Fawn Killer Gets Lead Poisoning, Is that a good thing?

[papa bearjd]

I tend to wake up early and today was cool in central Washington so I had the windows open. Long before the sun crested the ridge behind the house, I hear what sounds like a couple of fawn bawling. I look out the window and easily spot a doe and two fawns running flat out a couple hundred yards away. I pulled out the binoculars and quickly picked out about 8 distressed deer (does and fawns) pinned up near a fence across the canyon north of my place. I suspect coyote so I go to the safe and pull out the Valkyrie. By the time I can get geared up the fawn bawling has quit and most of the deer have left except for one doe and fawn that keep hanging around. I'm 90% sure I know what happened so I hang around with a spotting scope and the Valkyrie. A case of 250 yd 80.5 grain lead poisoning occurs a little later.
I personally am kind of a live and let live kind of guy concerning coyotes but I certainly enjoy the deer in my yard a whole lot more than whatever mice the coyotes are killing out in the hills. I'm interested in what our forum thinks of coyotes, and how proactive one should be in dealing with them.

 

[papa bearjd]

Just to bad you didn't get the chance to nail that sucker quicker.

 

[DSheetz]

They may be a myth but a few years back they were a fad and for sale in Denver as were the wolf cross breads . I maybe just haven't been around and killed enough to know for sure but I for sure have killed some funny color fazed coyote with different shaped ears and silver white legs as well as a coyote that had eyes that were the color of an australian shepherd and blondish fur .

 

[257X50]

If you owned an orchard.......the coyotes are sort of on my side.....
When we had standard trees you figured 5 bushel per tree went to deer.
And having to pound in 3 electrical conduit at each tree to keep deer from scraping them.......ruin a tree you have a couple of years invested in.

nope.....don't shoot coyotes..........tens of thousands of dollars to deer every year.

 

[Okanogan]

If you owned an orchard.......the coyotes are sort of on my side.....
When we had standard trees you figured 5 bushel per tree went to deer.
And having to pound in 3 electrical conduit at each tree to keep deer from scraping them.......ruin a tree you have a couple of years invested in.

Before my neighbor pulled his pear orchard, I used to try and shoot a bear every year instead of a deer. I only shot deer if I couldn't get a bear. Pear bears are fine eating. I once watched a group of deer sparing back and forth with a coyote from above on the ridge. I chose not to take a shot at the yote because it seemed even up and entertaining. 15 minute later I took a 250 lb cinnamon black bear boar that came walking along the ridge. I can honestly say that I'm happy that I don't shoot everything that I see in my scope. I sort of get the yin and yang thing which is part of my reason for the post. However, I have to admit after this recent fawn kill, my neighbors and I lean toward the lead poisoning option.

I passed on the yote training comments from an earlier post to a neighbor below me that has experienced harassment of his dogs by the yotes. He knows he isn't up to shooting them with his poor equipment but it will be interesting to hear from him whether he can change there aggressive behavior in the future against his pets with a 22 lr. In the mean time, he suggested I shoot whatever I see.

 

[Ohlongarm]

Sorry, I read it the wrong way. I'm not that familiar with them to know that an 80 pounder would be uncommon (if at all possible).

Gentlemen let me interject, I've killed realistically upwards of 1000 coyotes, a large coyote in Ohio is 45 lbs., here's a pic of one in dead of winter very lean , in good times he might have gone 55lbs. The only way to know for sure is to weigh them, 80 lbs. doubtful, HOWEVER Ohio DNR has documented some in the 65 to 75 lb. range, HOWEVER DNA testing showed northern timber wolf in the genetic background. This crossbreeding has occurred when Lake Erie freezes over and northern timber wolves cross the ice and interbreed with coyotes, all proven by DNA Testing a relatively simple process. Coydogs are extremely rare I actually thought I killed one picture to be posted HOWEVER after DNA testing it was proven to be a pure coyote. I deal in facts not speculation or drama. Here we go. The first picture red coyote was 100% pure DNA tested by my friend a veterinarian he's all into this kind of stuff, I also provide him with coyote hearts he checks the heartworm infestation in them in Ohio .I would have bet the farm this was a coydog. In the summer this coyote hanging might have hit 50 to 55 rare anyways.

