The old 25-06 Remington and 270 Winchester shot flatter than 6.5 CM

If they perform well consistently, I love wildcats, standards and new offerings. You have to have some availability of components, of course, but old sentiment or commercial popularity is rarely a factor when I choose a caliber. It's all ballistics.
 
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Do they still have these shoots? Im up by Waterloo, but would definitely travel to Pella. Letting my wife shop in town while i shoot sounds like a win win
Sadly, no. The landowner died, and remaining family didn't want the shooting to continue. The benches were removed and sold to a guy from across the state line in Downing, Mo., which became the Show Me Benchrest Shooters Assc., which only lasted a couple of years. A couple three of my range records there should hold for a while.
 
CMP, "But seriously I don't quite understand the hate directed at the 6.5 Creedmoor, 6.5 PRC and Hornady in general?". For me personally there isn't hate, I think that it is more about the fact that the 6.5s are being cherished and worshiped as the "do all", "shoot all", long range cartridge of the shooting market today. Then we're reading that someone shot an elk at 1750 yards and flop, bang, DRT results. And....that's being held as gospel and then we hear more stories of the same nature supporting the caliber. It seems like every shooting and gun magazine that you pick up and read has a new article about the 6.5 performance, or another gun company is coming out with a "new" rifle in the 6.5 caliber. There are numerous posts from reliable guides and hunters, who are stating that the 6.5 CM (in their opinion) is not an adequate elk caliber, yet there are posts where people argue against those opinions. I feel like the shooting public has swallowed the shooting industry's advertising hype (drank their Koolaid) for the promotion of the caliber. I firmly believe in having the right tool for the job, as well as having an adequate caliber/bullet to get the job done ethically for the animal being hunted/pursued. I like the older calibers, personally like the .270 Winchester for nostalgic reasons as well as performance reasons. There is a lot to be said about the .270 Winchester and a lot more to be said about the performance of the .270WSM. I'll go out on a limb here and probably get beat up pretty bad, but I will state that "any caliber that is sub 30 caliber" (.257 to .284) will be hard pressed to beat the performance of the .270WSM; I suspect that I'll get some flack from the 26-28 Nosler crowd here:rolleyes:! This doesn't mean that it is the catch all, do all caliber, just that it is a pretty good performer for just about any long range shooting on game. The older calibers 25-06, 7mm-06 (.280/.280AI), 6.5-06 also are really great performers. The 338-06 and the 35 Whelen are two great rounds that don't really get enough acknowledgement from the shooting public. I'm not saying that the Whelen is a great long range cartridge, just stating that it really does not get the acknowledgement it deserves. I recently read a post about elk hunting where a guy wrote that he always uses and has successfully shot many elk with his 35 Whelen. I had to read that post twice to make sure I didn't read incorrectly. The 338-06A-Square is a decent round, not as good as the .338Winmag, however is a lot more manageable for the recoil sensitive shooter and it uses a whole lot less powder to get the job done. It's very accurate and really don't beat you up with recoil, yet there's not a whole lot written about the round! I like the Ackley calibers, presently having two of them built. I just think that many of the readers are getting tired about the 6.5s and how great killing machines they are for everything that walks the face of the earth. I believe this is just the point that the OP is making with this post! No hate.
There are also guides saying they are fine for elk with good bullets! And it is as long as you keep under 700 yds or so! Its really that simple! Its not perfect, but will do the job! All the bla bla in the world will not change that fact!
 
There is no doubt the 6.5 creedmoor is a fine round . Less powder , less recoil and flat shooting to a given yardage! The 270 more powder and more recoil yes.. But you can push a heavier bullet faster which will give as we all know retained velocity and energy. From what I've seen and do my self is the addition of a break on the rifle. If you are going to have one on a 6.5 creedmoor why not put one on everything else. Give each rifle the same love.
 
Morning. Like many old timers (I'm 74) I tend to rely on the older, time tested calibers, ie, I hunt with a 700 Remington BDL in 270 Winchester (pictured on the left) and I use a Ruger SR 762 (ie, 308) AR-10 platform, at the range. I have found that both meet my needs and I have no problem finding ammunition, about the only caliber more plentiful would be the 30-06 and I carried one of them for quite a while.
 
Morning. Like many old timers (I'm 74) I tend to rely on the older, time tested calibers, ie, I hunt with a 700 Remington BDL in 270 Winchester (pictured on the left) and I use a Ruger SR 762 (ie, 308) AR-10 platform, at the range. I have found that both meet my needs and I have no problem finding ammunition, about the only caliber more plentiful would be the 30-06 and I carried one of them for quite a while.

Hello Msgt, great to read that I am not the only "ole" guy on here; 72yoa! I too like the older, time tested calibers; .270 Win, 30-06, .338-06, 35 Whelen, .358 Winchester, 45-70 to name but a few. I'm presently in the process of building a .270 Ackley Improved, lots of older, bad press on the cartridge, however I firmly believe that with the new powders and the new bullets that are out there, it ought to be a competitor for some of the newer ones that are being boasted and argued about. Nice looking rifle, is that myrtle wood stock?
 
There are also guides saying they are fine for elk with good bullets! And it is as long as you keep under 700 yds or so! Its really that simple! Its not perfect, but will do the job! All the bla bla in the world will not change that fact!
Are you saying or talking about the .270WSM or the 35 Whelen? I'm not too certain about the Whelen out to 700 yards, I don't think that the round has that much horsepower to get the job done; IMHO!
 
