up comming review; 2 rifles in 6.5 creed

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Coyboy, Apr 18, 2011.

  1. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    I ordered a Icon Precision hunter and a Savage LRP, both in 6.5 creedmoore.
    The goal is to shoot in both guns with 120 Hornady A-max factory ammo and write a little review.

    I need a couple of factory guns for the VHJ shoot in July, shooting in the light or heavy factory classes. If one makes the cut it will stay stock and if one falters in the accuracy dept. I'll lap the tube and punch it out to 260 or 6.5x284 and use it in modified stock class.

    I am actually kind of pumped about messing with a couple factory guns that should be very accurate. Not that I'm holding my breath, but I'm kinda pulling for the TC.

    Oh and a plug, ordered them both from BJ. 2nd generation shooters supply/Gene Sears. (another site sponsor)
    Look for a review in about 4 weeks.
     
  2. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Great!!! I'm looking to get Savage LRP, so far couldn't find any reviews about this model, but I'm considering 260 REM, also I had TC PH in 308 since TC introduced it, its great riffle, just I wish they would put longer barrels on their PH line. Can't wait for your review! I'm hopping to see 26" barrel in LRP getting better velocities and less drop down range.
     

  3. hammertyme

    hammertyme Well-Known Member

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    I am actually kind of pumped about messing with a couple factory guns that should be very accurate. Not that I'm holding my breath, but I'm kinda pulling for the TC.

    Pulling for the underdog hey Jim?

    Kind of curious who makes TC's barrels these days.

    Neal
     
  4. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    Last week I ordered in a Sav lrp in 6.5 creed and a TC precision hunter in 6.5 creed.

    I have been shooting both and the results thus far have been interesting, I am shooting the factrory hornady 120 a-max load, the 140 a-max load should ship in this week.

    I have about 60 rounds thru the TC 22" barrel and velocity is running around 2830-2850 fps. With 20 rounds thru the savage it has been in the 2930 range.


    How they Shoot;

    TC;
    Factory trigger was at 3.25 lbs. and as light as she would go, I gutted the trigger housing and now have it at a very crisp and completly safe 2 lbs. No slam fires whatsoever.
    This gun disapointed me with my initial inspection, cosmetically looks great, bedding system great, Chamber cut in the lead area visably off center with a bore scope inspection, 5r barrel looks ok, definatly not lapped, has some scratches that run down the bore in a straight line not "with the twist" so a bit curious how they came to be, the last 1/2" of the muzzle has some scratches that were put in it after rifling the barrel, not really sure what TC is doing. 1 st range session of 20 rounds left considerable copper fouling in the bore.

    But this gun is a hammer, Second range session; the first 3-5 bullets out of a very clean bore shoot in about an inch, then the barrel gets good and copper fouled and it comes into it's own.

    I have shot many 3 and 5 shot groups under 1/2" at 100 yards today. The last 5 shot group of the day after I let it completly cool off had 4 into less than .250" with the second shot going slightly left which I called with a mirage shift in the scope, opening it to still under 1/2".

    So on the TC so far it likes; fouled barrel, CBS is in the group, definate sub 1/2 moa rifle with factory load. Is going to make a great factory light gun for the VHJ this summer.

    Savage;
    The bore scope showed a relativly nice barrel typical savage machining marks from the drill and button process, not showing the scratches as the TC had. This lead/throat was also visably unconcentric but not to the extent of the TC. The action on the LRP is structurally the same as the target actions with the adition of the cut out for the DBM system. This is nice and makes a much stiffer action than the factory sporter actions as the loading port is the small target style. Trigger was factory at 1lb, 4oz.

    Well this gun has only seen one range session so I have yet to find it's consistancies, but what I will tell you is the first 5 shots out of this new rifle went into 1/2" at 100 yards, 4 of those cutting the same hole. I set the rifle aside for 5 minutes and the next 3 bullets went into .900" group WTF I said, had pretty high hopes with the first group.