 

[DSheetz]

If you read up on Wikipeda and Inspire Uplift Illinois and Ohio are both listed as having tested for and found to have a percentage of coydogs in their population of wild coyote it's not a high percent perhaps 3 percent . Wyoming is one of the states listed as being one of the states that had breading of coydogs early on by humans . We have a large sub-specie of coyote that are known as mountain coyote by a lot of people that will routinely run from 60 - 75 lbs . and have a much more blackish back and mane , we have a smaller coyote that has fine fur and is often called a sand hills coyote as well as an average sized coyote that will run in the 30pound range and over that has a nice silver back and mane refereed to as a Montana pail . There are several sub-specie of coyote with varying sizes , colors from reddish to nearly black ,silvery and some nearly brown . Coydogs are not real common but do exist in the wild and most likely have from around the time mankind brought dogs with them over the Bearing land bridge . Coyote kill to make a living and at times of the year kill more then they will eat as they are teaching the young of the year to hunt and kill , or in the spring they may only eat the soft parts to take back to the litter to regurgitate . I have spent a lot of my life studying coyote and learning how to hunt and kill them I haven't killed nearly as many as some have , around 4500 , and I sure don't know all that there is to about them and I hope to keep learning about them from people here on this site but as is usual if I think some info is wrong or I find that I may be wrong I will start to study some more and I will correct my statement for your benefit . Killing coyote isn't a bad thing over the years I have found that the litter size is consistent with the amount of food base they have so some what to the numbers of coyote in the area and the areas carrying capacity not on the hunting pressure put on them . They are survivors , adaptable and intelligent . I also do my best to deal in facts and study up so that I can for my own benefit .

 

[Pwbergen]

Here is another way to deal with coyotes.

 

[Coues110]

You have to reduce the population by 75% in one generation to even begin to reduce the overall population. I hunt them 100+ days a year. Kill every one you see. The yotes you stumble into are the dumb ones anyways. The smart ones ate their deer last night out of sight of your house.

Trapping restrictions in 1979 saw the beginning of the desert mule deer population decline in SE Arizona.

 

[shootallday]

Here's one killed in New York in 2005 I believe, 115 pounds.

 

[Deleted member 115360]

Here's one killed in New York in 2005 I believe, 115 pounds.
View attachment 293729

That's clearly a wolf. New York would be in the range of the wolves of the great lakes. Probably don't see many there, but it's possible I guess.

Edit: after a little reading, there is a small reclusive wolf population in upstate New York known as the "Adirondack wolf"

 

[257X50]

Before my neighbor pulled his pear orchard, I used to try and shoot a bear every year instead of a deer. I only shot deer if I couldn't get a bear. Pear bears are fine eating. I once watched a group of deer sparing back and forth with a coyote from above on the ridge. I chose not to take a shot at the yote because it seemed even up and entertaining. 15 minute later I took a 250 lb cinnamon black bear boar that came walking along the ridge. I can honestly say that I'm happy that I don't shoot everything that I see in my scope. I sort of get the yin and yang thing which is part of my reason for the post. However, I have to admit after this recent fawn kill, my neighbors and I lean toward the lead poisoning option.

I passed on the yote training comments from an earlier post to a neighbor below me that has experienced harassment of his dogs by the yotes. He knows he isn't up to shooting them with his poor equipment but it will be interesting to hear from him whether he can change there aggressive behavior in the future against his pets with a 22 lr. In the mean time, he suggested I shoot whatever I see.

Exactly.........we have a deer problem......very few coyotes.......
I'll see 40 deer a night....and see them during the day

 

[257X50]

That's clearly a wolf. New York would be in the range of the wolves of the great lakes. Probably don't see many there, but it's possible I guess.

Edit: after a little reading, there is a small reclusive wolf population in upstate New York known as the "Adirondack wolf"

Saw where red wolves will cross breed
Grey wolves will kill them.
In The NE The big coyotes have red wolf DNA

 

[shootallday]

Here's one killed in New York in 2005 I believe, 115 pounds.
View attachment 293729

That's clearly a wolf. New York would be in the range of the wolves of the great lakes. Probably don't see many there, but it's possible I guess.

Edit: after a little reading, there is a small reclusive wolf population in upstate New York known as the "Adirondack wolf"

I think I remember it was killed by pa or nj border. I seen one that was brought into the Sullivan county coyote contest 3-4 years ago. It was 90 something pounds, it went for testing but newer heard anymore about it. Would not surprise me if ny covered it up like there doing with the mountain lions we got.