300 wm 178 eld-x or 200 eld-x
- Thread starter Awol469
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Montucky Roamer
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The 178 may be very violent , splashy at wm speeds. My buddy shot a bear in the side of the head at 300 yards from a 300wm with the 200eldx and it never penetrated skull. So just be aware the eldm or x are great at LR velocities but require a little more thought about staying off bone etc, inside say 5-600 yards...
crazyhorse
Well-Known Member
Certainly not doubting the facts, but there had to be other factors in play for this result. I don't see a bear skull stopping a 200gr bullet of any construction from a 300WM, especially @ 300yds. Maybe a glancing blow?
Wedgy
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It begs the question "why" ?
Montucky Roamer
Well-Known Member
It was a follow up shot after a boiler room hit at closer range as it ran for the brush. A "miss' if you will
. He wasn't trying for the head. The vital hit was fatal anyway but the bear didnt know it yet. There may have been other factors like angle or who know? It was a dead bear so it wasn't a failure but just a rather notable result. On a deer at 100 the 200 certainly killed it very dead. No exit but wasn't needed at all. Just a shot in the ribs, not anything too heavy Jacket and core separated as expected....wasn't really what the bullets intended for but it worked.
Just be aware of the bullets intended purpose is all I'm saying.
freddiej
Well-Known Member
Awol469
Welcome to the group, to be very blunt with you.. no one slug can do everything. You have to pick your slugs for the range, animal, and construction of the slug to open or not open at range or speed. you must pick your slug for the specific senario you are going to have. or at least the one you are predicting you will have. if you are too close with one slug it will blow up the game, or if the game is too small it will blow it up as well. then you have too long then the slug will not open and pass through the game or if the slug is too light for the game. then you have to know what your gun likes in the weight category. I have a Sako 995 300 Win Mag. it loves 175 grain Barnes, and 190 grain AB's, and most recently it loves to fling the 185 grain Bergers. what it hates are slugs above 190 grains. I have tried 200's, 208's, 212's, 215's. it just hates them. so I went lower, it absolutely hated anything below 165 grain. so my gun's sweet spot is 165 grain to 190 grain slugs. IF I want to shoot the heavier slugs I am going to have to rebarrel it to a 1:8" or 1:7.5" twist. OR I have to rebarrel my other 300 win mag to a heavier twist. I have plans for two more builds.. 1:8" 338 Win Mag and a 1:7.5" 300 win mag. right now I have a 338 win mag that I love but I can not launch the 275's and 300's out of it without the slug destabilizing. Barnes 250's are marginal at best out of this gun so, I might be having the gun rebarreled sooner than later. so I am going to rebarrel it and put a bit longer barrel on it. I might be rebarreling it next month.
Welcome to the group, to be very blunt with you.. no one slug can do everything. You have to pick your slugs for the range, animal, and construction of the slug to open or not open at range or speed. you must pick your slug for the specific senario you are going to have. or at least the one you are predicting you will have. if you are too close with one slug it will blow up the game, or if the game is too small it will blow it up as well. then you have too long then the slug will not open and pass through the game or if the slug is too light for the game. then you have to know what your gun likes in the weight category. I have a Sako 995 300 Win Mag. it loves 175 grain Barnes, and 190 grain AB's, and most recently it loves to fling the 185 grain Bergers. what it hates are slugs above 190 grains. I have tried 200's, 208's, 212's, 215's. it just hates them. so I went lower, it absolutely hated anything below 165 grain. so my gun's sweet spot is 165 grain to 190 grain slugs. IF I want to shoot the heavier slugs I am going to have to rebarrel it to a 1:8" or 1:7.5" twist. OR I have to rebarrel my other 300 win mag to a heavier twist. I have plans for two more builds.. 1:8" 338 Win Mag and a 1:7.5" 300 win mag. right now I have a 338 win mag that I love but I can not launch the 275's and 300's out of it without the slug destabilizing. Barnes 250's are marginal at best out of this gun so, I might be having the gun rebarreled sooner than later. so I am going to rebarrel it and put a bit longer barrel on it. I might be rebarreling it next month.
Joefrazell
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Personally I'd go heavier. 212
drakehammer
Well-Known Member
What twist is the problematic Sako .300 Win. barrel now? I don't think you mentioned it. If its 1:11 or 1:12 then I can buy a potential stability issue that might be fixed by a faster twist...although 1:8 or 1:7.5 seems a bit unnecessary for the 200ish grainers.
I'm fairly certain that 1:10 should have stabilized the 200-215gr bullets you mentioned. From '06 to RUM, my 1:10s will handle all of those quite nicely. If it is in fact currently a 1:10, then bullet stability isn't really the source of your heavy projectile accuracy woes is it? Not to my way of thinking at least. Did I miss or misinterpret something?
