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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Gunsmithing
?To nut or not to nut?
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<blockquote data-quote="Pdvdh" data-source="post: 427149" data-attributes="member: 4191"><p>TM,</p><p>I'm looking to understand the concept behind your contention that the barrel nut will set the threads on the tenon to the threads within the action in a manner that will yield better accuracy from a rifle. Simple as that. If you are able to explain it, I'm open to your discussion - no matter what color you place on the kettle.</p><p></p><p>A point of clarification: I never specified a magnitude of any percentage of thread contact in any of my previous posts. You may be confusing my posts with those of another Forum member or members. </p><p></p><p>I'm not following the "small error in my post that needs to be rectified". You could be right, but I don't know what error you speak of so I can't really work with that and respond. </p><p></p><p>The use of the nut makes the nut an additional contact face in the assembly of the barreled action, and a key part in maintaining the concentricity within the barreled action assembly. I can understand that with the use of a nut, the threads are positioned within the barreled action first, and then placed under tensile force with the use of the nut without any further turning of the barrel threads into the action threads. The thread contact surfaces can remain stationary while the nut is tightened down. But tightening the nut down to generate the tension force on the barreled action places the nut thread to barrel thread contact in the same situation the barrel threads and action threads are placed under if the barrel is threaded into the action and tightened against the shoulder without the use of the nut. The threads are being turned (the contact surfaces are rotating) at the same time the tightening torque is being developed. So if that's a bad thing for the barrel thread to action thread fitment while torquing (tightening) of a non-nutted barreled action, it should likewise be a bad thing for the nut thread to barrel thread fitment when the Savage-style nut is torqued down.</p><p></p><p>Your contention that the use of the nut is a more controlled method of placing the barreled action thread assembly under tension seems to have merit. But your contention that the method will improve the accuracy of a rifle is up in the air. It seems to have neglected the inclusion of an additional set of threads (nut to extended barrel tenon threads) that have to be precisely cut and the additional mating surface of the face of the nut to the face of the action. I'm not a machinist, but I can envision that squaring up the face of a threaded nut in a lathe so that the action mating face is exactly perpendicular to the thru-bore of the threads in the nut is a headache - compared to squaring up the shoulder on a 20" plus long barrel that can be easily chucked up in the lathe. But I'm sure a good machinist would find a way.</p><p></p><p>I do appreciate your effort to explain yourself. Perhaps its just me. The jump from employing the barrel nut to improved accuracy is getting lost in the fog.</p><p></p><p>I can fully appreciate the ease with which barrels can be swapped out using the Savage-style nut. </p><p></p><p>I am confident of this. If the day comes where the competitive shooters setting the 1000 yd world records all consistently using Savage-style barrel nuts, then it will have been handily demonstrated that the non-nutted action competitors are at a disadvantage. I'm talking the guys shooting off the bench, eeking out the best accuracy their rifles have to offer. Not the fellows shooting prone off the ground. If the action nut adds anything substantial to accuracy, I believe we will eventually see it become THE standard method of competition rifle assembly. No? Then we could have some reason to believe that action nut accuracy theory, <u>and</u> reality, are one in the same.</p><p></p><p>Good shooting, with or without the nut.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Pdvdh, post: 427149, member: 4191"] TM, I'm looking to understand the concept behind your contention that the barrel nut will set the threads on the tenon to the threads within the action in a manner that will yield better accuracy from a rifle. Simple as that. If you are able to explain it, I'm open to your discussion - no matter what color you place on the kettle. A point of clarification: I never specified a magnitude of any percentage of thread contact in any of my previous posts. You may be confusing my posts with those of another Forum member or members. I'm not following the "small error in my post that needs to be rectified". You could be right, but I don't know what error you speak of so I can't really work with that and respond. The use of the nut makes the nut an additional contact face in the assembly of the barreled action, and a key part in maintaining the concentricity within the barreled action assembly. I can understand that with the use of a nut, the threads are positioned within the barreled action first, and then placed under tensile force with the use of the nut without any further turning of the barrel threads into the action threads. The thread contact surfaces can remain stationary while the nut is tightened down. But tightening the nut down to generate the tension force on the barreled action places the nut thread to barrel thread contact in the same situation the barrel threads and action threads are placed under if the barrel is threaded into the action and tightened against the shoulder without the use of the nut. The threads are being turned (the contact surfaces are rotating) at the same time the tightening torque is being developed. So if that's a bad thing for the barrel thread to action thread fitment while torquing (tightening) of a non-nutted barreled action, it should likewise be a bad thing for the nut thread to barrel thread fitment when the Savage-style nut is torqued down. Your contention that the use of the nut is a more controlled method of placing the barreled action thread assembly under tension seems to have merit. But your contention that the method will improve the accuracy of a rifle is up in the air. It seems to have neglected the inclusion of an additional set of threads (nut to extended barrel tenon threads) that have to be precisely cut and the additional mating surface of the face of the nut to the face of the action. I'm not a machinist, but I can envision that squaring up the face of a threaded nut in a lathe so that the action mating face is exactly perpendicular to the thru-bore of the threads in the nut is a headache - compared to squaring up the shoulder on a 20" plus long barrel that can be easily chucked up in the lathe. But I'm sure a good machinist would find a way. I do appreciate your effort to explain yourself. Perhaps its just me. The jump from employing the barrel nut to improved accuracy is getting lost in the fog. I can fully appreciate the ease with which barrels can be swapped out using the Savage-style nut. I am confident of this. If the day comes where the competitive shooters setting the 1000 yd world records all consistently using Savage-style barrel nuts, then it will have been handily demonstrated that the non-nutted action competitors are at a disadvantage. I'm talking the guys shooting off the bench, eeking out the best accuracy their rifles have to offer. Not the fellows shooting prone off the ground. If the action nut adds anything substantial to accuracy, I believe we will eventually see it become THE standard method of competition rifle assembly. No? Then we could have some reason to believe that action nut accuracy theory, [U]and[/U] reality, are one in the same. Good shooting, with or without the nut. [/QUOTE]
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?To nut or not to nut?
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