I have many years of elk hunting experience in wolf country as have you. My experience shows that we have called in bulls within a quarter mile of live active kill sites. Pack feeding, barking, howling and letting the entire world know they are content. We have hunted drainages for years, then one year the state agency paid contractors and they killed some 60 wolves form choppers (that was the number we heard). The season before and the season following (along with many previous and many preceeding) we have had just as much or more success than years prior or after. This in not in the "area" of our hunting grounds, this is in exact drainage we park and set up base camp and to spike out of. Just last year we actually had the best 5 days of elk hunting we have ever had with a den site very near. You could literally drive to the location and in a short hike witness a wolf with pups feeding on a cow elk not far from the den. Many hunters in the area had pictures and VIDEO of this happening. We could hear them at night from camp. Just on the other side of the mountain (literally within hiking distance) it was WWIII. Bulls out of thier mind....best 5 days of elk hunting we've ever had. So I understand they are a problem and I dont doubt they can be detrimental to undgulate populations but in my experience a well established existence of wolves hasnt harnessed much of our hunting. This may point to a "properly managed" or "newly established" population of wolves but like I said in my experience it's not been a major issue. I am in no way advocating for wolves. I'm just simply stating what I have witnessed. They have always been a part of our elk hunting grounds. Sometimes we see them, sometimes we dont but there is deffinately a possibly you will run into them. Like many it has never influenced our hunting plans and for good reason. Because most of the time it seems like the wolves blow out more hunters than game and that's been fine with us.
Feds and wolves
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I do not disagree with anything you say. The only thing I know about wolves is what I have seen while hunting. There many experts out there, believe me i do not pretend to be.
Starbuck
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I don't doubt your experiences. The only observation that I'd offer is that the west hasn't had wolves reestablished as long as the great lakes states, and that - at least from what I read - their density in the western states wasn't allowed to get as high as it has gotten in the upper great lakes states. We had wolf packs around for a good many years in Northern WI before we really noticed a drop in deer numbers. But, their numbers grow exponentially when there's unfilled habitat, and when we noticed a large uptick in wolf sightings, sign, and pack numbers, it wasn't too long before deer and snowshoe hare sightings became rare. If the population is left to grow unchecked, they will eat an area or region out of game, and then move on. It's not a theory I hatched from experiential encounters; this was told to me by a local wolf biologist. It's also common sense. Now that there's not much for deer around, we don't see the wolf sign we did 5-10 years ago, but the deer population has been having a difficult time recovering.
I'll readily admit that there's more at play than wolves. We had several severe winters around 2012, and there was pretty much unlimited harvest of antlerless deer for a lot of years. The herd can probably handle a lot of predators, or hard winters or high harvest, but the combination was too much, and now there just isn't much left where I hunt.
The main issues I have with wolves and their management hereabouts is the deliberate falsification of population estimates that went on for years, and the fact that they are only allowed to have a season on them every few years because it's perpetually held up in court for myriad reasons.
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For sure. I cannot comment much on country in the north. I would have to say that it's a completely different topography there and that although wolves are wolves and deer are deer that the differences in species/habitat can influence effects. Meaning (IMO), things in the west can seem so broke and distant. It's so close yet far at the same time and theres SOOO much country between you and the next point for critters to hide. Having hunted the north woods I equate it to setting a towel flat on the table(north woods) and then smashing it all together on the table (the west). In that analogy I can see how the wolves can void an area of most all mammals in the north woods. Topography provides a lot in the way of survival.
Agreed brother. I am in no way an expert at anything haha. All I have to offer is like you, what I've witnessed. We tend to take the positivity approach and it has worked. I do not discount what you have said. I know for certain that there has been many more accounts like yours than mine!
crashlanding
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I'm surprised fish and game from these states don't ticket them for wasting meat. Maybe that will change their behavior
I used to work with a guy who grew up in Montana and he pretty much said the same as you. Wolves will kill and not eat them in many instances. Another friend of mine was hunting in WY a few years ago and saw several cow elk laying dead and not hardly touched. He had posted a picture on his facebook page back then.
The wolfs have wiped out the elk in wilderness areas I hunted.Some places I went last year that I saw 6 bulls in one day never cut a track in 14 mile hike. The whole rifle season I never saw a mule buck.Before wolf I shot 180 bucks for 4 years in a row.Cant hardly even get a decent bull in NW MT, if your trophy hunting.You could drive by winter range and count all kinds of bulls and hundreds of cows.Now barely elk therefore elk in close to town in farms due to wolf that are at 3 times the recovery number.The wolf expert for MT that just recently retired use to stay in our cabin in the Nfork where the first wolfs where and did original wolf studies, on the Canadian border.Same in ID panhandle that I hunted.
3K elk winter at Jackson, 20years ago 20K..
Maybe it's the liberals that need a dose of S3?
Twolf
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when i have been out west in the mountains with my bow if we hear wolves we know our day of elk hunting won`t be very successful to even see an elk. also in Minnesota where i hunt deer on my own land in northern Minnesota if we hear wolves we don`t see deer much then either our only hope is the pack of wolves are not in our hunting area when we hunt. i have seen wolves moving near me in the dark when i shine the fashlight at the noise ,it can be kinda spooky but have never had any getting closes than maybe 30 ft. in the dark of the mourning hunt yet. but know of bear hound hunters that have been very close to wolves and some of these wolves have killed and ate their bear hunting hounds ,on some pictures i have seen the parts of these hounds/dogs what is left of that animal its a terrible site to see. simple we have way too many wolves but until someone in the political world with money looses something of their importance nothing will ever get done much . there has been attacks on people by wolves but that is always quiet down real fast . there is a sheriff in northwest Minnesota keeping track of farm animals killed and wounded by wolves in his area but the feds and wolf lovers try to keep a lid on that too with our Minnesota liberal state government.
Orange Dust
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EXACTLY
jakelly
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You do realize that what you're saying makes absolutely no sense, right? What are you suggesting that those 60+ wolves were eating? Do you expect us to believe the wolves were vegans?
Wolves require about 4 pounds of meat per wolf per day. The average bull elk yields 220 pounds of meat, full grown cows 170, call an elk 200 on average. 60 * 4 = 240 240/200 = 1.2 1.2 * 365 = 438 dead elk in that drainage per year. Mind you those are just above starvation levels of sustenance, if they're breeding and thriving that number is three times as high. That's over 1000 dead elk per year! And the hunting just keeps getting better?!?
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