God help us thread

[338 dude]

You nailed it. There is no reason that politcs/religion should be treated adversarialy. Just because somone doesn't share your beliefs (political or religious) doesn't mean that they are an enemy. How they (or you/we/I for that matter) act on that disagreement creates the enemy.

Think of how much good could happen if people stopped working against each other (trying to make the world what they think is best) and started working WITH each other to help make the world best for everyone.

To bring it back to politics of guns and hunting:

Most of you on here grew up in the country or suburbs and view a gun as a useful tool. It can provide food, protection, and enjoyment.

Most of the people that oppose gun ownership grew up in extremely urban areas and only know guns as a tool of violence, fear, and oppression (gangs, thieves etc).

Can you guys not see why they want to get rid of guns?

What do you think would happen if, instead of treating these people like the enemy, even just 10% of gun enthusiasts (like most of us on here) got together, volunteered our time/guns/ammo, and set up friendly, informative, low pressure range days to help people learn the good aspects of firearms instead of only knowing the bad ones that they grew up with?

I'm sure we all own a 22lr pistol and/or rifle and ammunition is super cheap. I've done it, and it always ends up with the peraon having a new respect for guns and changing their view of them for the better.

That all sounds great I'm all for it but you will persuade very few many on the left are unwilling to compromise and want nothing to do with fire arms And are not willing to learn anything about them their mind is made up

 

[XSIVSPD]

Once taken, nobody has ever gotten them back under the same regime.

If you believe ANTIFA, the Squad, BLM, the loons running the blue cities and states, ACLU, Planned Parenthood, Teachers Union, CPUSA, etc would ever give you back your guns you are in the Land of OZ.

You must be disarmed to be enslaved. Twas always thus and ever will be.

Call up RED DAWN and see that the Cuban Commander's FIRST order to his XO was.

I didnt say I believed they would give them back lol.

What I said, was that both the right and the left have become some extreme that there is no place left for the moderates on either side.

You're reaction is a good example of how the right has become more extreme. Words like "never", "always", "nobody" and "ever" are absolutes. They leave no room for disagreement or debate, and they are often wrong.


This is not accurate:
"You must be disarmed to be enslaved. Twas always thus and ever will be."

There are many ways to enslave an armed population. Read "ready player 1" and see how addicted everyone is to their virtual world. They wouldn't even have to enact any new legislation for that to happen. All they would have to do is NOT enact anything to stop it. And guess what... We're already on our way to that. They won't need to take our guns if 90% of the population does everything but sleep in the virtual world.

 

[338 dude]

If you take the part about Stalin, Mao, etc out of that, it would work for both the hard left and the hard right.

Hard right has stated that they'll kill anyone that trys to take their guns... Sounds like a "you will obey or else" to me

Guns of been a part of America for over 200 years we are not the ones trying to change that or take property that many millions of people own you can't buy back something you never owned what part of shall not be infringed can they not understand

 

[XSIVSPD]

That all sounds great I'm all for it but you will persuade very few many on the left are unwilling to compromise and want nothing to do with fire arms And are not willing to learn anything about them their mind is made up

You're absolutely correct that MANY feel that way. But "many" is neither "most" nor "all". Given the chance for them to work up to it, I've had great luck in my personal life experience doing exactly what I said. They might not have decided to embrace gun culture, but they stopped viewing it as the enemy and realized that mental health is more of an issue than allowing gun ownership.

 

[Deleted member 115654]

Yup sounds like 1860 does it not ?

We know how that worked out ?

I remember watching a roundtable with George McGovern and Alan Simpson years ago.
The question posed was: "You two Senators could not be farther apart on most issues and yet you manage to work together and strike compromises for the good of the nation."

The response was: "We both fought in World War II and saw what happened when men could not work together for the good of their nations."

