what to do?

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by sean1, Oct 20, 2011.

  1. sean1

    sean1 Well-Known Member

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    i have a winshester m70 super grade in 300 wm. beautiful gun topped with a luepold 4.5-14 40 ao. could not get it to group less than 1.5 " at 100 yards. had a gunsmith rebed and float the barrel as well as lap the crown. i took it to the range the other day and still have no better results. accuracy seems to get worse as barrel gets warm. all ammo are handloads. any thoughts?
     
  2. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    You could fiddle with seating depth, and change powders. If you are noticing poor accuracy as the barrel heats up, then you want to take your time and keep it as consistent in temperature. You may have to wait a few minutes between shots. Some barrels don't like to be heated up.

    What is your current load and bullet selection? What brass are you using and what is your brass prep work like? A lot of variables. The more info you can give about the particulars, the better we can walk ya in.

    Tank
     

  3. sean1

    sean1 Well-Known Member

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    I am very limited to seating depth. The magazine doesn't allow for the bullets to be seated out very far at all. I have tried h1000, h4831 and rl22. Bullets have been nosler bt's in 165 & 180 gr. Along with 180gr Sierra btsp and 200 gr bthp. All cases are neck sized, necks turned and primer pockets cleaned along with deburing flash holes. Cases are Winchester. Dies are rcbs along with the single stage press. Primers are Winchester lg rifle magnum.
     
  4. Snubbie

    Snubbie Well-Known Member

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    I have a Weatherby I've had similar results with. I can tell you this, the biggest variable I've found is with bullets. Some bullets just won't shoot worth a darn out of my gun. I've tried Nosler BT's, Nosler Partitions, Sierra Gamekings, Hornady A-Max and Interlocks, and Speer BTSP.

    Most average 1.25-1.50". The Partitions were the worse, grouping as badly as 3". I've finally worked a load with the Speers that will stay just under 1". The Interlocks also shoot okay, another BTSP.
    I still have work to do but I'm getting closer.

    My point is, the bullet itself has shown to be the biggest variable in my rifle. Maybe try some different bullets.
     
  5. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    For the 165's and 180's you may want to try some RL19 or H4350. The 200's your right where you should be with powder. How far from the lands are you currently when getting your rounds to fit in the mag? Have you tried or have shot any factory ammo that shot well in this particular rifle?

    Tank
     
  6. sean1

    sean1 Well-Known Member

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    i will check on the distance off the lands. i have not shot any factory ammo in this gun, to tell you the truth i cant remember when i have shot any factory ammo
     
  7. sean1

    sean1 Well-Known Member

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    the distance off the lands is about .18". i should add that my goal with this gun is to be able to take deer at 500+ yards.
     
  8. shortgrass

    shortgrass Well-Known Member

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    A lot of factory barrels are just dogs! Can't and shouldn't expect them to shoot 'bug hole' groups. They're designed and built for the average guy/hunting situation, not for 300+yds. Winchester went thru a rough patch where quality wasn't job one. Made some good looking rifles that didn't shoot. NOT your grandpas' pre-'64 model 70. The outside of that barrel might be nice and shiny, but, the inside probably looks like it was made with a hammer and chisel. And, talk about the fit to the receiver!!!! NOW you can tell me about all those factory rifles that DO shoot tight little groups at 750+,,,,,, but I won't be listening, 'cause I know better.
     
  9. sean1

    sean1 Well-Known Member

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    Umm. Ok. I am well aware of the quality of the pre 64 70's. I don't recall telling anyone about factory rifles shooting tiny groups at 750 yards. Nor do I expect mine to. Just wanting to exhaust every option I can before rebarelling the rifle. But if I have to then I will. No sense in putting a new motor in a car if it just needs new plugs.
     
  10. azsugarbear

    azsugarbear Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like a bad barrel to me. I bought a winnie back in 2005-2006, right before they went under. They turned out some sorry firearms abck then that were not worthy of the Winchester name. FN bought them out and has restored some excellent Quality Control Management to the operation (as now reflected in their price). It seems a lot of mfg's. go through this at one time or another.

    Do you notice any "tight" places in the barrel when you run a patch through? That was the problem I encountered. I did the whole rebedding, recrowning, different bullets, aftermarket trigger thing with only mild improvement. I even tried the lapping bullets from Tubb.

    I would suggest it is time to toss the barrel. You can spend a lot of time, money & aggrevation on a poor barrel trying to make it shoot. It isn't supposed to be that hard. Twist on a new barrel and start having fun.
     
  11. sean1

    sean1 Well-Known Member

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    That's about the time frame mine was manufactured. Did you have a new barrel installed? What is the approximate cost of having that done? I agree on getting expensive trying all the different combinations of bullet, powder and so on. Eventually I'm sire you could buy a new barrel for that price
     
  12. azsugarbear

    azsugarbear Well-Known Member

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    Mr rifle was a NIB purchase, so after fidddling with it for 8 mos., I paid to have it shipped back to them and told them to fix it. That is when I first learned that Winchester had gone under and been purchased by FN. The people at FN (old Win employees) told me that while FN was not obligated to warranty old Winchester products - they would stand behind their work on this rifle. They got back to me and confirmed the barrel was bad.

    Unfortunately, under the new FN management, they were no longer producing that model or caliber, so no new barrels were available. They gave me the choice of shipping it back and living with it, or giving me credit (full retail price) towards a new firearm (Browning or Winchester mfg.) of my choice - also at full retail price.

    I chose to put another $275 cash on top of the trade and went with a NIB Browning A-Bolt in 300 WM. This was back when Obama had just been elected and there was a run on guns and ammo. I took what they had. I don't think they will offer you the same this far down the road, but the cost of a phone call would be well worth it. especially since you have eliminated everything else. The word af a local gunsmith would carry some additional weight with them. I found the guys in the Winchester repair dept. to be top notch and a delight to work with. Good Luck.
     
  13. roninflag

    roninflag Well-Known Member

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    LOADED i-4350 AND 165 BALISTIC TIPS IN MINE AND SHOT A .33 AND A .37