what should I buy.

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by jjohnson, Aug 2, 2004.

  1. jjohnson

    jjohnson Member

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    I have been a police officer for several years and served in the military including a recent tour in Iraq. I am looking to buy a weapon and am leaning towards a 7MM rem mag. I have several friends (fellow police officers, some on the ERT) and they are stuck on a .308. I also have a friend who is a former USMC scout sniper (he is also a police officer now) who says that the 7mm has a flatter tajectory and will be more accurate at long range over the .308. Now the ERT guys say that the 7mm cant compare to the .308 and that my friend doesnt know what he is talking about. I know ERT only has to qulify at 100 yards and the farthest the have ever shot the .308 in trainning is 600 yards at hearsal davis (comand master chief us navy seals) training facility in Illinois. so what is it the .308 or the 7mm rem mag. I would like to shoot anywhere from 500 to 1000 yards and be able to take it elk hunting someday. Is this posible with this round (I know that I succesfully engaged targets up to 600 meters with my M249 in the desert, and it was only a 5.56 calibur machine gun).Personaly I thought the .308 was to small for something like elk but that is why I am asking for advice. Also I met a guy who said he used to shoot his 7mm at 1000 yards and hit his targets accurately, and that it is a powerfull enough round to kill anything that walks? If it is to be the 7mm who makes one for a left handed shooter with the heavy barrel, I saw one at a sporting store(I think it was the short case ultra mag for a righty though)is this gun capuble of what I want or do I need to get some thing custom.
     
  2. preacherman

    preacherman Well-Known Member

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    ...308 is the undisputed favorite of medium to long range accuracy...pleasant to shoot...tried and proven beyond question... however, when it comes to elk and the likes at long range, a magnum is preferable... 7mm short action mags and ultra mags are very popular, but once again the .30 cal 300 short mag or ultra mag wins over the 7mm... at least in popularity... if you like the 7mm rem mag, it's a splendid elk cartridge...go for it... hope this helps
     

  3. meathead

    meathead Well-Known Member

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    Welcome home Brother! This Veteran would like to thank you for your service to this country, both as a Law Enforcment Officer and Military duties!
    I have some time in on the 'ole 308, and it is a excellant cartridge. I have even harvested a bull Elk with the 308, not to mention enjoying the wonderful accuracy of the round.
    Would I feel confident using it as a long range hunting round? Yes, on whitetail and mule deer class critters. If you decide on the 7mm "Magnum" class of rounds, you are making a good choice. They are much more powerful at any range than the 308, the accuracy potental is the same and just as easy to shoot. It all depends on what you feel confident with, and the type of game you plan to hunt. Do some research, lots of good information here and elseware and good luck!
     
  4. COBrad

    COBrad Well-Known Member

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    I've had 3-7mm mags, and they were all very accurate, one of them was my prairie dog gun for a couple of years it was so accurate. I've killed several elk with one, and IMO it is a very effective long range elk round. If I were limited to one center fire rifle for shooting everything, it would be a 7mm Rem mag.
     
  5. jjohnson

    jjohnson Member

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    thanks for the input guys, I am going to research the 7mm mag further like sugested. If anyone has anthing to add please do as I will check this post daily for more input.
     
  6. 308 nate

    308 nate Well-Known Member

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    HI Johnson,
    You would not need to go custom for what you want. Savage makes a heavy bareled-left hand.308 which is capable of sub 1moa.
    The .308 round is an awesome round and is every bit as accurate as the 7mmwm but I would not recommend taking Elk at over 500 yds. O.k I'm going to have some fun. here is what I would do,I would buy the Savage model 12flv for around $500 and would shoot it to my hearts content then I would re-barrel to 7mmsaum with a Broughton or Krieger barrel and put a Mcmillan A2 stock on it.
    There are all kinds of after market modifications,like easily changed out tactical bolt handle.(You don't have to worry about ripping off soldered on bolt handles) also several after market triggers and the action is easy to blueprint.The only thing I like better then shooting my rifles ...is building them [​IMG]
    last Sunday I shot my 7mmwsm and am still in disbelief.....at 700 yds my first 3-shot group measured 1.500. I was shooting through my crony and the ES was 16 fps.
    Then I shot a 4-shot group at the same range and it measured 2" needless to say I still have a grin on my face.
    Oh, BTW I built that on a Savage action [​IMG]
    have fun,
    308nate
     
  7. BountyHunter

    BountyHunter Writers Guild

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    Jeremiah

    The 308 is a very nice cartridge to learn with and pleasant to shoot. Lot of shooting matches that it can be used in but it gives up a lot in windage and flat trajectory compared to todays calibers.

    Plus it is really not a LR hunting round at all (800-1200 plus yards) especially on bigger game.
    You might have differences of opinion on what is LR so I have given some idea of what I call LR.

    The 7WSM is really coming on and with fast twist 1-9 it will shoot the 180s (about highest BC bullet around). In my opinion it is head and shoulders above the SAUM. I am really not sure they are going to last long term and they give up too much to the WSM line.

    Savage actions are great, easy to tune up and good aftermarket supply of drop in barrels, stocks, triggers etc.