We are at the point where reasonable men like these are all dead. The fanatics have emerged on the form of the Communist/Socialist/Islamic/Democrat party. There are no "reasonable" adults in control in that group. Thus the ONLY logical response is to take as hard a line as they do. The difference being they want to turn America into a one party state run by "special elites" where as we just want to ensure the last great hope of men seeking freedom continues to exist.

As my signature elsewhere states: "It may be 1788, it may be 1858, it may be 1938, it may be 1968, but is sure as heck is not 1958 !"

I imagine about 10% of those reading that "get it".

 

[XSIVSPD]

I remember watching a roundtable with George McGovern and Alan Simpson years ago.
The question posed was: "You two Senators could not be farther apart on most issues and yet you manage to work together and strike compromises for the good of the nation."

The response was: "We both fought in World War II and saw what happened when men could not work together for the good of their nations."

We are at the point where reasonable men like these are all dead. The fanatics have emerged on the form of the Communist/Socialist/Islamic/Democrat party. There are no "reasonable" adults in control in that group. Thus the ONLY logical response is to take as hard a line as they do. The difference being they want to turn America into a one party state run by "special elites" where as we just want to ensure the last great hope of men seeking freedom continues to exist.

You keep singling out the democratic party for being unreasonable, fanatical, zealots. You need to realize the the republican party is absolutely no better in that regard. The only reason they seem less so is that you agree with much of what they want.

Look at Mitch McConnell for proof. He's refused to allow a vote on several things in the senate simply because they were proposed by a Democrat. Even when those things aligned with not only typical republican views, but the majority of the US populations desires.

 

[Treeslug]

Whew... you misinterpreted the whole intent of my post brother. I am all for a venue for us to discuss the issues at hand, but think we should not "bite the hand that feeds us", so-to-speak... meaning to not be offensive to this site's moderators. Without this site and others like it, we would not have the ability to exchange ideas and communicate as we do now.
If we remain civil with the site's owners and moderators, maybe we will remain free to have these discussions. It is THEIR site, and we are the visitors. In-fighting amongst each other is part of the reason we are in the predicament we are realizing at this time.
Have a great evening.

I beg to differ, Sir. While it is true that this is the owner's site, the owner is making money for the advertisements you see alongside the commentary you read and write. Without "visitors" to this site, there would be no sight. I have been on political forms where I was warned about my right-leaning ideas and I left the forum because I refused to fall in line with the owner's point of view while the far left folks ran amuck. It is truly frightening how many people in this country there are that have no idea of what is really going on politically, and worse, how many people are deprived of knowledge of the right due to censorship by the left who control the media, social media, and have no intention of allowing the rest of us to go against their thoughts and ideas.

 

[Deleted member 107796]

The problem is the hard left does not debate, compromise or understand.
They are pure fanatics and you will obey or else.
They have the same mindset as Stalin, Mao, Castro, Chavez, Pot Pol and Hitler.
Listen to what they say. They mean every word !

The exact could be said of the hard right. Ignorance is ignorance and fighting ideological wars has been proven senseless. Once you demonize, there is no logical discussion. I think many, including other than independents like me, are sick of the winner or loser games extremists play.

"but the majority of the US populations desires."

I was unaware you talked with us all OR are you quoting more fake polling from Democrap funded/owned companies.

I notice you got a "like" from Kalirado. That says it all.

Proud to be born and raised here, long before politics mattered much. Your "Kalirado" silliness says it all.

 

[Deleted member 115654]

HICKENLOOPER says it all.

America is facing an epidemic of gun violence that is tragically all too familiar to us in Colorado. We have lost too many of our friends, neighbors, and children to guns, which has resulted in 39,000 lives lost nationwide in just one year. Over the past decade, more than 1.2 million Americans have been shot and millions more traumatized by gun violence, which has disproportionately impacted communities of color. Each day, 21 more children are victims of gun violence.

The loss of precious lives is incomprehensible, devastating, and deeply etched in our hearts and memories in places such as Columbine, Arapahoe, Platte Canyon, STEM School Highlands Ranch, Aurora, and in schools and communities across our state and nation.

