belted cartridges

sable tireur said:
[<>] Many of us can also turn the belts off of belted mags allowing the headspace to shift to the shoulder. A new HS gauge is required.
Click to expand...

There is NEVER a reason to remove the belt on a belted case.

The reason people have case splits and other problems with beltless cases is because they full size the cases, creating real headspace... which leads to cases stretching, and splits.

An experienced handloader will not full length size any belted case. They use the shoulder to set dies, exactly like a beltless case...

There are no headspace gauges for belted cases with the belt removed.
 
CatShooter said:
There is NEVER a reason to remove the belt on a belted case.

The reason people have case splits and other problems with beltless cases is because they full size the cases, creating real headspace... which leads to cases stretching, and splits.

An experienced handloader will not full length size any belted case. They use the shoulder to set dies, exactly like a beltless case...

There are no headspace gauges for belted cases with the belt removed.
Click to expand...

NEVER?

Well... yes there is. When I'm making brass for another (obsolete) cartridge which does not have a belt. In fact, I'm working on just such a project currently. Then I get a new reamer and new headspace gauge to go with it which headspaces off the shoulder. Then I turn off the belt.

There are still a few of us left who manipulate existing cases to produce obsolete cases or difficult to find cases. We also make our own dies out of necessity as well for the same reasons.

Just goes to prove that old saying:

Never say Never.:D;)
 
jmcmath said:
Thanks, I guess my point is only that I think because a lot of people here know how to do it they speak as if it's foolproof. However, for people that are learning or go by the books they very well may run into problems(at least a little quicker), and acting like those hang ups don't exist seems disingenuous.

This is good to know, I am not an experienced reloader and I am building a 300 win mag right now that will be my first adventure into reloading belts.

You heard it right, not a PRC.... a boring old win mag;)
Click to expand...


Nothing wrong with being inexperienced. We have all been there. Before the Internet , we got our information from someone that we new was more experienced or we just learned the hard way.

Now there are so many "Experts" on line that it is confusing to the beginner, so knowing the source of the information is very important.
I always tell people not to believe anything you hear and only half of what you see. At least on this site, if someone gives you some bad advice, others on this site will correct them to keep you out of trouble.

Many years ago I had a case head separation on a non belted case. I figured it out and have never had another one on shouldered cases.
The first time I had one on a belted case, I applied the same fix and
have never had another one (Over 40 years ago). Now I do minimum sizing on all cases just to the point that they chamber good and no more. The only exception is for dangerous game where you cant afford to have problems chambering (The reason that belted cases were designed) brass life is not a consideration when hunting something intent on doing you bodily harm.

Accuracy is also something you often hear that is a problem with belted cases, It is not. Some of the most accurate rifles I have seen are using belted cases and are used for long range hunting and matches over 1000 yards.

The cartridge that you want to load for is belted and has a very short neck that for a while was also considered bad. It became the top Sniper round for a while and had a reputation for extreme accuracy
so the short neck bunch had to eat crow.

Learn the cartridge, learn the proper reloading this cartridge, and re loading can be mastered by anyone.

J E CUSTOM
 
1000 yard competitors relied on the 300 Win Mag "forever". Experimented with others and came full circle back to the 300. The Marine snipers are going back (have gone back) to the 300 WM. I'd say.... NO, nothing wrong with belted cartridges. ANY head can separate if you shoot it too much and don't re-size optimally. Don't be greedy and limit the number of reloads (probably 6-10, maybe more). It's a Ferrari. There's a price to pay for performance. Otherwise, drive a Ford Taurus (.308). Speed Kills! :D
 
sable tireur said:
NEVER?

Well... yes there is. When I'm making brass for another (obsolete) cartridge which does not have a belt. In fact, I'm working on just such a project currently. Then I get a new reamer and new headspace gauge to go with it which headspaces off the shoulder. Then I turn off the belt.

There are still a few of us left who manipulate existing cases to produce obsolete cases or difficult to find cases. We also make our own dies out of necessity as well for the same reasons.

Just goes to prove that old saying:

Never say Never.:D;)
Click to expand...
Never....is SUCH a long time.
 
Gregg C said:
No worries man. Worked 17 yesterday myself-I get it.
And now, back to our regularly scheduled program. I know several people personally who used to constantly hate on belted cases. Funny thing was, none of them could point to any issue, and say, that's gonna bite you on the ---. It was all their perception from questionable sources. There is a condition that can develop with a belt. The Dread Case Bulge! And an ingenious tool was brought about to combat this. I have never needed it. Got a 300WM, Been loading for that rifle 30yrs. Never caught Case Bulge.
Click to expand...
I have a great idea for both of you....go the heck to bed before the love starts OOZING thru the whole forum!
 
Michael Cantor said:
1000 yard competitors relied on the 300 Win Mag "forever". Experimented with others and came full circle back to the 300. The Marine snipers are going back (have gone back) to the 300 WM. I'd say.... NO, nothing wrong with belted cartridges. ANY head can separate if you shoot it too much and don't re-size optimally. Don't be greedy and limit the number of reloads (probably 6-10, maybe more). It's a Ferrari. There's a price to pay for performance. Otherwise, drive a Ford Taurus (.308). Speed Kills! :D
Click to expand...
That is literally three decade old information, no accuracy records are held by anything with a belt, the 300 WSM quickly wiped it out of contention!!
 
You can have any headspace guage you want made by a reamer manufacturer, no different than any wildcat.
 
bigngreen said:
That is literally three decade old information, no accuracy records are held by anything with a belt, the 300 WSM quickly wiped it out of contention!!
Click to expand...
Actually several years ago a .300 Ackley rail gun (huge water-cooled setup) was holding a LR accuracy record.
 

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