    Buy a Savage 110 FP (long action 308) to practice with and another bolt head ($20) and then another barrel for 7 WSM later.

    BH
     
  8. dakor

    dakor Well-Known Member

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    I have said it before and I will say it again [​IMG] If you are going to shoot long Range with a 7mm get the 7mm STW it is the best 7mm out there. You gain 200 to 300 fps faster then the standard 7mm about the same recoil and same accuracy.
     
  9. doc76251

    doc76251 Active Member

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    For my $.02 I'd go with the 300WM or the 300WSM for one reason only. Bullet selection. There are more .30 cal bullets out there for diffrent applications than you can shake a stick at. It's a proven winner at the 1K target line and will handle anything in North America with the right bullet. Box ammo is plentiful and while not cheap, it can be found anywhere in a wide selection of bullets. 7mmWM = less availability and less bullet selection.

    Just my $.02

    Cheers [​IMG]
     
  10. 308 nate

    308 nate Well-Known Member

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    If you don't reload I would definately go with the .308 for there is a good supply of affordable match grade ammo.If you do reload I think you can't do much better than 7mm for anything in North America.First off weight to weight comparison the 7mm has a better BC and a higher SD compared to.30 cal.Secondly bullet selection is plentifull.
    Nosler makes nine 7mm bullets.
    Hornady makes sixteen 7mm bullets.
    Barnes makes sixteen 7mm bullets.
    Sierra makes fifteen 7mm bullets.
    speer makes twenty-one 7mm bullets.
    Berger makes two 7mm bullets.
    winchester makes one 7mm bulets.
    remingtom makes three 7mm bullets.
    not to mention JLK's and other custom bullets. And Sierra's new 175.that's 83 bullets not counting customs.what more could you want.

    don't mean to start a range war but I just get irritated when people say there isn't a good selection of bullets for the 7mm.
    And yes, I realize there is a bigger selection of bullets for the .30 cal.

    bountyhunter,I agree with you on the long action for the 7mmwsm but I guess I'm just a short action guy and that's why I suggested the 7mmsaum.

    I don't think they make a long action in .308 anymore and it may be hard to find a used left hand.

    forgot to mention, for ultra long range energy, heavier bullets than 7mm offers are required.(ultra long range meaning 1-2,000 yards.)
    FWIW

    [ 08-04-2004: Message edited by: 308 nate ]
     
  11. Lightvarmint

    Lightvarmint Guest

    I personally think that long-range implies loading your own fodder. Without the control over components which control the consistency, you could get into a situation where it would not be ethical to shoot the animal at long range due to the accuracy of the rifle.

    Finally, a rifle in the area of 1 moa is not a long range gun that I would use on game.

    James
     
  12. Iron Worker

    Iron Worker Well-Known Member

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    To the Veteran and current Police officer.Thanks for your service. Hey now lets talk performance.The 7mm mag is from the 60ties,7mm stw is from the ninties.The 7mmWSM is better than the 7MM Rem Mag its from the new century.It is of the new design Short and fat.You get that in a sako 75 and you'll be the envy of all.However why stop there I shoot a Remington 300ultr Magnum.It kicks butt.Its just getting started at 600yds.Also new design fat rather than skinny like a 300 Winchester or weatherby Magnum.I have a Remington sporter with a vias muzzel brake[removes 60% of recoil]and looks good.This rifle will with great ease shoot 1/2" MOA as long as you don't get the BBL too hot.Of course this applys to any 7mm Mag also.[that is heat of BBL]I was shootin mine today its bad to the bone!!!! I'm getting ready to hunt Black bear.Bullet weight selection is from 110 to 220.This rifle is aproximately 65 to 75% more powerful than a punney 308.But back to the 7mm's The 7MM WSM is the best for the buck! its the rave of all the long range hunters. The 7MM STW is more powerful but its yesterdays tech.The 7REM MM MAG is old,old stuff.In its day it was great. iTS LIKE COMPARING A PROPplane to a jet. Hey keep up the good work thanks for your national convictions. [​IMG]
     
  13. BHShaman

    BHShaman New Member

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    disclaimer: I have not shot both cal. side by side with the same gun model.

    I did score my moose some 15 years ago with a 7mm Mag at over 250yds (easy). The shot passed through the moose and caused considerable damage. My Dad also got his Moose the same year with the same rifle.
    Its an all around workhorse for hunting.

    When I get around to buying my own 700, it will be 7mm Mag due to nostalgia, AND that I have seen it work on N. America's Biggest Game first hand. Or maybe I can coerce my Dad to give his up. Sometimes it is not about being the latest and greatest. It is about being proven and most beloved.
    [​IMG]

    [ 08-10-2004: Message edited by: BHShaman ]
     
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I have a remington 7mm mag sendero. and I really like it. no I love the thing. But I will rechamber for the 7mm wsm when time to do so. that way I can pull the bullet out a little farther and put more fire behind that 162 gr. Amax.7mm mag is without a doubt one of the best rounds ever made.If you are stuck on a 7mm round go with the wsm its the going thang.but take a good look at the 30 cals ther is just more energy there thats my 1 cent worth.