For too long, the National Rifle Association's (NRA) leadership has recklessly fought even the most basic gun safety measures, such as universal background checks, which 90% of Americans and a majority of the NRA's own members support.

When I was Governor of Colorado, we took on the NRA leadership and won. It wasn't easy, but with the support of local and state elected officials and a diverse coalition of Coloradans, we were able to enact legislation requiring background checks for all gun sales, as well as a ban on large-capacity magazines. We became the first purple state to enact comprehensive gun safety legislation. If we could beat the NRA in Colorado, we can beat them nationally.

Senator Gardner has received nearly $4 million in support from the NRA and is standing in the way of allowing background checks — among other reforms — to receive a hearing in the United States Senate. He has also voted against closing loopholes that allow guns to fall into dangerous hands. Enough is enough.

As your next Senator, I will fight for comprehensive, common-sense policies to tackle gun violence.

A National Agenda: Common-Sense Gun Safety Policies

• Ensure background checks for all gun sales

Background checks save lives. Since the 1990s, the background check system has blocked the sale of more than 3 million guns to criminals, domestic abusers, and other dangerous people. We need to expand background checks to cover gun shows and online retailers, as well as close the "Charleston Loophole" to ensure that all background checks are properly completed.

• Establish national magazine limits

Magazine limits save lives during shootings. The shooter who killed 12 and wounded 59 at an Aurora movie theater in 2012 was carrying a gun equipped with a 100-round magazine. The shooter in Tucson, Arizona, who killed six and wounded 13 — including former Congresswoman Gabby Giffords in 2011 — was carrying a handgun equipped with a 33-round magazine. That shooting came to an end when he was tackled by a bystander while he tried to reload his gun.

• Restore an assault weapons ban

It's time for Congress to enact an effective assault weapons ban that builds on the previous legislation that expired in 2004.

• Fund community-based violence intervention

Communities of color in Colorado and our nation have to deal with gun violence on a daily basis and face a considerably higher risk of being a victim of gun homicide. Funding evidence-based violence-intervention programs has been shown to be effective at reducing shootings in cities across the country.

• Strengthen enforcement against gun trafficking

We must stop gun trafficking by strengthening prosecution of the small number of "bad actor" gun dealers who illegally sell guns without a background check. Law enforcement also needs the tools to treat straw purchases (where criminals who can't pass a background check have someone purchase weapons on their behalf) as serious offenses.

• Stop the proliferation of "ghost guns"

Ghost guns are firearms that can be assembled at home with parts that have been ordered online or produced by a 3D printer. They are available without a background check, cannot be traced by law enforcement, and are an emerging issue in Colorado and across the country. We must pass a federal law ensuring that no one can construct a firearm without first going through a background check.

• Hold reckless gun manufacturers responsible

We need to repeal the 2005 law that uniquely shields irresponsible gun manufacturers from lawsuits and puts them in the same category as every other business.

• Implement Extreme Risk Order Protection laws

In order to prevent future acts of violence, Extreme Risk Order Protection laws let families and law enforcement temporarily remove an individual's access to firearms when judged to be a danger to themselves or others. These policies are effective at both preventing mass shootings and reducing suicide.

• Create a safer future for our children and communities

While the NRA leadership has embarked on a relentless effort to mislead, mischaracterize, and deceive, we know in Colorado that we can protect our Second Amendment rights AND protect our children and communities with reasonable gun safety policies.

 

[Mram10us]

HICKENLOOPER says it all.

America is facing an epidemic of gun violence that is tragically all too familiar to us in Colorado. We have lost too many of our friends, neighbors, and children to guns, which has resulted in 39,000 lives lost nationwide in just one year. Over the past decade, more than 1.2 million Americans have been shot and millions more traumatized by gun violence, which has disproportionately impacted communities of color. Each day, 21 more children are victims of gun violence.

