trying to find 6mm caliber

Discussion in 'Gunsmithing' started by tjonh2001, Oct 23, 2007.

  1. tjonh2001

    tjonh2001 Well-Known Member

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    i am looking for a new custom. i will be shooting 600 and 1000 yard match and varmits with this gun. my gun builder and i are down to two different calibers the 243ai or the 6x47 lapua. the parts that i have...

    700 short action
    30 inch broughton 5c barrel 6mm caliber
    want to shoot 105 or 115 bergers
    leupold VXIII 6.5x20 m1 tmr
    mark 4 rings and bases
    jewell trigger
    bell and carlson vertical grip stock
    harris bipod


    does anyone also know about any bottom metal for this besides hs or badger?

    please give some input
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2007
  2. James Jones

    James Jones Well-Known Member

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    The 243 Ackley will give you a bit more velocity especialy with the heavier bullets , the down side is the bigger case capacity will decrease barrel life a little and the Ackley case takes fireforming to get the full effect of the case desgine.
    I have never worked with the new 6.5-47 lapua case but it is rapidly gaining popularity in the long range comps so thats gotta say somthing about the desgine.

    Both cases will allow you to use the great lapua brass and both cases have enough power to get you to 1000yds with the bullets you have chosen.
    if you looking to get the flattest bullet path with the most on target "pop" for shooting varmints then you could also look at the 6mm-284 but your barrel life is going to be alot shorter.
    if your looking for maximum barrel life then you could look at the 6mmBR , I know it doesen't look that impressive but it does have a proven track record in the 1000yd comps.

    In reality you only looking at a few hundred feet per second from the fastest to the slowest of the 6mm's , the faster rounds will allow you a little flexibility in range and wind misscalculation and alittle more on target energy for shooting live targets at long range but the trade off is less barrel life and alot of the time the hotter rounds are a little more finiky with their load choice
     

  3. James H

    James H Well-Known Member

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    Either round will do the job. You will get more spectacular varmint kills with the 243AK but in the short time it has been out the 6x47 Lapua has already proven itself at 1000 yd matches and with much better barrel life, so that would be my choice.
    James
     
  4. wnroscoe

    wnroscoe Active Member

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    I was just at this crossroad a few weeks ago. I decided on the 6XC because no fire forming as the .243AI will require and availabilty and quality of the new XC brass from Norma. I ordered a Reamer with .104" FB and can load the XC with 107's or 115's in the magazine. While the .243 can be magazine feed you will have a lot of bullet in the case while using the 115's. The 6/6.5x47 Lapua was at the top of my list and I probably would have gone with it but, several friends I shoot with have the XC's and have had very good luck with them.
     
  5. Patriot44

    Patriot44 Well-Known Member

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    T2001,

    If your going to be shooting the larger 6mm bullets, I strongly recommend the 243 AI, you will love it. Also, the Lapua 243 Brass is excellent!!!

    If your going to use it for long range varminting, I would strongly recommend the 87grn V-Max with a .400 BC or the 105grn A-Max with a .500 BC. The other bullets will work, however, they do not kill the varmints as well as the 87grn V-Max or the 105grn A-Max.

    If your going to shoot competitions with the rifle, I would highly recommend using the 105grn Lapua Scenar.

    If you go with the 243 AI, you should get the following velocities with a 28" barrel;

    1. 87grn V-Max around 3500fps
    2. 105grn A-Max-you could push it faster, however, it will blow up once it goes over 3200fps. So watch your speed with this bullet.

    3. 105grn Lapua Scenar, 105grn Berger, or 107grn Mk can be pushed around 3300fps.

    One of my varmint hunting buddies uses a 243 AI for his varminting out to 1000 yards. His two favorite varmint bullets are the 87grn V-Max and the 105grn A-Max. He uses he 87grn V-Max for shots ranging from 100 yards out to 800 yards. When he shoots past 800 yards, he uses the 105grn A-Max.

    He has made many kills, with the 87grn V-Max, at 1000 yards, so it can be used at that range too. For pure red mist, he recommends the 87grn V-Max. He also recommends H4350 and federal primers with the 87grn V-max and Reloader 25 or Retumbo for the 105grn bullets.

    I don't know too much about the 6x47. I have heard that it is performing well. However, it will NOT give you the velocity performance that the 243 AI offers.

    I have used and seen the 243 AI in action, once again I highly recommend this cartridge.

    The 6BR is a excellent excellent catridge. However, if your wanting more velocity with the larger bullets, the 6BR will not give you the velocity performance of the 243 AI or 6x47. If you only shoot the lighter varmnt bullets, 55grn to 70grn, the 6BR would be the best choice. The 6BR with a 28" barrel will push a 70grn bullet at 3550fps. It shoots the 105grn bullets at 3000fps.

    The 6x284 was mentioned above. It will shoot the barrels out quicker than the 6x47 or 243 AI. However, if you want a 6mm for pure speed and accuracy combined, the 6x284 will out perform all of the 6mm cartridges. It will shoot a 87grn V-Max out of a 28" barrel at around 3700fps and can also push the 105grn bullets at 3500fps.