    So I don't let it cool and I shoot 5 more and all but one of those created a nice tight sub 1/2" group with one of the 5 opening it to 3/4". I give the girl a break and the next group is similar to the last. At this point with no brake-in I'm calling it, as I need to see how the fouling is laying down when I take it back to the shop. I'm sure this rifle will come around, so wait a bit and I will continue with it this week. IF it dosen't the chambers getting puched out for the modified class.
    __________________
     
  5. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Scratches in TC was major issue with my PH, TC even replaced it once because to many of them developed (pitting) in that last portion of the barrel. By the way, can you check how fired brass expands in the neck, just to see who's got tighter chamber. I remember I tried to use Forster neck reamer on brass from Icon PH and necks were to expanded so reamer wouldn't touch it, and Lee collet die was scratching it. I think it has to do with loose chamber.
     
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2011
  6. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    Jinx,

    how bad were you scratches?
    How did the gun shoot with that barrel?
    at what point did the form pits, 100 rounds 300 rounds, ect?
    How fast did TC get a new barrel on the gun?
     
  7. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Coyboy, here is link I have posted previously about pitting: What's in the barrel - LongRangeHunting Online Magazine

    It developed pitting after a year, I had about 500 - 600 rounds down tube.
    I was getting very good results at first, like 0.25", but with pitting it start to open up, to the point I was hardly getting 0.5", more like 0.8", TC didn't replace barrel, they simply replaced whole rifle, this part I didn't like. The one I had was factory tested to shoot 0.56" the replacement was factory tested at 0.95".
     
  8. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Coyboy, so how's Savage and the fouling, I'm very curious because I acquire LRP of my own, took to the range and there are lots of fouling... I'm using KG-12 to get rid of copper. On mine its not just one spot where copper accumulates, its all around. I think this barrel requires good dose of J&B... What you think?
     
  9. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    I'm only at 60-70 rounds with that gun, and I am getting fouling that I feel is typical for a factory barrel at this point. I would suspect when I hit around 200 it should fall of quite a bit.
    On the TC, the scratches were possibly caused by the removal of the button, according to a tech at TC, it was not a common problem but did occur on a few barrels. So they want it sent in for a new tube.
     
  10. backwoods83

    backwoods83 Well-Known Member

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    Jim for factory class you should have picked a model 12 F-class 6.5x284, I started mine off with corbon ammo with 139 lapuas and shot 3 back to back 5 shot groups at the same half inch bullseye and made it disappear! It will shoot sub cal sized groups with my favorite recipe. Has also shot quite a few single digit 1k groups using it in IBS light gun, by far the most accurate factory rifle I've owned.
     
  11. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Jim, are you serious about copper foaling cleaning out on its own after 200 rounds? Do you consider any sort break in procedure? Yesterday I was short on time so I cleaned every 5 shots, but I wasn't able to get rid of the copper in the field, it was strongly embedded in the lands and between.
     
  12. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    I just clean them every 20-30 rounds on a factory gun that fouls with copper, always getting all the copper out with bore-tech and a brush if needed.

    Some point after 200 rounds the barrel "breaks in" and typically it fouls less than it did when new. Drill/reamer marks from the rifleing process generally smooth out over use.

    Unless you have a bore problem like the TC than the barrel should come around, the scratches in the tc is what is promoting the fouling.
     
  13. backwoods83

    backwoods83 Well-Known Member

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    Jinx I think the answer your looking for is that you always need a certain amount of copper fouling to fill in the nicks, pits, scratches, and any imperfections in the rifling. After its wore in to where it has a smooth ride when you remove the copper fouling always piss away 5 or so rounds to fill those little spots in. J&B is really only good for carbon fouling, but in my 6mms 6.5s and big 30s I use it every 40-50 rounds, only about every 100 in anything else.
     
  14. Jinx-)

    Jinx-) Well-Known Member

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    Backwoods, so how about Tubb bore polishing system, which should remove imperfections in riffle barrel?