The loss of precious lives is incomprehensible, devastating, and deeply etched in our hearts and memories in places such as Columbine, Arapahoe, Platte Canyon, STEM School Highlands Ranch, Aurora, and in schools and communities across our state and nation.

For too long, the National Rifle Association's (NRA) leadership has recklessly fought even the most basic gun safety measures, such as universal background checks, which 90% of Americans and a majority of the NRA's own members support.

When I was Governor of Colorado, we took on the NRA leadership and won. It wasn't easy, but with the support of local and state elected officials and a diverse coalition of Coloradans, we were able to enact legislation requiring background checks for all gun sales, as well as a ban on large-capacity magazines. We became the first purple state to enact comprehensive gun safety legislation. If we could beat the NRA in Colorado, we can beat them nationally.

Senator Gardner has received nearly $4 million in support from the NRA and is standing in the way of allowing background checks — among other reforms — to receive a hearing in the United States Senate. He has also voted against closing loopholes that allow guns to fall into dangerous hands. Enough is enough.

As your next Senator, I will fight for comprehensive, common-sense policies to tackle gun violence.

A National Agenda: Common-Sense Gun Safety Policies

• Ensure background checks for all gun sales

Background checks save lives. Since the 1990s, the background check system has blocked the sale of more than 3 million guns to criminals, domestic abusers, and other dangerous people. We need to expand background checks to cover gun shows and online retailers, as well as close the "Charleston Loophole" to ensure that all background checks are properly completed.

• Establish national magazine limits

Magazine limits save lives during shootings. The shooter who killed 12 and wounded 59 at an Aurora movie theater in 2012 was carrying a gun equipped with a 100-round magazine. The shooter in Tucson, Arizona, who killed six and wounded 13 — including former Congresswoman Gabby Giffords in 2011 — was carrying a handgun equipped with a 33-round magazine. That shooting came to an end when he was tackled by a bystander while he tried to reload his gun.

• Restore an assault weapons ban

It's time for Congress to enact an effective assault weapons ban that builds on the previous legislation that expired in 2004.

• Fund community-based violence intervention

Communities of color in Colorado and our nation have to deal with gun violence on a daily basis and face a considerably higher risk of being a victim of gun homicide. Funding evidence-based violence-intervention programs has been shown to be effective at reducing shootings in cities across the country.

• Strengthen enforcement against gun trafficking

We must stop gun trafficking by strengthening prosecution of the small number of "bad actor" gun dealers who illegally sell guns without a background check. Law enforcement also needs the tools to treat straw purchases (where criminals who can't pass a background check have someone purchase weapons on their behalf) as serious offenses.

• Stop the proliferation of "ghost guns"

Ghost guns are firearms that can be assembled at home with parts that have been ordered online or produced by a 3D printer. They are available without a background check, cannot be traced by law enforcement, and are an emerging issue in Colorado and across the country. We must pass a federal law ensuring that no one can construct a firearm without first going through a background check.

• Hold reckless gun manufacturers responsible

We need to repeal the 2005 law that uniquely shields irresponsible gun manufacturers from lawsuits and puts them in the same category as every other business.

• Implement Extreme Risk Order Protection laws

In order to prevent future acts of violence, Extreme Risk Order Protection laws let families and law enforcement temporarily remove an individual's access to firearms when judged to be a danger to themselves or others. These policies are effective at both preventing mass shootings and reducing suicide.

• Create a safer future for our children and communities

While the NRA leadership has embarked on a relentless effort to mislead, mischaracterize, and deceive, we know in Colorado that we can protect our Second Amendment rights AND protect our children and communities with reasonable gun safety policies.

People should be accurate with statistics and mention the number of suicides (which would happen regardless) and the number of gang/drug related. Gun violence is not the problem, it is the people, as we can all agree.

When being honest statistically, we see that the number of gun related deaths are far less than second hand smoke each year.

 

[Treeslug]

You nailed it. There is no reason that politcs/religion should be treated adversarialy. Just because somone doesn't share your beliefs (political or religious) doesn't mean that they are an enemy. How they (or you/we/I for that matter) act on that disagreement creates the enemy.