Dear Stuck in the Past,
Several things have changed the paradigm of big game hunting :
1) Laser range finders-you no longer have to shoot a Weatherby rope
2) Better bullet technology-a 130gr premium does what a 200gr cup&core did
3) Factory ammo of higher accuracy & velocity- tighter tolerance machines & blended powders
4) More accurate rifles both factory & custom- CDC tolerances, manufacturing techniques/tolerances
5) Better triggers !! a bigger deal than most admit
6) Better optics- more precise & repeatable internal adjustments
7) Hand held ballistic apps & wind meters- the last frontier starts yielding data
All this means less recoil to deliver proper bullet placement with superior penetration to vitals at greater distances.
 
6.5 Creedmoor is a nice little round for most of us it's the 260 rem ballistic twin. Writers and shooters get a hold of this round and sing it's praises to the point where it is perceived to shoot as flat as a beam of light and hits like Thor's hammer.
Truth is to get the full performance of the round you need to spend countless thousands of dollars for the rifle , scope and dies! It's almost criminal the way this round is exalted having people going out and buying the Savage axis or the Ruger Americans expecting to take down game at several hundred yards.
It's almost a oxymoron round if you think about it .... I want a super long range rifle/cartridge combo that is highly accurate with longer aero dynamic bullets with a case that has lesspowder capacity and longer neck. I have to fit all this into a short action length rifle .
Hey if your looking to shoot long range paper and measure your groups with a micrometer or you want a nice low recoil rifle for hunting deer size game the 6.5 CM fits the bill. That's what it is ,nothing more .
 
Oh and another thing...you don't have to have one of those dammm hearing destroying muzzle brakes. The Swedes 6.5x55 was&is the answer only due to old actions still out there, the lawyers have ruined another otherwise brilliant invention.
 
Dear Stuck in the Past,
Several things have changed the paradigm of big game hunting :
1) Laser range finders-you no longer have to shoot a Weatherby rope
2) Better bullet technology-a 130gr premium does what a 200gr cup&core did
3) Factory ammo of higher accuracy & velocity- tighter tolerance machines & blended powders
4) More accurate rifles both factory & custom- CDC tolerances, manufacturing techniques/tolerances
5) Better triggers !! a bigger deal than most admit
6) Better optics- more precise & repeatable internal adjustments
7) Hand held ballistic apps & wind meters- the last frontier starts yielding data
All this means less recoil to deliver proper bullet placement with superior penetration to vitals at greater distances.
Here's my take on this list...

1) This is true, range finders are a game changer, but they're still just a tool.

2) Ballistically, yes... Performance on game, Hell no! In a target-only environment, the modern 6.5mm 130 will beat the .30 caliber 200 partition. But in a hunting environment, the 130 6.5mm will never compare to the performance of a 200gr .30 caliber bullet when it comes to penetration, damage, and kinetic energy exerted onto the target. You can't change physics.

3) Factory ammo is only as good as the rifle that shoots it (typically factory rifles). If the rifle is sh!t or the shooter can't shoot, the ammo will make no difference, and accuracy will still be horrible.

4) True, factory rifles are finally catching up to technology, and this is also pushing customs and aftermarket companies to do better as well.

5) Triggers make a big difference, agree on that 100%.

6) Optics tech has come a LONG way in just 10 years. Today's $500 scopes are on-par with $1,500 scopes of 10 years ago.

7) This is true, they are very helpful TOOLS, however, they don't put the bullet on target for you...That skill still needs to be practiced.
 
I've never owned or shot the 6.5 creedmore, but have a one time experience with it. Guiding 3 hunters all armed with the Creed. First morning I find elk on a bench across canyon at 630 yds. These guys have the right gear, seem to know what they're talking about, and say they have practiced all summer at a 600 yd range with several opportunities at 1K. Wind is calm and everyone is well set on bipods. First guy fires one shot, misses and puts down his rifle. Next guy fires, looks like a gut shot and 3rd guy shoots immediately after. Another bad shot. One guy shoots again and misses. The other shoots again and elk drops. He proclaims it a high shoulder shot. That shot was a high head shot. The gut shot looking one left only a few drops of blood that were found a few hundred yards away. Poor shooting, plain and simple but I wonder if a more powerful round might have stopped the wounded one. The one we recovered had a neat little hole punched through a hoof and the head shot was a small punch as well. FWIW. Personally I think the round would be great for marmots, if it weren't for those high BC 25 cal VLD's Black Jack is making.
 
I love my 6.5 creedmoore that being said , mine is strictly for target shooting.
My hunting rifles range from 7mm-08 to 338 win mag , and sabot slugs . My go to being either a 300 wsm or a 30-06 depending on chances of getting scratched up.
I believe my 6.5 would be deadly at long ranges but I'm not into taking chances.
 
Truth is to get the full performance of the round you need to spend countless thousands of dollars for the rifle , scope and dies! It's almost criminal the way this round is exalted having people going out and buying the Savage axis or the Ruger Americans expecting to take down game at several hundred yards.

Was this sarcastic? My experience has been you don't need custom rifles and handloads anymore to shoot tiny groups and get long range performance. Rifle and ammo manufacturers have stepped up their game. Its not hard to find a factory rifle using factory ammo that will shoot sub moa out to 1000 yards. Don't know about the axis, but I have seen a kid use a 6.5 creed ruger american with a vortex hslr 4-16x44 paint a 5" group at 700 yards with hornady match ammo. That whole gun was put together for less than $1000.
 
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