What really makes it a magnum?

[rscott5028]

For rifles, there's at least one "magnum" designated round whose head diameter's .473" so it'll work in a standard .30-06 size bolt face and it's a belted case. Tried to find others Googling around the i-net but didn't. 'Tis Roy Weatherby's .240 Wby. Magnum;

http://www.stevespages.com/jpg/cd240weatherbymagnum.jpg

And in the rifle magnum ammo chart's "pipsqueak" column, there's the .22 Winchester Magnum.

There's other rimmed cartridges used in rifles that have "Magnum" in their name, but they originated in the handgun world.

If we're splitting hairs, the 224 Weatherby Magnum has a .430" bolt face.

The bottom line is that anyone can create a wildcat and call it whatever they want to.

I assume there's a procedure and fee for certifying/registering a new cartridge with SAAMI or CIP. And, I doubt they care much what you call your cartridge if it doesn't conflict with an existing one.

-- richard

 

[Max Heat]

The first "magnum" rifle cartridge was the 375. It was invented in 1912, across the pond, by H&H. The belted cartridge's rim measured .532", which for many years was the standard that practically all rifle cartridges that were called magnums, used. And although to a somewhat lesser extent (i.e. the short magnums), it's still pretty much the same "case" today. That's the history.

But the actual "definition" of a magnum? Technically speaking, there isn't one. The closest thing I can come up with is a "connotation". For the less educated, a connotation is basically a thought picture that the mind conjures up upon hearing a certain word or phrase. And for "magnum", that would be: Large, powerful, ***-kickin, when compared to what one considers typical, or "standard", especially, but not limited to, a particular caliber.

Can anyone do better than that?

 

[rscott5028]

The first "magnum" rifle cartridge was the 375. It was invented in 1912, across the pond, by H&H. The belted cartridge's rim measured .532", which for many years was the standard that practically all rifle cartridges that were called magnums, used. And although to a somewhat lesser extent (i.e. the short magnums), it's still pretty much the same "case" today. That's the history.

But the actual "definition" of a magnum? Technically speaking, there isn't one. The closest thing I can come up with is a "connotation". For the less educated, a connotation is basically a thought picture that the mind conjures up upon hearing a certain word or phrase. And for "magnum", that would be: Large, powerful, ***-kickin, when compared to what one considers typical, or "standard", especially, but not limited to, a particular caliber.

Can anyone do better than that?

Good explanation.

So if Magnum conotes, "Large, powerful, ***-kickin," what the heck's an Ultra Mag?

-- richard

 

[jtkratzer]

good explanation.

So if magnum conotes, "large, powerful, ***-kickin," what the heck's an ultra mag?

-- richard

a wmd?

 

[Bart B]

But the actual "definition" of a magnum? Technically speaking, there isn't one.

I believe the first use of "magnum" was to define a 1.5 litre bottle of wine. Late 1700's or early 1800's was the time frame.

 

[Joe King]

Good explanation.

So if Magnum conotes, "Large, powerful, ***-kickin," what the heck's an Ultra Mag?

-- richard

toof ratlin scope bitin

 

[Max Heat]

I believe the first use of "magnum" was to define a 1.5 litre bottle of wine. Late 1700's or early 1800's was the time frame.

Yea, but there IS some debate about that. Some contend that it = to "2" regular 1 quart (or 1 liter) bottles. But that's really getting off topic.

 

[Mikecr]

You couldn't base it on velocity, as a 20br would then lessen all 'magnums'.
Energy maybe..

Personally, I consider accuracy potential far more powerful than magnums typically provide.

 

[elkaholic]

I think magnum is a term that appeals to our "machismo" and it is used as a selling point. It just happened that the large cases, at least on this side of the pond, were belted so that is what we typically think of. A 12 gauge round can be 2 3/4" and be magnum or even target depending on what you load it with so in my opinion, magnum is whatever you want it to be. It is considered to be more powerful than std. (whatever that is)....Rich

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

I believe the first use of "magnum" was to define a 1.5 litre bottle of wine. Late 1700's or early 1800's was the time frame.

so a little bottle then....

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

Yea, but there IS some debate about that. Some contend that it = to "2" regular 1 quart (or 1 liter) bottles. But that's really getting off topic.

getting warmer...

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

I think the selling point posts have it. Much like the 80's Japanese station wagon I has was a "Deluxe" which loosely translated means piece of crap.....

Some "Magnum" cals like the 350 rem mag are really equals of a standard cal. with a belt. The 7rem is not much more than the 280's, but with it's little belt is gets a special name. Could have been a hula skirt-- doesn't matter.
It also gives reloaders the "right" to try to blow the heck out of themselves by the simple fact that it's a "magnum", so it HAS to go fast.
Hand me that mallet to open the bolt, would you please???
Look up the shoe test if you load hot for a "magnum".

 

[Max Heat]

Beyond the "belt"?

The belt had ruled the magnum world (of rifles) for almost 100 years. But as far as I'm concerned, it was under false pretenses. From what I understand, it's purpose was to reduce/eliminate headspace problems. But from my personal experience, it had totally failed in that regard. Let's just say that I would prefer not to post the pic that I have of a mushroomed primer.

As for 20br, one could consider it to be "magnum" unto itself, being that it is just a c-hair under 80 cal! But wait, you could say that the "real" magnum version of it simply hasn't been "invented" yet (as far as I know). It comes down to the simple matter of necking a 25mm case down to 20. And what about the ultra-magnum version? Anyone "macho" enough to fire something that lights up a 30mm case full of powder (necked down to 20mm), off of their shoulder???

Oh and PS, the only references that I could find for the "shoe test", involved actual "footwear". Ever hear of "magnum" brand boots?

 

[Bart B]

Re: Beyond the "belt"?

The belt had ruled the magnum world (of rifles) for almost 100 years. But as far as I'm concerned, it was under false pretenses. From what I understand, it's purpose was to reduce/eliminate headspace problems. But from my personal experience, it had totally failed in that regard. Let's just say that I would prefer not to post the pic that I have of a mushroomed primer.

According to H&H in the UK, they modified a rimmed double rifle cartridge's back end to the belt so the same cartridge shape and performance could be used in bolt action box magazine rifles as well as doubles. Rimmed cases have problems charging (being placed into) box magazines as well a feeding when the top round's rim is behind the round beneath it. That almost 1/4th inch long belt prevented this problem yet was excellent in controlling headspace of the H&H .275 Belted Rimless Magnum which was the H&H .275 Flanged Magnum used in double rifles.

Since 1912 when H&H started "belting" cases, belts have worked excellent in controlling headspace on cartridges with shallow angled shoulders. That belt may well be the best thing out there to prevent shoulder setback from firing pin impact before the round fires; common with most rimless bottleneck cartridges. It's my understanding that H&H tried making their Super 30 Flanged Magnum case a rimless one with the dimensions forward of the extractor groove identical to the flanged version. But its shallow shoulder angle let the shoulder set back to far from firing pin impact and had to use a belt to maintain it as well as let the round charge and feed reliably from box magazine bolt guns. The name of that round in England was the .300 Belted Rimless Magnum. When introduced in the 1920's for the USA, it was called the .300 H&H Magnum.