Extracting split cases from chambers

[wildcat westerner]

Hello,
Recently I was fire forming a large amount of cases for a .257 A.I. and I had a case split in half on firing it. Years ago I had a similar situation occur with a different rifle and it cost quite bit to have the partial case removed from the chamber.
Yesterday a solution was suggested to me to solve the problem and I am sharing it with you because it works and is quite simple. Mount the rifle securely in a padded vise horizontally
1. Insert your cleaning rod from the muzzled end of the rifle
2. Attatch a large metal bristle brush on the end of you rod which now sticks out the end of your actio n.
3. Pull this large brush back into the chamber, where it will become stuck in the neck. The tighter the better.
4.Now, give the handle on the rod a sharp smack
5. The case will be removed from your chamber if your brush was fit tight inside it.
I am embarrassed that the solution could be so simple, even though the problem was so frustrating.

Take care,

WW

 

[SealT5]

Thank you for sharing

Joe

 

[tbrice23]

Duly noted.
Ok... just as important, how did it happen? Were you using a false shoulder or jamming the bullets intothe lands to form ?

 

[MagnumManiac]

I have had this issue quite often with a certain brand of brass in my 6.5 Swede.
The first few were difficult to remove with a rod and brush, then by accident I found an even easier solution.
Now, in a push feed action, I wouldn't recommend this, but seeing that my rifle is a CRF, the claw is large enough that damage is unlikely.
In rapid fire 3 position, I didn't notice that only the case head was ejected, and racked the bolt to discover it stopped way short of where it should, when I pulled the bolt, the loaded round came out with the separated case stuck on it and it was REALLY stuck.
Every time this happened from then on, I just racked a loaded round into the chamber and the separated case came out.

Cheers.

 

[Varmint Hunter]

My buddy has occasionally had a case head separate, leaving the balance of the case in the chamber. He inserts a cleaning rod with a shotgun brass brush from the breech end and pulls the case straight back. It has worked many times.
I'm not sure what size bronze brush he uses. 410, 20ga ??

 

[MNbogboy]

Duly noted.
Ok... just as important, how did it happen? Were you using a false shoulder or jamming the bullets intothe lands to form ?

Perfect question.
Most of us will become painfully aware during our reloading career that The main reason for "split" cases (incipient head separation) is over stretching your brass.
When forming Ackley cartridges it is important that the case head be held against the bolt head as tbrice23 states.
A true Ackley chamber has built in interference (.002-.004) to provide this. This is based on saami spec parent case. Not all brass meets these specs so false shoulder or jamming will provide this fit.
Secondly this applies to all calibers, others or should I say a lot of reloaders set their dies to generic instructions that came with the die. This is the cause of the biggest percentage of all case separation. My first experience happened approx 10 years into my handloading experience (cost me a buck). Now at over 50 years it hasn't happened since (knock on wood).
My suggestion to anyone having issues with head separation is to research incipient head separation and shoulder bumping.
My .02
Randy

 

[tbrice23]

Perfect question.
Most of us will become painfully aware during our reloading career that The main reason for "split" cases (incipient head separation) is over stretching your brass.
When forming Ackley cartridges it is important that the case head be held against the bolt head as tbrice23 states.
A true Ackley chamber has built in interference (.002-.004) to provide this. This is based on saami spec parent case. Not all brass meets these specs so false shoulder or jamming will provide this fit.
Secondly this applies to all calibers, others or should I say a lot of reloaders set their dies to generic instructions that came with the die. This is the cause of the biggest percentage of all case separation. My first experience happened approx 10 years into my handloading experience (cost me a buck). Now at over 50 years it hasn't happened since (knock on wood).
My suggestion to anyone having issues with head separation is to research incipient head separation and shoulder bumping.
My .02
Randy

Agree I set my headspace on Ackley chambers for .004- .006 crush fit. Now forming 7wsm from 300wsm brass I use the false shoulder method.

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

the oversized brush method will clear most separated cases. I have had to use a wood drill bit a couple of times combined with a bit of creeping oil (from the muzzle end) to get the brass to spin loose. The bit will dig into the brass like an easy out and after a half turn or so it'll drop free. Be careful on this or you WILL mess up your chamber.

 

[wildcat westerner]

Thanks for all your input.
The false shoulder method has worked for me in th past, but this time I was necking Up , not down, with a huge amount of .244 brass that simple would not fit my .244 despite sizing it all with a small brass die. That surprised me. So I decided to convert all of it to my old .257 AI, and after all th fire forming, hopefully tomorrow, then I will be load all of this brass witha single loading and it should last the rest of my life, for this rifle. I have seated out 5 different bullet weights to force that base of the case hard against the boltface.
Take Care,
WW

 

[MNbogboy]

Thanks for all your input.
The false shoulder method has worked for me in th past, but this time I was necking Up , not down, with a huge amount of .244 brass that simple would not fit my .244 despite sizing it all with a small brass die. That surprised me. So I decided to convert all of it to my old .257 AI, and after all th fire forming, hopefully tomorrow, then I will be load all of this brass witha single loading and it should last the rest of my life, for this rifle. I have seated out 5 different bullet weights to force that base of the case hard against the boltface.
Take Care,
WW

Depending on how soft brass gets after annealing it is possible that ejector spring pressure (depending on rifle) can push the bullet into the case or deeper into the lands. Removal of the ejector during fireforming may help.
Also I have expanded up one or 2 calibers to form a false shoulder as in your case. Here annealing is your friend.
Good luck with the rest of them.

 

[wildcat westerner]

Yep, they are all loaded and ready to be fired I tried one this morning and there was a dimple in the primer, but no ignition. I am done fooling with this rifle and will turn it over to my gunsmith when he gets active once again in May.

I am curious : MN bogboy, where are you at? I was raised in Mankato.

WW

 

[bigedp51]

You need to get a Hornady cartridge case headspace gauge and measure a "GOOD" case fired in your rifle. Meaning a case that has the shoulder blown out and a snug fit in your chamber and get a good headspace reading off the cases.

Now put a .020 feeler gauge between the base of the die and the shell holder and adjust down until you contact the feeler gauge.

Now full length resize the case and see if squeezing the case diameter will move the shoulder forward. Raising the die off the shell holder and sizing the case should make the case longer in headspace than the chamber.

Any time you have case head separations, it means you have far too much head clearance. And this allows the case to stretch excessively causing the case separation.

 

[MNbogboy]

Yep, they are all loaded and ready to be fired I tried one this morning and there was a dimple in the primer, but no ignition. I am done fooling with this rifle and will turn it over to my gunsmith when he gets active once again in May.

I am curious : MN bogboy, where are you at? I was raised in Mankato.

WW

Hibbing
By your post it is pretty clear that your 244 (6mm Rem) cases are real short at the shoulder. And your jammed bullets are not holding the case back. My guess your necks would end up real short if it did fire. Even though you jam the bullets the ejector and extractor (before it jumps over) are pushing the bullet farther into the lands. You could make up a longer dummy round until it jams hard enough to just get the bolt closed. Of coarse you would have to pull all your others out but most importantly "work up" to safe pressure.
If they do fire in the condition they are now they will really stretch the brass and start the thinning where subsequent loads will separate also.
Did you get any to form? If so make some comparison measurements to see if it is even possible to use that brass in your chamber.
Also by removing your ejector plunger you could use the COW method if you manually insert the case under the extractor.
Wish you were closer I might be able to help you get something work. I pretty much do all Savage stuff for myself, kids & grandkids.
Your gunsmith will get you fixed up.
Keep me posted