ATH
Well-Known Member
I would not assume heavier bullets are "too much". Lighter bullets will carry more velocity, so if construction is equal, they will be more explosive. So a lighter bullet could actually be "too much". For example I've loaded 110gr Vmax at 3800+ fps in 300WM, talk about explosive. It's literally shooting a hand grenade into something. A 200gr bullet from a 300WM inside 400 yards is plenty destructive. I see no need to increase the destruction with a lighter bullet, and I range everything anyways so I don't need to go to a lighter weight to try and gain a few inches in close range trajectory. My 200gr load with Nosler AB is my "do everything" load.
For deer or larger game I'm a fan of 200gr bullets in the 300WM at all ranges. I have not yet played with the heavier bullets as I worked up my load before they were available and am slow at burning out my barrel and moving on to something new, but I'd only look up at the 208s and 212s.
For deer or larger game I'm a fan of 200gr bullets in the 300WM at all ranges. I have not yet played with the heavier bullets as I worked up my load before they were available and am slow at burning out my barrel and moving on to something new, but I'd only look up at the 208s and 212s.
freddiej
Well-Known Member
Drake, You would think so. That however has never been my experience all the way back to 1986. starting with a Ruger M-77 in 30-06 1:10" twist barrel would not shoot any slug over a 180 grain Speer HPBT. This Ruger would shoot 150 through 180 grain slugs and then the groups would just start opening up and by 200 grain slugs it would hardly stabilize the slug. I honestly have not checked the twist of my 300 win mag. I presumed it was a 1:10" twist. but I found out a month ago it is a 1:11" from a friend that owns the same vintage rifle. I have had this problem ever since I was a 1,000 competitor shooting 190 grain slugs (that rifle was a 1:10" twist barrel and refused to stabilize 200 grain match kings) . I can not speak for anyone else that I competed with but my 1:10" twist barrel never did like the 200 and heavier grain/longer slugs. it never did stabilize them properly. now, no one else has seemed to have this bad luck or problem with shooting 200 grain Match Kings like I did. I have had this problem since the early 1990's. call it a personal cross to bear. I can not seem to make any 300 win mag, stike that.. ANY 30 caliber rifle I have ever owned with a 1:10 or 1:11 twist barrel shoot any slug over 190 grains. however, I built a 1:8" twist 300 win mag, only to have it stolen 2 months later, that slung anything over 175 grain slugs (180 through 240) down range at one mile without a problem. like I said my gun loves the 165 to 190 grain slugs.. no other slug will shoot well in the gun. I have tried for 11/12 years to do so without any luck. I just traded for another 300 win mag (1:10" barrel) that will get a 1:8" or 1:7.5" twist barrel on it or I will get my Sako rebarreled. I do not care which. I am just tired of people calling me a liar, expounding on what I am doing wrong, or saying that my life's experiences are wrong. I am at the end of my rope with this problem. until the day I die I will never use a slug heavier or longer than a 190 grain AB through my 300 win mag unless it has a 1:8" barrel on it.
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drakehammer
Well-Known Member
Fair enough. Interesting no doubt.
AWOL469. I would go 200 or heavier. I am currently using the 225 eldm with a 1:10 and it shoots great. I had a 212 eldx pencil through an antelope at 500. Not saying it's a bad bullet but that's just my experience with them. If your concerned about the 200 being too heavy for antelope why not work up a load for both and switch depending on the animal your hunting?
dporter99
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To the OP's question re: doing it all, I shot a cow elk and doe antelope this past fall with a 300WM using the Hornady 212 ELD-X. I'm running a Broughton #4, 10 Twist, 26" with great accuracy using a 212 ELD-X and H1000.
Unexpectedly had an opportunity to take a doe antelope on a cow elk hunt out of state and didn't have a smaller caliber with me. Clearly one doesn't need a 300WM for a doe antelope, but it was effective! If a perfect shot, I would've placed the bullet right behind the shoulder on that doe and not got into the shoulder meat. Due to shooter error, I didn't, and instead went high shoulder at ~200 yds. Dropped her on the spot with a pass through, and there was a fair amount of bloodshot meat. I'm fairly confident that a 178 or 200 gr bullet would've done the same damage. Just tells me that I'd go with the heaviest bullet the gun likes and deliver the knockdown power on the elk (one shot put my cow down too at a similar distance), then just recognize judicious shot placement will be key on lighter game to avoid losing shoulder meat...
Just my opinion...
Unexpectedly had an opportunity to take a doe antelope on a cow elk hunt out of state and didn't have a smaller caliber with me. Clearly one doesn't need a 300WM for a doe antelope, but it was effective! If a perfect shot, I would've placed the bullet right behind the shoulder on that doe and not got into the shoulder meat. Due to shooter error, I didn't, and instead went high shoulder at ~200 yds. Dropped her on the spot with a pass through, and there was a fair amount of bloodshot meat. I'm fairly confident that a 178 or 200 gr bullet would've done the same damage. Just tells me that I'd go with the heaviest bullet the gun likes and deliver the knockdown power on the elk (one shot put my cow down too at a similar distance), then just recognize judicious shot placement will be key on lighter game to avoid losing shoulder meat...
Just my opinion...