Think of how much good could happen if people stopped working against each other (trying to make the world what they think is best) and started working WITH each other to help make the world best for everyone.

To bring it back to politics of guns and hunting:

Most of you on here grew up in the country or suburbs and view a gun as a useful tool. It can provide food, protection, and enjoyment.

Most of the people that oppose gun ownership grew up in extremely urban areas and only know guns as a tool of violence, fear, and oppression (gangs, thieves etc).

Can you guys not see why they want to get rid of guns?

What do you think would happen if, instead of treating these people like the enemy, even just 10% of gun enthusiasts (like most of us on here) got together, volunteered our time/guns/ammo, and set up friendly, informative, low pressure range days to help people learn the good aspects of firearms instead of only knowing the bad ones that they grew up with?

I'm sure we all own a 22lr pistol and/or rifle and ammunition is super cheap. I've done it, and it always ends up with the peraon having a new respect for guns and changing their view of them for the better.

Your first hurdle will be deciding on "what" will make the earth BEST for EVERYONE. It is political again.

Correct: Most people that oppose gun ownership know little or nothing about guns. Go ahead and take some gun opponents to a friendly range for a day of shooting. Don't forget to stop off and buy that larger, harder to move safe you have always wanted. Sooner than later, you will wish you had.

The people who grew up in urban areas and only know guns as tools of violence, fear, and oppression are not the people that want to take away our guns. Nor are those people the ones that want to defund the police.

In the end, this is NOT a struggle over guns! This is a struggle over FREEDOM. It is the political elite who want to take away our gun rights because they intend to take away ALL of our rights. Arm yourself with knowledge and stop voting away your rights that were given to you in the blood of others. That is your right.

 

[Mram10us]

You keep singling out the democratic party for being unreasonable, fanatical, zealots. You need to realize the the republican party is absolutely no better in that regard. The only reason they seem less so is that you agree with much of what they want.

Look at Mitch McConnell for proof. He's refused to allow a vote on several things in the senate simply because they were proposed by a Democrat. Even when those things aligned with not only typical republican views, but the majority of the US populations desires.

We single out the dems because they are trying to take away the one tool that is constitutionally protected to fight against tyrants. Dems are forcing everyone to pay for abortion and social programs that we do not agree with. They are the ones trying to change the country, many of us signed up to serve and protect. We are the last free haven on earth. I doubt i'll change your mind.

 

[squeeeeze]

Like it or not the far left (who in fact vote democrat) will NEVER stop fighting and wants to dismantle our constitution and "fundamentally change America" at ANY cost with no shame or ethics whatsoever. The left can do whatever they want and I'm surprised so many are ok with it. I'm very concerned about my 1st and 2nd Amendment rights (the only reason we're here)!

Yes the far right may be radical and extreme, but most still fight to preserve the constitution, NOT destroy it. While I don't condone extremist behavior, at some point we have to stand up and fight to preserve it. As long as we continue to try to stay center and non biased, the left continues to push their agenda further and further left. There has to be checks and balances. We have to wake up, sitting silent is not an option if we want to try and preserve the constitution.

It's too late for our country at this point, and has been since 2012. Trump came in 4 years too late in my opinion. At least people are seeing the truth thanks to him. The left keeps pulling us further and further left, and not enough people willing to stand up and pull back to the right. So much PC and hurt feeling nowadays.

BTW, where the heck has the NRA been??? They sat silent through the election. Apparently they have been strong armed and been attacked and finally just gave in I'm guessing. They gave in to the mob that had probably been attacking them with legal action, threats or bribes. It seems even they have given in on the good fight from what I see. Glad to see my donations to them have let them be silent, but I hope that changes.

 

[Deleted member 115654]

Old Wayne is too busy spending his $500,000.00/ year clothing allowance to worry about we deplorables. The NRA is another swamp needing draining.