plus roughly .040 depending on the bullet, for my reamer spec. I have seen short throats give situations where accuracy nodes are split so yes the 50 fps could matter. You might find that the shorter throat makes you run a lower node. Maybe max loads only differ by 50 fps but it doesn't mean that will be the difference in the nodes(usually ~100fps). I only have personal experience with one 28 but My custom throated 7-300s would outrun my 28 with 180s. Maybe it was just a difference in the particular barrels. I'm going to sound like a broken record. I would never buy a production rifle expecting a custom throat and I would never build a custom rifle and use a SAAMI throat.
I see your "customed" non production 28 nosler was pushing the 180 eldm at 3115 FPS.
My standard chamber built by me(savage) pushes it at 3090 FPS With h1000 shooting in the .3s. So you gained 25 FPS and I think I can hit the higher node.
Sometime when you spend the extra money, you have to justify it to yourself to make yourself fell good. I do it sometimes and that's ok.
My point is the standard chamber will push ALL the current bullets over or around 3000 FPS with superior accuracy. If someone says not, they are lying or misinformed.
My standard chamber built by me(savage) pushes it at 3090 FPS With h1000 shooting in the .3s. So you gained 25 FPS and I think I can hit the higher node.
Sometime when you spend the extra money, you have to justify it to yourself to make yourself fell good. I do it sometimes and that's ok.
My point is the standard chamber will push ALL the current bullets over or around 3000 FPS with superior accuracy. If someone says not, they are lying or misinformed.
Trm82
Well-Known Member
If that's touching the lands that can not be SAAMI spec. See my pic with the ELDM which has a longer bearing length.
Danny1788
Well-Known Member
That's what I was thinking as well. I posted on the first page my reamer is saami length freebore .181" and my 180s and 195 are not down that far.
If you are .010 off the land and your chamber is standard, your coal should be 3,58 plus or minus about .02.
Hatrick
Well-Known Member
Looks like 2 different bullets.
You are incorrect on your statement about my rifle. That was a SAAMI chamber production Ridgeline and I seriously doubt you are going to hit the higher node with out trashing brass. Mine would not even come close. I do not need to justify anything. If I spend $2k or $3k or $4k on something it better give me something a $500 dollar Savage will not. I will be the first to ship something out the door that does not live up to what it was supposed to. I will never justify a $4k piece of ****. Yes I do spend more money on rifles than some but it is not for "better" performance it is for features not found elsewhere. I really feel that the rifles today approach the point of diminishing returns much quicker than other products like spotters or binos. Scopes are in the same boat as rifles these days. The lower priced items are quickly catching up. Having said all that I know of two guys with multiple 30 Noslers throated .100 longer than the two SAAMI chambered 30 Noslers I have getting around 100 fps more than mine in the accuracy node. Is that worth going custom? I can not be the judge of that for you but when I smoke my current Fierce 30 Nosler barrel I will be using a custom reamer. As far as your statement about the 3000fps I absolutely agree but so would my custom throated 7wsm with 14 grains less powder shooting 180s in a 25" barrel. No we have come full circle. A custom throated WSM using 14 grains less powder for the same performance. Is it worth it? that is a lot of barrel life. This could go on and on we could then argue that the 280 ackley will nearly approach that with even less powder. If you are satisfied with 3k fps then you are wasting money on powder and barrel life with a 28 Nosler.
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Here is my fierce edge 28 nosler with 180 hunting vlds. COAL 3.585 to the lands
Attachments
This is what it should look like.
This about the 28 nosler.
At 1000 yards, the difference from 3012 FPS and 3100 is .5 inches of drift and about 125 ft lbs( 8000 ft, 5 mph wind). That's with the 195s. We all dial for drop anyway?
Two questions?
What will the .1 difference gain? I have asked you this numerous times but you never answer.
Also what are the speeds that custom mAkers are pushing 195s with the long throat? One builder's personal 28 is pushing 3050 with N570.
Would it be reasonable to think if I could gain speed with n570?
QUOTE="rfurman24, post: 1453499, member: 26535"]You are incorrect on your statement about my rifle. That was a SAAMI chamber production Ridgeline and I seriously doubt you are going to hit the higher node with out trashing brass. Mine would not even come close. I do not need to justify anything. If I spend $2k or $3k or $4k on something it better give me something a $500 dollar Savage will not. I will be the first to ship something out the door that does not live up to what it was supposed to. I will never justify a $4k piece of ****. Yes I do spend more money on rifles than some but it is not for "better" performance it is for features not found elsewhere. I really feel that the rifles today approach the point of diminishing returns much quicker than other products like spotters or binos. Scopes are in the same boat as rifles these days. The lower priced items are quickly catching up. Having said all that I know of two guys with multiple 30 Noslers throated .100 longer than the two SAAMI chambered 30 Noslers I have getting around 100 fps more than mine in the accuracy node. Is that worth going custom? I can not be the judge of that for you but when I smoke my current Fierce 30 Nosler barrel I will be using a custom reamer. As far as your statement about the 3000fps I absolutely agree but so would my custom throated 7wsm with 14 grains less powder shooting 180s in a 25" barrel. No we have come full circle. A custom throated WSM using 14 grains less powder for the same performance. Is it worth it? that is a lot of barrel life. This could go on and on we could then argue that the 280 ackley will nearly approach that with even less powder. If you are satisfied with 3k fps then you are wasting money on powder and barrel life with a 28 Nosler.[/QUOTE]
You
At 1000 yards, the difference from 3012 FPS and 3100 is .5 inches of drift and about 125 ft lbs( 8000 ft, 5 mph wind). That's with the 195s. We all dial for drop anyway?
Two questions?
What will the .1 difference gain? I have asked you this numerous times but you never answer.
Also what are the speeds that custom mAkers are pushing 195s with the long throat? One builder's personal 28 is pushing 3050 with N570.
Would it be reasonable to think if I could gain speed with n570?
QUOTE="rfurman24, post: 1453499, member: 26535"]You are incorrect on your statement about my rifle. That was a SAAMI chamber production Ridgeline and I seriously doubt you are going to hit the higher node with out trashing brass. Mine would not even come close. I do not need to justify anything. If I spend $2k or $3k or $4k on something it better give me something a $500 dollar Savage will not. I will be the first to ship something out the door that does not live up to what it was supposed to. I will never justify a $4k piece of ****. Yes I do spend more money on rifles than some but it is not for "better" performance it is for features not found elsewhere. I really feel that the rifles today approach the point of diminishing returns much quicker than other products like spotters or binos. Scopes are in the same boat as rifles these days. The lower priced items are quickly catching up. Having said all that I know of two guys with multiple 30 Noslers throated .100 longer than the two SAAMI chambered 30 Noslers I have getting around 100 fps more than mine in the accuracy node. Is that worth going custom? I can not be the judge of that for you but when I smoke my current Fierce 30 Nosler barrel I will be using a custom reamer. As far as your statement about the 3000fps I absolutely agree but so would my custom throated 7wsm with 14 grains less powder shooting 180s in a 25" barrel. No we have come full circle. A custom throated WSM using 14 grains less powder for the same performance. Is it worth it? that is a lot of barrel life. This could go on and on we could then argue that the 280 ackley will nearly approach that with even less powder. If you are satisfied with 3k fps then you are wasting money on powder and barrel life with a 28 Nosler.[/QUOTE]
You