    If this rifle is going to be a low volume varmint rifle and you have other rifles you will use during your varmint hunts, I would strongly recommend the 6x284. The 6x284 is absolutely devastating on varmints. On our last varmint trip, one of the guys had a 6x284. It was awesome when he hit varmints with this thing. He was using the 70grn Nosler Ballistic Tip and pushing it out of his 30", 1-12 twist barrel at 4100fps. It was deadly accurate out to 700 yards. When this guy hit a squirrel, it blew them into tiny parts and the red mist was super cool!

    Anyhow, good luck with your choice. If your dead set on the two cartridges, 243 AI and 6x47, I would strongly urge you to seriously consider the 243AI. You will love it!!!

    P44
     
  6. SDWhirlwind

    SDWhirlwind Active Member

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    For information purposes here are some velocities I have obtained from some of mine and twin brothers 6mm caliber cartridges;

    2-6XC's with Rock 1/8 26" and Win brass 3000fps with 107SMK but with pressure. Realistic about 2950 tops. This with nekkid bullets. Tried some moly and did get just over 3000fps with less pressure and using 39.5gr of H4350 Just got some Norma brass but haven't had time to chrono anything yet. Tubb guaranteed 3100 using his Norma brass so will see.

    243AI Lilja 1/9 at 24". Nosler 80BT's at 3610fps

    6BR- Krieger 14tw @ 26" 65Vmax at 3400 and about tops in this barrel.

    6x47 Lapua- Krieger 8 tw, 26", 107SMK @ 3080fps but haven't had chance to test it alot yet. May get 3150fps but think that about tops.

    6mm Rem- Shilen 10 tw @ 26", I cannot get over 3600 without pressure using any 70 grainers nor accuracy. Best has been about 3550 with a 75Sie and RL19

    6x47 Lapua- Broughton 5C 8 tw @ 26" but haven't put it on paper yet or chrono


    The 6 Dasher is extremely popular with the 600-1000yd boys. Holds alot of records but needs fire forming and expensive dies.

    If your goal is around 3000fps with the 105-107 class of bullets with alot of barrel life choices for me would be the XC or Lapua because of brass issues and magazine feeding. Dasher would be interesting if fireforming and die cost not an issue. Long range and highest velocity possible I would take the 243AI or 6AI mainly to have no concern over feeding issues from a mag. However Tubb and others are getting 2500-3000rds from the XC and I think top accuracy in the 243AI will be about 1500 with variances in how you use it.

    All this probably will make things just more confusing :)
     
  7. Rijndael

    Rijndael Member

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    A few months ago I made the same choice. I plan on running moly 115's. The one plus side of a shorter barrel life is you don't have to live with your choice very long. I'll be happy if I can make it to 3K while staying reasonably accurate.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2007
  8. shiredude

    shiredude Writers Guild

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    I built a 243AI last spring and so far so good. It is a bit of pain in the ass to do all the fireforming, but what i did was try to find a load w/ 80 gr BT's to do my fireforming. This let me find something that would shoot for prairie dogs and such. I then had about 100 rds of fireformed brass ready for 107 SMK's. Finally got a load right around 3200 fps with the 107's.

    One other thing is, w/ the 107's, i have them right in the lands, and it makes it a single shot because of feeding issues. I have shortened them, but accuracy goes down as well.
    Mine has a #4 Douglass contour barrel and my next one will be heavier as that thing gets smokin' hot after about 10 rds in 10 minutes!!
    Sorry for the rambling, but those are the only two issues you might have.
    I love mine!! So far I have about 350 rounds through it.
     
  9. James Jones

    James Jones Well-Known Member

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    Loading the 243Ai with the longer VLD bullets out to the lands isin't a problem if you have a Wyatt's box installed , which in my oppinion is a basic adition to any factory action getting built on
     
  10. shiredude

    shiredude Writers Guild

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    Mr. Jones,
    Can your give me some more info on this Wyatt's box? I've never heard of one but may be interested.
    Thanks,
     
  11. Rijndael

    Rijndael Member

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    Last edited: Oct 24, 2007
  12. James Jones

    James Jones Well-Known Member

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    Thats right the extended box is a pretty easy for a smith with a mill to install , I have seen them installed by guys at home with a dremil tool and work full well , but I reccomend the mill.
    the extended box , in my oppinion , should be done to all rifles that are going to be using even moderatly heavy bullets whan chambered for the 308 family of cases and should always be used when guys are using a short action to build anything on the 7x57 case (ie 6mm Rem) or the 284 as a parent case as these are a good bit long for a short action anyway.

    they also make boxes that will make converting a regular short action to a WSM AlOT easier , also boxes for long action are made and installed the same way
     
  13. shiredude

    shiredude Writers Guild

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    sorry for hijacking your thread


    thanks for the info guys, appreciate it.
     
  14. tjonh2001

    tjonh2001 Well-Known Member

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    dont worry about that we are here to learn.

    thanks for the info

    i have desided to go with the 6x47 lapua i hope that 308nate (straight shot gunsmithing)can build me another great rifle. he just finished my 7mm wsm its amazing.

    does anyone know where i can get some brass and dies at a good price....