Tuning for long range

Was 44.2 in the second pic you? Do you have velocities? Were they consistent in the climb? did you have any pressure signs? Not knowing this I would think I would look at that 44+ area. If you up there with smiley faces on your case head that 42.6-43.2 would need to be looked at. Seems to hold vertical
 
Ladder test for 6 Dasher hunting rifle, 23" #3 Contour Krieger 1 in 8 twist barrel, Leupold VX-R/LRV reticle 4-12X50 scope. Scope adjusted so aim point is not showing on the photo. No pressure signs. Sorry that I did not make notation for velocities on the target. The only velocity I know now is for the load that I chose. Which node would you guys pick? I'll keep my choice secret for a bit. Should also mention Rem 7 1/2 primers since I did not write that on the target.

View attachment 83028

I would reload 8, 9 and 10 the go up by .3 for number 11.
 
Was 44.2 in the second pic you? Do you have velocities? Were they consistent in the climb? did you have any pressure signs? Not knowing this I would think I would look at that 44+ area. If you up there with smiley faces on your case head that 42.6-43.2 would need to be looked at. Seems to hold vertical
I'll creep up a bit maybe to 45gr, but that may be getting a little hot. I'll edit with velocities later.
 
Here are the velocities to go with the ladder.
Bringing this back for some opinions. Shot at 400 yards off bipod, but forgot my bags (dammit) so I was stuck using a jacket. I have my conclusions, but want to see if they line up with the guys who know much more than I do. If you want me to post velocities, I can throw them up. Thoughts?

Looking at my notes, I numbered the charges on the target incorrectly, BUT, knowing my mistake, I know the charges of each shot and their respective velocities. So if you want to throw in your $.02 on the charges on the target, I can look at my notes for the ACTUAL charge. The velocities I posted are correct for their respective charge.

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0.287" bushing
42.4 2626
42.6 2660
42.8 2679
43.0 2694
43.2 2690
43.4 2684
43.6 2678
43.8 2712
44.0 2745
44.2 2743


0.291" bushing
42.4 2654
42.6 2665
42.8 2673
43.0 2676
43.2 2671
43.4 2697
43.6 2684
43.8 2737
44.0 2724
44.2 2794
 
308??
Those flat spots in velocity translate right on the target. That first bushing might have something a little further up. Load up 3/5 in those flat spots and you should be golden.
 
I figured I'd take some time to share how I go about tuning a new rifle intended for long range hunting. I'll say up front I have tried every method out there and have settled on this one for a few reasons. First, it works. It has always provided me with loads that perform. Its fast and easy. Most times I can tune a hunting rifle in less that 20 rounds. I have 100% faith it the method, when I was still competing in 1000 yard Benchrest I would shoot a ladder the night before every match and load exactly what the ladder told me. That year I set 2 group aggregate world records. It would not have happened without the ladders.
When you get your new rifle, load a light load and go put 100 rounds on the barrel. Use this time to get the scope setup, break in the barrel, and learn the rifle. Most barrels will change in that first 100 or so shots and you will be re-tuning if you find a load right away. I have been down that road so many times that I just dont try and cheat it anymore. You should also take some cases and work up .5 grains at a time until you hit pressure (stiff bolt lift). If you MUST do some load work before 100 rounds just play with seating depth but dont fall in love. Once you have that first 100 down and you know where pressure is in your barrel it time to load a ladder test. I would have to assume we have a basic knowledge of what powders, primers, and bullets seem to work well in the case we're loading for. I will usually pick 2 powders and load ladders with powder charges spaced .6%. So for a case that holds an 80 grain charge you would go in .5 grain incidents. Load about 10 cases ending just under your max. Example for a 28 Nosler with an 89 grain max
84
84.5
85
85.5
86
86.5
87
87.5
88
88.5

Usually this will show you your upper node and the next one down. I didn't mention seating depth. Here I will say I usually always find accuracy just in or just off the lands. I will start with a seating depth that I know that bullet seems to like. Certain bullets do in my experience seem to like the similar seating depths across many rifles. I will list a few examples
215 Breger Hybrid .010" off
195 Berger Hybrid .015" off
300 Breger hybrid .015" in
180 Berger Hybrid .020" off
If its a new to me bullet and there is no good data I will usually start .010" off, unless its really long like the 300 or 230, then I will put it .015" in. For some reason those long heavy bullets have responded very well to being in the lands. I have never pulled a bullet, I do not use very light neck tension. I have found most rifles will shoot best with more. I typically start with .003". Do nothing to the inside of your necks other than brush with a stiff nylon brush, do NOT remove the carbon from inside your necks.
Im no writer and have bounced around, but I will tell you how to perform the ladder now. So you have your 10 loaded cases. Color from the ogive to the tip with a sharpie. Blue, red, green, and yellow are best. Record the colors so you know what they are and you will have to repeat their use because we dont have 10 colors to use. But you will be able to tell what are what, as the hotter ones usually will climb the target. Use your judgement on the range at which to shoot. If things are decent I will go to 600 if they are not great I will go to 300, but never less. You need to use your chrony for this. Use a clean white piece of paper, butchers paper works well or the back of a target. Fire all the rounds at the same aim point. adjust your scope so they print off to the side so you can read them better. With ladders we are looking for bullets to climb, then for 2-3 shots to stop and form a group before starting back up the target. Those spots where the shots level out also have to correspond with a flat spot in velocity to work for a hunting rifle. We are looking for the spot the barrel has given us leeway in load variations as well as a flat spot in velocity which will provide us with good ES. You then pick a powder charge in the middle of that flat spot and adjust seating depth if needed to achieve the accuracy your after.

I must note that this method requires a well built rifle that is capable of good accuracy. We are depending on the rifle to pet every shot where it should go. I would not recommend shooting a ladder with a 1moa rifle, there will be too much built in vertical to make sense of it. Also you must be capable of breaking good shots, and choosing a day worthy of testing. If you test on a bad day with highs winds or mirage you will end up chasing your tail. It does not need to be perfect, but it needs to be decent. This was a lot of typing but I guarantee you if you do it in a controlled manner you will love the accuracy and efficiency of the process. Im sure I missed something, but Im just tired of typing at this point. Im happy to answer any questions...
Can this be done with a magnetospeed? It seems like it would influence the barrel harmonics, especially on a lighter barrel.
 
No. Theres no way I would tune with one of those on my barrel. If you have ever used a barrel tuner and seen how small of an adjustment it takes to change the load, you wouldnt either.
That's what I feared. So I guess the alternative is to shoot the ladder as you've described, then shoot the vertical cluster charges separately to find the flat spot in velocity?
 
When I was younger we never knew what the speed of our rounds were. We just shot drops and would adjust powder weight according to previous data. You have your dope as far as speed. It will change because of DA. Shoot you loads and find the flat spot on the target. Load in that spot and practice shooting. You'll gain far more doing this and recording your DA and how your rifle shoots through the heat cycle then fussing over loading. Paralysis from analysis
 
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